Like you said there is very little clearance between the rod/piston/pin. Anything you put on it will be sqeezed or pulled off. When I assemble engines I use a mixture of 10W30 and STP oil treatment. Others use that assembly lube that looks like that runny cam lube.

Dave

 

A good quality assembly lube is best for piston pins. Like Dave said, most of the lube will be pushed out, due to the very tight clearance. Spread a light coat of assembly lube on the pins, as well as the pin bore in the rods and pistons. This will insure that all surfaces have lube. This is assuming that you are talking about full-floating pins, right?

 

I use Lucas oil stabilizer as my assembly lube. That stuff is like snot, and stays where you put it for a long time. I mix some BG MOA into it for added Zinc. It's my homebrew that has worked for me for quite some time...

That certainly doesn't help you now. I'd say your fine with what you have done.

 

Ditto on the Lucas......very sticky !

 

Yes full floaters. I have the motor upside down, waiting to install the pan. I can easily dump more oil or something on the pins. I have a bottle of Fed.Mog. bearing lube...its like sticky syrup, I can use that, or even more oil or whatever.

Honestly though, wouldn't all the oil would be running off these areas anyway once installed and running? As long as some lube is on these areas, we should be good...I hope!

 

New advances in lubricants have been made since I've assembled engines, but I always used a quart of 10W-30 with a can of STP added to it. Then, I would simply dip the (assembled) rod, piston, floating pin and the rings into that mixture. I never had a problem with that method, or I was just lucky.

 

If we're all in agreement that the pin clearance is very tight--WHY is thick oil seemingly preferable as an assembly lube?

I'd consider using ATF. Thin enough so that there's probably still some in there after assembly.

The pins are being splash-lubed the moment the engine starts and has oil pressure; I don't see pin prelube as a big deal. Anything that can get you by for a few unloaded revolutions during assembly; a little engine cranking (also pretty much unloaded) and a couple of seconds of actual running--in neutral; so not a huge amount of cylinder pressure there, either.


I wouldn't "dunk" the piston; there's TOO MUCH oil in the ring package that's going to do nothing useful; but it will burn when the engine starts.

Vasoline? That's not an extreme pressure or even high pressure lubricant suitable for internal engine use.

While I might prefer #105 engine assembly grease (or even engine oil); I could just about see Vaseline working for valve guides. Lots of surface area but not much side force = low surface loading.

I suppose the big question is "WWWD"

What Would Wolfplace Do?

 

KB sent some lube for my pins and it was called Torco. Red, very slick and sticky, also said not to use on cyl walls.

Jeff

 

Vince, That is the same method I used to install my pins, and I was just as concerned as you when it all squished out, but so far so good on my 460 I put in last winter. The only other thing I did with the engine upside down on the stand was put some oil next to my electric blower heater to warm it up good and squirted it around the pins. Thought if it was thinned out and just let it sit there it would run around the pins better. I have also always just used motor oil on the valves, but my machinist had me use vasoline on this build. I also put some 20-50 in the guides but smeared vasoline on the valves.

I think you are okay with what you have done based on my experiences. My next go around I will likely use some sort of assembly lube on the pins though.

 

Vasoline? That's not an extreme pressure or even high pressure lubricant suitable for internal engine use.

 

Vasoline? That's not an extreme pressure or even high pressure lubricant suitable for internal engine use.

Yea, but it works for a temporary lube on the guides along with the oil. Don't ask me. I just did what the man told me and he builds some of the baddest big cube engines (Big Dog, IHRA Top Sportsman, big Brackets) here in this area, so I had no reason to doubt what he said.

 

it will be okay as it is.
I usually use either Lubriplate 105 or red assembly lube when installing the piston pins.
don't pour any assembly lube on them it will wind up on the cyl walls.

 

What a timely post Vince. Not to hijack it, but I'm in the process of putting the rods and pistons together also with floating pins and like Vince said most lube squeezes out. (I'm using Redline assy. lube) but the question I have is, what should the clearances be for the pin in the rod? I checked the mains and rods so why not the pin/rod bore?

Mike

 

What a timely post Vince. Not to hijack it, but I'm in the process of putting the rods and pistons together also with floating pins and like Vince said most lube squeezes out. (I'm using Redline assy. lube) but the question I have is, what should the clearances be for the pin in the rod? I checked the mains and rods so why not the pin/rod bore?

Mike

Mike,
You will probably get a lot of different opinions on this. I like to see around .0007" to .001" on performance engines. You can probably run them a little tighter on stock stuff if it is not going to be run real hard. Factory specs for engines with floating pins tend to be in the .0003" to .0007" range.

It definitely is a real good idea to check it. Most of the lower priced aftermarket rods seem to be finished on the tight side and there is also a significant difference in pin sizes from one manufacturer to another. Also, many pistons, especially TRW/ Sealed Power for some reason, seem to be tight from the factory and need to be honed.

 

I actually did use alot of oil, most of it gor squished out. But as mentioned, how much can you possibly need? The motor, even after installed and broken in, will have the oil run out of the pin area anyway, yet this doesnt seem to cause an issue. As long as SOMETHING is there, were good. Same thing with the valves. In fact, there's probably more oil the stems now that there will ever be.

I feel better just talking about this stuff...I really have nothing to worry about!

 

I have never heard of using Vasoline as an assembly lube on engines, nor any other mechanical device. As Tom has pointed out the stuff is not a pressure lubricant, as most assembly lubes are.

Pin fit is extremely close, measured in tenths. Most well-equipped engine shops are able to measure the fit. If fit is too loose, it usually results in the need for oversize pins, then the rod and piston will need to he honed to size.

 

I have never heard of using Vasoline as an assembly lube on engines, nor any other mechanical device. As Tom has pointed out the stuff is not a pressure lubricant, as most assembly lubes are.

Pin fit is extremely close, measured in tenths. Most well-equipped engine shops are able to measure the fit. If fit is too loose, it usually results in the need for oversize pins, then the rod and piston will need to he honed to size.

I have known some people to use Vasoline on transmission lip seals

The transgel assy lube feels just like Vasoline,,

I myself dont use Vasoline on transmissions but i have seen many do so

 

Vince nothing wrong with talking about things.....:thumbsup:

Plus its good to hear how other folks approach the same issue....I'm sure there are many ways to achieve the goal, you are going to be just fine with your method......Sounds like the project is moving right along.......:beers:

Whens the big day? Good Luck hope it fires and runs like a clock......:yes:

 

Bill, shortblk is together, heads and cam installed, rockers adjusted. Just waiting on an oilpan. Unfortunatley, I have to dial in the bellhousing again, then install. Installing a motor/trans combo - when the trans is a manual - is a much bigger PIA than an automatic, as I have to play the z-bar vs header game, linkage, shifter boot/handle, etc. Then, I have to tackle the electric pump install/-8an. THEN, I have to finish the SSM bar install which I started but got side tracked.
Hopefully, she run in a couple of weeks. Soon as it fires up, I'll check for leaks, and take her for a drive right to the burn-out box

 

Sounds like perfect timing Vince, the weather should be perfect.....What a great way to start spring........:yes:

 

You're ok as you have it.

I use Childs & Albert assembly oil on the rings and pins, it's nice and light, gets in there a little. And it is very clean, seems like I read it is filtered to 2 microns. But I could be thinking of some industrial crap too but I don't think so