I have talked to Mark several times in the last few years. Earlier this year I called Mark again and we discussed which 467. We settled on the solid flat tappet version. October is the expected delivery. I think my sons and grandson are more excited than I am. It is going into a 69' Chevelle 300 Deluxe hardtop.
Mark Jones 467
mrpaticular
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"It should really be in the mid 1.40’s to low 1.50 with the power that it is "supposed to make"
"
Just to be clear when that engine was tested, Harold Bettes from Super Flow was consulted to ck calibration on the dyno and to be present during the dyno test to verify the results of the test, then write a report on the dyno test results, which he did, I'am sure Rick has Harold Bettes's report.
My question, (and I'd like a answer) to you and whoever else is involved with this disaster is this: WHY CAN'T YOU FIGURE OUT WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON HERE, OR WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO THIS ONE TIME FINE ENGINE? 1.50 60 foot, my 4000 pound 350 NA shop truck runs that, 1.40s 60 foot what a joke, that's for low 11 sec cars.
Rick, do the right thing and post Harolds report I paid him to write, I don't have it on my new computer.
For anyone who's interested, here the full build of Ricks 670 HP 467. On post 54 is the graph of Harold Bettes's dyno test findings comparing my peanut port 467 that ran 10.34 @ 3720 pounds to Ricks 467 that made 670 HP, you can see the dramatic difference between the two engines.
4085870-467-650-hp-pump-gas-build-3.html
4085870-467-650-hp-pump-gas-build-3.html
467 650 HP Pump Gas Build ? - CorvetteForum - Chevrolet Corvette Forum Discussion
C3 Tech/Performance - 467 650 HP Pump Gas Build ? - My plan is to build a production parts based 454 over the next few weeks. My build will consist of a .060 2 bolt 454 block, worked over GM 4.00 crank. Compression will be set at 10.3, heads will be a 781 GM oval port heads, Performer RPM air...
www.corvetteforum.com
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963 Posts
Mark,
That’s the 64000$ question, I want to see Ricks car run the numbers as much as you do I’m sure . The car has had 3 different converters as we suspected that might be what was holding it back. The transmission has been rebuilt 2 times, it’s had 3 different carburetors on it and has had a ton of suspension work done to it to try and get it to perform. I know Rick has tried both bias and radial tires. The car has been on a chassis dyno and is down on power. The engine runs good there is no misfiring ,it has good steady vacuum and the timing is solid . I have personally made 4 passes with it and it runs clean all the way down the track . The very best mph the car has run is 122 and that was only once. I’m not crazy about the mechanical fuel pump but the car never layed over when I drove it. I think it should run 126-127 mph in the 1/4 . We are working on the chassis to improve ET but the mph should be there and it’s not. I have offered to put the motor in my car and see what happens but that is up to Rick. I had a 427 in my car that was never on a dyno but at 3775lbs would run 125-126 all day on any day and that motor was around 590-600hp based on the Moroso calculator. I know this isn’t a stock eliminator car but neither is mine. I’m sure Rick would be open to any of your professional imput . If I offended you I apologize that was not my intention, I just want to see Ricks car run the way I know it should.
Brian
Even with a dismal 122 MPH that should be 10.70s, why won't it do it? 15 minutes in a room with that car and I'd probably know where the problem or problems is. Even though chassis dyno numbers to me are mainly for one thing, tuning, Alans 3700 pound Vette with 460 RWHP runs 128.90 MPH, if I'am not mistaken 460 RWHP is what you guys got? That engine would have run 9s in my Chevelle, is it hurt? I STRONGLY recommend you do put that engine in your car, lets get to the bottom of this after 5 years, put his converter in along with it. And just so you know I offered Rick to bring the car to Texas and have us set it up and get the results. A lot of extra work went into that engine. Are you telling me that car has a mech pump? We just ran a 390 HP car that ran down the track fine, no missing, we put a new fuel system on and it picked up 3 MPH, with the exact same back half MPH on both fuel systems, no other changes from one week to the next. I have questions will you please answer them:
1. What brakes, does the car roll good?
2. What tires front and back?
3. What kind of rims front and back
4. Fuel system?
5. Weight
6. Will the engine REV
7. Ignition
8. Gas
The 122 MPH is telling for a fact it should run 10.7 which is horrible, but why won't it run that at least???? That car including drive line behind the engine has problems OR the engine is hurt, period. How is it possible after years to have a hooking problem with a Chevelle/why? I hate to say this but my experience tells me often, people like their car how they have them setup, and may not want to do what it takes to utilize an engine like this, some people get lucky with their cars and get decent results with out a full on car prep, but not everyone is lucky.
Maybe there's there's something going on with the car..........................Ok the report says dyno was accurate on that day tested or any day after.
Maybe just maybe something is going on with the engine now.
Who knows?
Don't beat up on the guy.
He's frustrated enough.
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5,366 Posts
My point exactly.
Please don't use your WELL sorted out race car chevelle as an example.
That's not fair.
Most guys don't put much into suspension required to run the numbers that a certain power plant "should" do.
That's not a dig at Rick either!
Maybe he runs with all the accessories like fan PS pump alt FULL exhaust alll the stuff that's NOT on the engine on the dyno.
Not with just dyno headers with collectors and a electric water pump.
There's probably .3 rt there.
Then the th400 ,12 bolt or whatever rear he's using.
All power eater's rt?
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963 Posts
Agreed Mark,
I will let Rick answer your questions as I don’t want to misrepresent something. If the motor ends up in my car it will definitely have the converter that he uses.
Brian
I realize its a lot of work for both of you, but your going to get the the bottom of the problem with out a doubt.
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5,366 Posts
How old are the rubber lines?
Maybe one is acting as a residual valve....before it doesn't let any back!
I had a motorhome do this to me.
Drove me nuts and roasted a few rotors too!
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11,876 Posts
Dont want to get off into the weeds with this thread, but yeah - need to check the hoses first. Thanks!
After a drive, my car in neutral wont even roll down the gentle decline to my garage. Just need to get the motivation to jack the car up lol.
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963 Posts
That is probably the only good thing about Michigan winters we have plenty of time to work on our junk 🙂
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6,021 Posts
1. What brakes, does the car roll good? Wilwood disc on front, Ford 150 drums on the back. I can push the car by the tires. New DTS 12 bolt, true trac, 410.
2. What tires front and back? Front M/T front runners, back Hoosier or M/T Street R 275/60/15
3. What kind of rims front and back - reproduction rallys front 4" back 8"
4. Fuel system? Robbmc 1/2' tank sending unit, filters, pump and regulator. Redhorse 1/2 line,
Earls and Fragola fittings. Everything new at the same time. AED 1000, Pro Systems 1000 and older 750 DP that ran 11.19 with a 439 ci.
5. Weight - 3500 with helmet and 3/4 tank, 3720 with driver
6. Will the engine REV - The engine runs great. Revs freely.
7. Ignition - MSD 6 AL with 2 step
8. Gas - 93 pump
No power brakes or steering. Mechanical water pump, flex fan. Battery in front, factory radiator.
Headman 2" primaries, 3" collectors, dumps before axle.
400 th gone through 2 times
Alum driveshaft
Fully adjustable rear suspension.
Any other questions or comments are welcome.
Rick
2. What tires front and back? Front M/T front runners, back Hoosier or M/T Street R 275/60/15
3. What kind of rims front and back - reproduction rallys front 4" back 8"
4. Fuel system? Robbmc 1/2' tank sending unit, filters, pump and regulator. Redhorse 1/2 line,
Earls and Fragola fittings. Everything new at the same time. AED 1000, Pro Systems 1000 and older 750 DP that ran 11.19 with a 439 ci.
5. Weight - 3500 with helmet and 3/4 tank, 3720 with driver
6. Will the engine REV - The engine runs great. Revs freely.
7. Ignition - MSD 6 AL with 2 step
8. Gas - 93 pump
No power brakes or steering. Mechanical water pump, flex fan. Battery in front, factory radiator.
Headman 2" primaries, 3" collectors, dumps before axle.
400 th gone through 2 times
Alum driveshaft
Fully adjustable rear suspension.
Any other questions or comments are welcome.
Rick
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6,021 Posts
Last t&t at Mid Mich Motoplex for the last run we set the 2 step to 4400. We moved it up a little each run checking tire spin. It left hard with no tire spin but at 10-20' out it fell but recovered immediately. I think the front float level was too high for that launch and some fuel went into the vent which would have dumped raw fuel into the carb creating the stumble.
Without that the 60 would have been in the 5's and et 10's.
Thanks for the reminder Geo.
Rick
Without that the 60 would have been in the 5's and et 10's.
Thanks for the reminder Geo.
Rick
Is the fuel pump mech?
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6,021 Posts
Chevy BB 1100HP Fuel Pump – PN 1110 mechanical pump
Fuel Pickup – 1/2" Sending Unit, PN 1069
Dead Head Fuel Pressure Regulator – PN 1050
PN 1025 Large 100 Micron Filter, Up to 400 GPH, 1/2 NPT Ports
PN 1029 Large 40 Micron Filter, Up to 400 GPH, 1/2 NPT Ports
Redhorse 230 Series Standard Black Nylon Braided Hose 1/2 all the way to the carb inlets
New fuel tank
Light weight pushrod
System holds 6.5 psi for hours after shut off. I changed out a good working gauge for a new one just to make sure of psi.
Rick
Fuel Pickup – 1/2" Sending Unit, PN 1069
Dead Head Fuel Pressure Regulator – PN 1050
PN 1025 Large 100 Micron Filter, Up to 400 GPH, 1/2 NPT Ports
PN 1029 Large 40 Micron Filter, Up to 400 GPH, 1/2 NPT Ports
Redhorse 230 Series Standard Black Nylon Braided Hose 1/2 all the way to the carb inlets
New fuel tank
Light weight pushrod
System holds 6.5 psi for hours after shut off. I changed out a good working gauge for a new one just to make sure of psi.
Rick
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