[aml396]

for rockers to be clattering when firing up a freshly rebuilt motor ?
1965 396 with new 540 lift insky hydo cam.With hydrolic Ive been told by many that you dont need feeler gauge to adjust however this guy that adjusted them did 3 thou on intake and exhaust.He tells me just a little lose will be better.We fired the car up tonight and the rockers were clattering after 5 plus minutes. We took a valve cover off and there was oil getting up there but it didnt seem like there was enough yet.Yes this is the motor I posted about a week ago where everyone said the 65 396 needed the groove in the back of the cam and in the bearing as well.We took the damn thing out of the car then I had the guy over who put the new motor together.He pointed out that the old cam that was in the same motor had no groove in the back.We looked at the old cam.The car allways ran great with that cam without the groove in it. We primed the motor out of the car with a drill AGAIN.It took 10 or more minutes to get the oil up but it got up there.He said put the motor back in the car and I will adjust the valves and you will be fine.Did that. Now we fire it up tonight and as I said it was still clattering after 5 or so minutes so we shut it off and called it a night.
Should it have taken that long with the drill to prime?
Should I just let it keep clattering and hope when enough oil gets up there it will stop?
Im not sure what RPM the drill is turning but maybe I have to wait atleast as long as it took the drill to prime it as when running......I dont know....VERY frustrated
any good advice on this would be greatly appreciated.....sunk alot of money in this and it just keeps costing ...Im not a mechanic or engine builder

 

[65cayne]

Unless that drill was turning real slow, it shouldnt take ten minutes to get oil to the rockers. When I put mine together, I primed at about 120-200rpm with a drill and I had oil flowing to all rockers in about 45 seconds. That was a dry motor...just my experience.

You'll get it figured out. Try not to get too frustrated.

If you have a gauge hooked up, what is the pressure during priming?

 

[aml396]

thanks....any ideas about why it would take that long ?

 

[65cayne]

Well, I cant remember what all was covered in your other thread except the deal with the cam bearing, but along that same line I might be inclined to think clogged oil passages or a problem with your pump. I dont know. I could be wrong, but 10 minutes to get oil to the rockers would bug me.

 

[aml396]

goes right to 100 lbs of preasure during the drill priming or the running.Low end sounds fine.Theres a brand new pump in there. I dont know

 

[hiperf69]

Have you looked at the Dist.I beleive In 1965-66 the Big block Dist. controls the oil direction with that lower groove. The bottom of the Dist.dosn't have the full groove in it and that I think controls the upper oiling. Just my thoughts, Joe.

 

[wark67]

You NEED to set the preload on the hydraulic lifters. When the intake starts to CLOSE, set the exhaust valve. When the exhaust starts to open, set the intake valve. Take up all of the clearance out of the pushrod, by spinning it with your fingers. You should be able to tell when the clearance is 0. When you achieve this, then tighten the rocker arm another 3/4-1 turn. Your hydraulic lifter is now set. That is why they are clattering.

 

[engineguy]

You NEED to set the preload on the hydraulic lifters. When the intake starts to CLOSE, set the exhaust valve. When the exhaust starts to open, set the intake valve. Take up all of the clearance out of the pushrod, by spinning it with your fingers. You should be able to tell when the clearance is 0. When you achieve this, then tighten the rocker arm another 3/4-1 turn. Your hydraulic lifter is now set. That is why they are clattering.

X2! Hydraulic lifters must be operating with the plunger below the retaining ring. This is what you are accomplishing when you tighten the rocker arm adjusting nut after zero lash is determined. Look at your instructions that came with the lifters, some manufacturers may specify 1/2, 3/4 or 1 full turn to preload the lifters.

 

[Dark_Horse]

X2! Hydraulic lifters must be operating with the plunger below the retaining ring. This is what you are accomplishing when you tighten the rocker arm adjusting nut after zero lash is determined. Look at your instructions that came with the lifters, some manufacturers may specify 1/2, 3/4 or 1 full turn to preload the lifters.

Not to hijack this thread but is the above true with ALL hydraulic lifters? My engines has not been rebuilt (350 w/4 bolt mains) and during a repaint I had the valve covers off and a couple of rockers are easily movable or even a bit loose. Should I tighten these up? Does it matter if the oil has been primed up yet?
Thanks and sorry for hijaking if I did :yes:

 

[Rich-L79]

X2! Hydraulic lifters must be operating with the plunger below the retaining ring. This is what you are accomplishing when you tighten the rocker arm adjusting nut after zero lash is determined. Look at your instructions that came with the lifters, some manufacturers may specify 1/2, 3/4 or 1 full turn to preload the lifters.

X3. Hydraulic lifters don't need and shouldn't have a lash setting, they actually need a small amount of preload as outlined above.

I don't want to sound harsh, but it might be time to get the car to a qualified mechanic before something expensive gets damaged.

 

[bracketchev1221]

Not to hijack this thread but is the above true with ALL hydraulic lifters? My engines has not been rebuilt (350 w/4 bolt mains) and during a repaint I had the valve covers off and a couple of rockers are easily movable or even a bit loose. Should I tighten these up? Does it matter if the oil has been primed up yet?
Thanks and sorry for hijaking if I did :yes:

I wouldn't. It could just be that the oil has drained out of those lifters and they appear loose. With full oil pressure they may tighten right back up.

 

[66 BRONZE]

for rockers to be clattering when firing up a freshly rebuilt motor ?
1965 396 with new 540 lift insky hydo cam.With hydraulic Ive been told by many that you dont need feeler gauge to adjust however this guy that adjusted them did 3 thou on intake and exhaust.He tells me just a little lose will be better.We fired the car up tonight and the rockers were clattering after 5 plus minutes. We took a valve cover off and there was oil getting up there but it didnt seem like there was enough yet.Yes this is the motor I posted about a week ago where everyone said the 65 396 needed the groove in the back of the cam and in the bearing as well.We took the damn thing out of the car then I had the guy over who put the new motor together.He pointed out that the old cam that was in the same motor had no groove in the back.We looked at the old cam.The car allways ran great with that cam without the groove in it. We primed the motor out of the car with a drill AGAIN.It took 10 or more minutes to get the oil up but it got up there.He said put the motor back in the car and I will adjust the valves and you will be fine.Did that. Now we fire it up tonight and as I said it was still clattering after 5 or so minutes so we shut it off and called it a night.
Should it have taken that long with the drill to prime?
Should I just let it keep clattering and hope when enough oil gets up there it will stop?
Im not sure what RPM the drill is turning but maybe I have to wait atleast as long as it took the drill to prime it as when running......I dont know....VERY frustrated
any good advice on this would be greatly appreciated.....sunk alot of money in this and it just keeps costing ...Im not a mechanic or engine builder

You need to find a mechanic that knows how to set hydraulic lifter preload. No offense but the guy working on your car sounds like a hack.:sad: RED FLAG !!!!!!

 

[Tom Mobley]

so you put the same non-grooved cam back in and still have a lack of oil to the top? Surprise! Read my last post in your other thread.

Don't let that idi.... guy work on your stuff anymore. He's lost in space, has no idea whatever.

Take the cam out, have it grooved before you trash the rest of the top half of your engine.

 

[aml396]

no.... we never took the cam out. The cam that was originally in the car had no groove and there was no problem.Only the bearing was grooved.With this rebuild we put a new insky cam in with no groove.Maybe its not a 65 block or maybe someone somemodified the 65 block so that it does not need the groove in the cam.What I do know for sure is that the cam that was in the motor when I bought it was not grooved and there was never a problem.Given those circumstances what would you do?

 

[BillK]

aml, what is your name anyway ?

Ask your guy what part number cam bearings he used. To be perfectly honest with you, even though I always cut the groove in the the cam on those engines, I have NEVER seen a stock cam with a groove in it, I dont think they existed. The groove in the correct cam bearing should supply enough oil to keep the lifters quiet. Just not enough for a lot of performance use. The fact that you had a cam without a groove before proves this.

Did anything else change in this build ? If he used the incorrect cam bearings, you really should not be getting any oil at all up top. If he used the correct ones and does not have them aligned properly they might be blocking off half of the oil holes ?

Oh .... and you do need to have some preload on the lifters. I am not even sure if having them too loose might keep them from metering oil up top ? I would take the valve covers off and tighten each one of them 1/2 turn. If he set them with .003 lash, that should put you in the ballpark of being correct. At least you will know if that is the issue.

 

[novaderrik]

is it not getting oil to the rockers, or are they just noisy?
if they are noisy but wet with oil, then properly adjust the valves.

 

[aml396]

My name is AL...Im a carpenter framer/ home builder

Im not sure what the number is but I can find out.I do know the bearing is grooved though.

On the bearings being misalligned...I doubt that happened from the start but another guy told me that they somtimes twist or shift hence become misalligned.
ever seen that ?
what is your oppinion on this deal where its taking about 10 minutes to get oil up with the drill ?

 

[Tom Mobley]

>>> "what is your oppinion on this deal where its taking about 10 minutes to get oil up with the drill ?"

3 guesses, first two don't count. the groove in the bearing is too shallow to do anything much.

 

[Rich-L79]

Somthing just occurred to me: could having hydraulic lifters set up without preload cause the low oil pressure?

 

[Pete 67]

To be perfectly honest with you, even though I always cut the groove in the the cam on those engines, I have NEVER seen a stock cam with a groove in it, I dont think they existed.

I have Bill. When I tore apart an all original, bone stock 396 out of a 66 Impala, the stock cam had the groove.