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Real world HEI spark plug gaps

36K views 25 replies 19 participants last post by  jimyconn7873  
#1 ·
There have been some here on the boards that simply refuse to accept FACTS on tat has evolved in HEI spark plug gaps, tech, other facets. There seems to be a small handful that simply don't get how it works, nor the changes GM made along the way to reduce problems created by wrong spark plug gaps.

FACT, The GM HEI was NOT developed as a performance ignition system, it was designed strictly to be able to properly fire off increasingly leaner fuel/iar mixtures in EMISSIONS engines. This required a few parameters to be adhered to.

The first criteria was to build an ignition system that would not degrade, nor change timing specifications over a minimum 50K miles, to insure emissions were not increased.

The second was to make a spark great enough to bridge a slightly larger spark plug gap than a point system made, so, as fuel molecules were reduced for leaner mixtures for emissons, there would be enough gap in the plug to "catch a fuelk molecule" to light off the burn in the combustion chamber.. This took creating "drivrs" in the HEI module to increase dwell charge time to the coil, store more energy, to make the larger gap function correctly over a point system.

Along the development of the HEI, some engineers decided that to fire off ever more leaner fuel molecules, the HEI needed increased spark plug gaps. So, Pontiac, Buick, Cadillac, and especially Oldsmobile simply opened up their pluggaps first to .065, then, to .080, with NO changes to any of the distributor components to accompany the increased gaps.

What this did was create, at the tme, largest warrantee failure replacement program GM had, from HEI modules and coils failing very quickly on newly sold vehicles. The first 3 had about a 40 percent failure rate, Olds had over 70 percent failures when the spark plug gaps were increased to fire off ever leaner fuel mixtures.

This led to some of us old guys that were at GM in the HEI development stages, to come back on,and get it figured out and fixed.

Failures were heat/load induced coil layer shorting to failure, and those issues causing HEI modules failing "for no apparent reason".

So, what did we do? Well, we simply reduced the spark plug gaps back down to the original .045 sizing, and, MAGIC, LIGHT OF LIGHTS, NIRVANA, THE WARRANTEE COIL/HEI MODULE FILURES/PROBLEMS AND FAILURES STOPPED, and failure rates went back to the levels pre-giant gap.

Opening up the spark plug gaps was done by a few brand name engineers, mostly at Olds, that dimply did not understand that the HEI will not tolerate giant spark plug gaps, it was an easy "fix" for a more sensitive fuel/air mixture developing situation, and their "fix" was totally WRONG..

Carburetor specifications were revised, emissions levels were maintained, and all was set good again.

Fact, We developed service bulletins, called FDM's (Factory Directed Modification) that REDUCED spark plug gaps on all those 4 division engines that were firwt set up to have the giant plug gaps, and, the dealers were instructed to pull all the plugs, regap if needed, ON NEW VEHICLE GET READY FOR SALE.

If yu still see a specification for an incorrect giant spark plug gap for an HEi for any of the HEI's, DROP THE GAP DOWN TO THE PROPER SPECIFICATION OF .045 MAXIMUM.

All this was done in the divisions that designed the HEI, here in America, NOT some place in the middle of the Gobi Desert, nor Antarctica, nor the moon, but, here in The United States, where it all started..

Those are the FACTS of it, if yOu have some sort of specification that insists on larger spark plug gaps in any HEI, it is WRONG, WRONG, WRONG.

This is an open forum, no problem there. If you disagree with these FACTS, I suggest you go investigate for yourself, as NONE of you worked with the team that fixed the problems, nor wrote the FDM's.....but, I DID.
 
#3 ·
Dave, what you are forgetting is that THIS forum is composed of enthusiasts who maintain their cars, & check things like spark plugs on a regular basis. Not wait until the engine misfires & then check the 100,000+ miles spark plugs.

Ford also specs 0.060" plug gaps for their electronic ign.
 
#8 ·
Dave, what you are forgetting is that THIS forum is composed of enthusiasts who maintain their cars, & check things like spark plugs on a regular basis.
And some of the members are new to ignition issues and some are influenced by marketing myths.
 
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#4 ·
I am not real good at science. A few years ago I installed a brand new H.E.I. from my local Chevy. Dealer. I bought a set of AC-44s for my 468 big block. I took the plugs out of the box and looked to see if any were smashed shut. Non were smashed shut so I screwed them into the 468.
With whatever gap the plugs had?? That whats in my engine. All has been fine with the plugs and Ign. for 6-8 years.
I will say with an " ORG. G.M.-- H.E.I. system, ( NOT some offshore TRASH that I have had.) I just like a sore body part, You just CAN NOT beat it. :crying:
I do believe a GM HEI is dam near BULLETPROOF !
Bob
 
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#6 ·
ANY GM dealer should have access to those FDM's, might be in archived stores, now, not on paper.

Sorry, the attempted ongoing intended defamation of me fails once again, I don't "forget" things.

YES, ALL of us work on our cars, and ALL of us should get the CORRECT FACTS in doing things like getting spark plug gaps RIGHT, NOT supposition, nor incorrect original pre-revision specs that were altered after they were found to be causing massive failures of components, nor specs from other countries when this is the U.S.A, nor any other incorrect information.

The one item required changed with EVERY 50K mile warrantee inspection were SPARK PLUGS. So, unless someone didn't have their factory warrantee service done, the plugs were addressed at the service.

And, the last time I looked, NO GM vehicle has EVER BEEN A FORD. That might be one very interesting reason I convert so many Dura-Spark and other Ford ignition systems to a better system, some version of the GM HEI. One FACT, years ago, Ford actually used GM steering boxes in their vehicles, because they just couldn't get theirs to work right.
 
#7 ·
Well, I for one, appreciate ALL of the AUTHORATATIVE facts and background info posted on this forum and elsewhere. I have yet to find any authoritative source that disputes Dave Ray's facts. :thumbsup:

I may be biased though, since I use GMPP HEI on all four of my GM V-8's including my recreational drag car - the 55 gasser. Autolite spark plugs because they are cheap - gapped at .038 to .042 depending on driving conditions but haven't found that any gaps from .035 to .045 make any noticeable difference.

I did install a D.U.I. module in the 55 gasser and may send my distributor to D.U.I. for a custom curve - but why? Just to see if it really makes a difference I guess.
 
#10 ·
Dave, Thanks for the info on the plug gaps. I thought I would show these decals. They are GM licened reproduction of 1975 and 1976 Corvette. The 1975 shows the plug gap at .060 and then 1976 shows .045 That .060 did not last long.
 

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#16 ·
I don't know about longevity, but I have never had a HEI fail. Haven't had many, but all had over 100,000 miles. Our 1975 Impala 350 2bbl, had the sticker like that, .060. It would foul plugs when very cold, and choke was on, but we always kept the plugs at .060. We probably would have been a lot better off putting them at .045. One nice thing about HEI, over 120,000 on it when rust took it, and never had to set the timing, it was always spot on.
Dave, just curious, what prompted your post starting this thread?
 
#11 ·
I've searched about the same thing, HEI GM plug gap and .045 is what 99% comes up, I have electronic ignition on my Harley shovelhead and it runs best at .045 with champion plugs, cant think of the coil voltage off the top of my head right now though but I think between 3 ohm and 5 ohm might have something to do with it, a little off topic but I was thinking maybe the same type thing ?
 
#12 ·
Thank you for the support posted above.

However, it seems every word I post is torn apart, I am literally called liar, idiot, moron, and just plain wrong, and accused of wilful "forgetting" by a small handful of people that never have worked in the ignition system industry, nor for GM factory development, Duntov, or any other place, and they insist I am wrong, they alone are right.

I have far more things to do than come defend every letter of every post I make, and be forced to have full-on battles of wits with some very few completely unarmed persons, so, I am going to back off posting here, probably for the duration of whatever life time I have left, nobody needs any of this aggravation and hate.

To all that have both supported, and still support me in tech info and facts, a giant THANK YOU, you are the greatest. Conversely, to those that have only tried to tear me apart, well, it is said that if you don't have something nice to say about those sort of people......................sshhhhh, quiet.

Now, it is off to Europe, for my other job, engine developer lead tech, premier class World Championship MotoGP motorcycle racing.
 
#13 ·
However, it seems every word I post is torn apart, I am literally called liar, idiot, moron, and just plain wrong, and accused of wilful "forgetting" by a small handful of people that never have worked in the ignition system industry, nor for GM factory development, Duntov, or any other place, and they insist I am wrong, they alone are right.
Recommend you reach for the baby aspirin, man.
 
#14 ·
I have a 1968 Chevelle 396 with HEI and my power does not seem to be there when I need it. I told him that the power got a little better once I changed the spark plugs. He saw the old plugs and said that if I put the in new plugs in that were gapped the same and the same brand then I screwed up. He said these plugs look like they would be used for a points system, I have an HEI system so I need hotter plugs and bigger gap.
Can someone tell me what brand of plug and what gap I should be using?
 
#15 ·
i followed dave ray advise,i put ac delco r44xl,with gm hei and gapped plugs at 45, car runs so much better and stronger, i had ac delco r4 plugs and gapped at 35,engine a 396 is so much better now running and plus it works better with that gap and hei,that is my story.
 
#17 ·
I worked in a local garage in the mid 70s. We kept a box full of rotors for replacement on GMs new (at that time) high energy ignition systems.

Before those came out I was acutely aware of spark plug gaps at .035” for points type systems. I had a brand new 1975 Camaro and my mother had a new Caprice Convertible both that took .060” gapped plugs. The thinking at that time was that people were leaving their key on that was causing the rotor failures. Glad to have the knowledge base here.
 
#23 ·
My apologies if I left the wrong impression. There were so many failures in relatively new cars that people were always asking us what caused it. We were just dumb mechanics and honestly didn’t know. All we could do was speculate, rather incorrectly as it turns out. We weren’t engineers who were trying to correct the problem rather than repair the defect. That’s why I appreciate having Dave’s firsthand feedback about what was going on. That was the point of my post.
 
#19 ·
Despite Dave constantly saying he’s done with this forum and never coming back, he still stays. Too bad he’s not a man of his words.
 
#22 ·
Yeah, evidently it hacks some people off when Dave Ray comes on here and tries to help out when someone asks. Then there the others that are too stupid to figure how to pour p*ss out of a boot. Sure glad they know all the answers to everything else.
 
#25 ·
Interesting read.. I’d never heard about that. Sounds like it was probably not a fun year to be on that team!

It seems like the extra voltage stress of having to fire a larger gapped plug was enough to push the coil over the edge? I’d think the transistor could also be at risk, but possibly it had more headroom than the coil did.

Building something that will reliably take high voltages, plus the hot-cold cycles and vibration that you get on top of an engine, is not easy.
 
#26 ·
Ty Dave for your professional input,my 70 suburban 350 high performance cam has a hei,and it stopped dead in the tracks the other day! Inside the cap of the hei surrounding the inner button was completely burnt up ! So I'm replacing the cap rotor and coil and make sure my new plugs are gapped at .045 as you suggested.so obviously the larger gap on my plugs caused the coil to fry.ty very much sir and don't let these [karens] get to you God bless jimmy and daisy dog!!