What am I missing in this thread? Are you blaming the T&D, the EZX or the Dart Block?

 

In no way am I blaming the parts I used. I am just seeking answers I will have the block checked just figured someone on this forum with a lot more experience then me thinks this was caused by detonation.

 

First question that comes to mind is why are you only at 4.310" bore with a Dart block?

 

Time to pull it and figure out what damage was done as that cylinder detonated, because it surely did. Hopefully that littler mark is just a scratch from a small piece of piston heading out the tail pipe.

 

Can't tell for sure from pictures Tim. I would guess worst case you might have to bore it more which would mean more POWWA! Those Mamofied heads would work better on a bigger bore anyway. I had read where you had trouble with a carb, maybe you were lean and broke part of piston or ring.

 

You will not be the last person to experience problems in a build. How the hell else will you learn? I always have some anxiety on a new build. Take a look at Nascar, ever so ofter their engine's die prematurely and what we spend is a drop in the bucket as compared.

 

I agree its a learning experience. But nascar needs their engines to survive 500 laps at 8500+ rpms. I didnt spare any money on this build, just bought my lemons stainless headers and a new carb and to find this. It's disheartening. Im not even 30 yet and already have a big chunk of cash into a engine that has been nothing short of a nightmare.

 

That really sucks. I hope it works out for you and it is salvageable.

 

"Not even 30 yet"! You are doing pretty well then. Engine's are not inexpensive.

 

I know this lol. And it never ends on costing big money. But i am on the fence on just ordering a new dart block and having my componets over and check this block out and use it for a different build and let Chris and Scott have free rein.

 

Mmmmm ... Let's find out what happened and what broke before making any plans

Building hot-rod motors is a trial and error process. You can loose some of the trial and error by listening the old guys that go fast and have done the busting before you ...

But every build needs a plan (and a budget). It's your motor, not someone else's. Let's work it out with you and for you - exactly what you want ...

If you post your goals, maybe we can reach a consensus of what might be the best approach ...

But before that, we still gotta know what broke, or tried to break ...

As far as that block, if it did crack(?), I'd just do a thick walled sleeve and run on. But, being as it's a Dart Block, I'd bore the snot out if it too - to the limits for a one sleeve rebuild with reasonable wall stability. Inches count, so make use of that if you can

 

Yeah but my goal was 800hp I was so close at 790hp but I had to many issues that kept popping up and I have discussed my build with Scott, Chris, Mike, Jon and countless others. Everything was built to be overkill. Dragonslayer 4.25 crank, Dart Big M with steel caps, Ultra Callies Rods, Diamond -31CC pistons, Chris Straub Solid roller spec with isky EZX lifters, and T&D shaft rockers with 3/8 to 7/16 push rods. I even spent more on a set of AFR Custom CNC heads from Tony. So I know building engines cost money with dyno time 2 carbs stainless steel lemons headers and having a ton of extra machine work I am not stranger at dropping 25k+. But buying a new block getting a replacement piston from Diamond would be the best choice and get my block checked out and maybe start a serious racing build with Scott and Chris I will probably pull the crank, rods, pistons out tomorrow and see if any of the piston rings did indeed snap. But by the looks of it the top ring is still in one piece. the piston looks fine as well but it could have fracture crack from detonation so i would replace any ways. I know my valve spring on #2 tip broke off but was in the valve cover area. But as I was telling Chris, Jon, I am thinking just going with a 565 and adding some stupid psi. I already plan on having O2s on my car as had lemons put them in the reducer. So egt bungs and new headers would be in order.


Goals were to run at drag week if I ever get my car done and run in the 9s with ease. and with the weight i was shooting for at 2800lb race weight with me in my nova. It could have gotten there if I didnt have to keep sinking money into something that is always going to be a money pit other then my car.

 

are you thinking that little spot of galling or black death on the cylinder wall is a crack? Pop that piston out and look at it.

any other cylinders have that?

 

No there is no other cylinder that looks like that. At the top of the scratch I can catch a finger nail wont stop your finger but can certainly can feel it. I dont know if its cracked as I dont have the tools to actually check to see if its a crack looks more like a scratch. I am going to pop the pistons out because I am pretty much at a stand still until i pull it out. I rocked the piston in #2 to make sure the ring looked intact where the scratch is. There was no metal in the pan I am afraid to even pop the main caps off as i am afraid of seeing score marks on my crank journals. But it has to be done.

 

Hey after 35+ dyno passes and a couple issues I was going to send out my engine to get intake work and figure out why this thing keeps eating #2 T&D shaft rocker. I was getting ready to get it sent out and figured what the heck ill pull the #2 to check it out after seeing the isky ezx roll thread and that it burnt a piston. So I pulled the plug and found this. 4.310 bore doesnt look like a crack but will have the block checked to see if it cracked.


No I am not blaming any of them. I have had issues with the adjusting nut coming loose on my #2 rocker. I was curious if that looked like detonation. The block was dynoed several times I tightened the rocker adjuster to the 20ft.lbs T&D said to and my isky ezx rollers are perfectly fine. I read the post from Rat540 and saw that it burnt GuysMonte pistons. In no way am I blaming the parts I used. I am just seeking answers I will have the block checked just figured someone on this forum with a lot more experience then me thinks this was caused by detonation.

None of the dyno slips showed that cylinder ever go lean. so I am curious why my luck is just crap lately.

But I am sorry for you assuming something I was not doing. I was just curious if the block was salvageable and if its worth it to sleeve to keep my 4.310 pistons or just go bigger.

Tim,
Best guess not having it in front of me
That is some aluminum from the piston that got dragged down by the top ring
99% positive that is not a crack & I would bet the cylinder will clean with a light hone
Even if it left a slight nick you will never know it is there so I wouldn't be afraid to replace one piston if this is what you want to do for now
The thing is you have a bunch of really nice pieces here & it is a great time to go to 4.560 or 4.600 if in the budget.

Remember,,, I am not looking at the engine so this is partly speculation based on what I am seeing which appears to be melted aluminum stuck to the top of the bore, left side in the picture

 

Thanks for chiming in Mike. It has a slight nick in it at the top and was thinking of getting a replacement piston and getting it honed but I am afraid with my luck that this could be a crack.

On all the pistons where the exhaust valve on the dome of the piston where it would miss on all 4 on the passenger side there is a small shiny spot on the piston I wiped off number 8 piston and it did not appear to have a mark in the actual piston. The people that did the short block wrote down they checked piston to valve clearance exhaust had .120@9 degrees BTDC, .111@10 degrees ATDC. So is it normal to see a shiny part of the piston when the rest is carbon build up. This engine first time around was pig rich.


At the moment new pistons and porting the heads I could afford but really I wanted to do more with less. But I think I will have to get the block checked before making a further decision.

Thanks for posting

 

Since you're out for a max power from limited cubic inches, step it on up to a 505. That's another fairly common size (.100 over) that a lot of people build. You'll still be close to your initial size, so you'd still see how well you did compared to your yardstick.

I've seen some Dart blocks run through the mill and a few blown up, never saw one with that particular kind of mark.

Good luck with whatever you choose, as serious and meticulous as you are with this, I'm confident it'll all work out well in the end.

 

I really don't think that's a crack as that it the thickest part of the cylinders right at the top.

 

Before you tear it down to further inspect , I would rotate the engine to just below the mark on the cylinder wall. Put a mark on the piston with a paint marker that lines up with the mark on the cylinder wall.

It may just be an optical illusion, but it sure looks like a lot of piston to wall clearance?

 

I cocked the piston to get a better veiw of the the ring but i will take a couple pictures further before and after i take it apart.

 

Piston to wall clearance at the bottom of the skirt is .004.

 

you can't tell anything about the piston to wall clearance from the top. keep in mind the head of the piston where the ring lands are is a smaller diameter than the skirts.

.004 sounds in the ballpark, different piston manufacturers measure the pistons at different places on the skirt, so be sure you're measuring at the right place.

 

Yeah i pulled the pan off yo measure the piston to wall clearance where diamond said.