[sapperox]

After banging our collective heads for a number of months now, my friend suggested that I ask my fellow chevelle.com'ers if they have any ideas regarding a starter seizing problem we are having. So far we have:

1. Reinstalled, Shimmed, reseated the starter at least 10 times.
2. Had the local starter guy (whom does great work) install it.
3. Lost many hours of sleep!

SETUP - SB400 /w no tranny connected. H/D Flex Plate installed.

SYMPTOM - After initial installation the starter will turn fine, engage the plate, and turn the motor over. Then after a random # of tries (usually 1-3) it starts making a grinding/clanging sound that hurts your soul, and will not work again until you loosen and reseat the starter. The starter is good and the plate appears to be correct, we are just at wits end here.

Suggestions?

 

[Natural Born Killer]

Your timing may be way off. On my buddys Chevelle the engine would kick back against the starter and actually start backwards. after a few starts it would break the starter nose. Make sure you have the correct balancer/timing tab combination.

 

[al carson]

Did you use shims to space the starter?

 

[Cecil]

Are you using "real" starter bolts?

 

[sapperox]

Thanks for the suggestions...here's what I know:

1. Good point on timing, except the fact that the engine isn't actually running yet. We are in the process of getting it configured now, and don't want to actually fire it until it's correctly set.

2. We tried a number of shim configurations, no dice.

3. The bolts are just high grade lag bolts for the hardware store. I think we shortened them for fit purposes. I used the same in my velle with no problems, but it's worth looking into...

 

[1Fast7D]

Originally posted by sapperox:

The bolts are just high grade lag bolts for the hardware store. I think we shortened them for fit purposes.

There is your problem right there. Real starter bolts have a knurled shank to keep the starter from moving around. Use only GM or ARP starter bolts. You might ned a starter brace too.

 

[sapperox]

Make logical sense, would explaing why it will work once or twice only to shift...like it depended on how tight they were...

We'll test it out and let you know what happens...

 

[novaderrik]

is that a fresh engine that has never been fired?
if so, WHY ARE YOU CRANKING IT OVER? i can't think of anything worse for a fresh engine.

 

[Moloko]

Just FYI, we have the starter bolts at A-zone behind the counter. Only like 2 bucks for both.

 

[sapperox]

is that a fresh engine that has never been fired?

Have no fear, this is a well-seasoned motor. We pulled it from his old truck to put in a "new" one. We are in the process of installing an auto tranny and need to have a running motor before sending to the tranny shop...

I've instructed him to stop by the AZ for the bolts tonight. Hopefully we can make it work!

 

[Chaz72ss454]

Make sure you install the starter Braces I use 2, one from block to center of motor case, second at end of back plate, theres a stud there, use it. The first is overkill, yea yea Right, It Works 60,000 miles on my work truck, Wore out two drivers seats to one starter, changen da seat was easier, no? Note. If'n yer chevy ain't spit'n fire on da First Click,it ain't in tune. Not always the case in highly modified engine,tho'

 

[sapperox]

Starter braces? Where would one find such items?

 

[novaderrik]

GM has the starter braces. they are actually pretty cheap, but you might need to find a parts guy who's been at the job a while to be able to find it.
pick up starter bolts while you are there- i'd take GM bolts over AutoZone bolts anyday.

 

[sapperox]

Got starter bolts, installed, and it did not help...In fact, now it's worse. The starter will not engage. Instead a loud "thunk" followed by a "gong" sound (as is someone popped the flexplate with a hammer). Shims were reinstalled identical to how the starter shop had them...

Now before we go track down braces, we need to get the starter to engage...period. Anyone have additional suggestions? At this point I will probably take it completely apart and start over...

Very frustrating, as we now have 60$ in the starter and over $100 towing back and forth...

 

[2k3Chevelle468]

Do a search for my name and check my post on starter problems. (Sorry I'm too lazy): )

Our problems may or may not be identical. But I tried many of the same suggestions with no avail. When I replaced the 3 (one original and two new replacements) with a high torque starter with a billet mounting plate everything mounted up and started fine. I don't think I even had to use any shims.

I've been watching your post for a few days and haven't posted in case the problems are different. But why don't you read and decide.

Good luck!

 

[John D]

One thing to consider, now that you have the "correct" bolts, you may need to re-check and re-shim the starter. Going by what was done before may not be correct any longer.

 

[Chris R]

Why dont you CAREFULLY, get underneath the car while its secured with jackstands and have someone crank the engine and watch to see if there is any movement in the starter itself.

Chris.

 

[Jim Mac]

when You say you shimmed the starter, you are putting an 1/8 inch drill bit between the flexplate and the shaft the the starter gear spins on right? You'd be suprised how many people just reinstalls the starter shims but not know why, Jim

 

[wanarace]

To shim the starter put +12 Volts to the small inside lug on the solenoid. This will push the pinion on to the flywheel or into it if they are not meshing right. Make sure the large battery cable is NOT connected to the starter.

Steve

 

[OrrieG]

Is the flex plate true (not warped front to back and centered correctly)? All the teeth ok? It almost sounds like an issue there. Maybe it has gotten messed up from all the "false starts". Has the toothed ring been replaced? Does the number of teeth match the starter?

I'd get a dial indicator and check the flex plate for out of round and front to back runout. Closely examine the teeth to make sure that isn't the problem. I once had the toothed ring come loose, luckily I was just idleing.

I assume your starter guy has checked all the bearings and bushing to make sure the shafts aren't move under torque. Good luck.