Those things are a total waste. We got rid of our 1997 3/4 ton 4X4 tow rig and picked up a used 1999 durango 4X4 with trailer tow. It WAY out pulls the Suburban with our 12K lbs. off-shore boat. Of course if you need to carry more than 7 people at the same time well....

 

Try pulling a race car in one of those hybrids that they plan on building instead of the Excursion! LOL

My Excursion with the 6.0 PSD pulls awesome and gets dang decent mileage on the road (18+ - >20 according to the lie-o-meter when cruising at 65) When you need a big vehicle to travel, etc it is what it is and it costs a little more to run big. I've heard the V10 does get horrible mileage.

I'm a Chevy guy but wanted a diesel and am very happy so far with the EX.

 

I think where they are going with this is the trend for better equiped crew cab trucks. The big SUV's are rarely bought for any real hauling other than people carriers. The light duty trucks all have the good powertrains and come in at alot less money than a comparable SUV. When I got the Silverado, I had just come out of an Expedition. Didn't really need the 3rd seat and the cargo area just doesn't hold enough. I think a lot of people are coming to the same conclusion that there are other options.

 

But the soccer moms don't look cool in a p/u truck. Coworkers wife said she wll only drive an suv because won't look cool in vans and cars.

 

from the article: "Ford didn't really address it because it wanted to do the right thing," West said. "Ford's addressing it because gas prices are skyrocketing and people are freaking out."

Gee, ya think? I'm currently driving an Excursion at work, and I'll tell you I'm a little embarassed when it's just me in that HUGE, gotta grab a handle to climb up into it, metal monster. I honestly think that anyone who thinks they "need" a vehicle that huge, needs to deal with some inferiority issues. That being said, it's a free county, and a free market economy, and for anyone to "demand" that a company do the "right thing", when there's obviously a market for their product "as is", or that people buy a "sensible/responsible" vehicle, is living in another world. Special interest groups and government regulation will not drive the car makers to make more "efficient" vehicles...us NOT buying "non-efficient" vehicles will. I think this is an early sign of a trend. I just wonder what will be available for towing 5 years from now.

 

I am sure they could make a product that could get better milage, but then the gas companies wouldn't like that.

 

We're going to replace our burb next year, I'll hang onto it as a backup manly because it is 12 years old and with 130 plus miles they won't give me anything for it. Starting to talk to the wife about the replacement and she is insisting on either another burb or a full size quad cab truck with cap. She likes the safety of the rig, insists on 4 wheel drive and being up in the air were she can see. She does a lot of driving. Of course she and my family owe their lives to a suburban, having that much steel around you comes in handy when a tractor trailer decides to run over you. If they had been in one of those econo cans, I'd have lost the entire family.

The only way you'll ever get me in an economy car is if they make them into hearses and my mortician is a tree hugger.

 

The only way you'll ever get me in an economy car is if they make them into hearses and my mortician is a tree hugger.

I guess I'm just a natural risk taker but I'm having a blast driving my MINI Cooper....and I'm getting 35MPG.

I rode motorcycles for 40 years and survived, the MINI seems huge compared to my last bike.

 

I am sure they could make a product that could get better milage, but then the gas companies wouldn't like that.

Do you really think it's the gas companies that dictate what kind of mileage the vehicles Detroit puts out should get? Gas companies don't buy as many vehicles as the general public do. If Ford could come out with an Excursion that could get 25-30 mpg on the highway, and have enough power to tow a boat (or even just get out of it's own way), they'd sell them faster than they could make them.

There's only so much energy stored in a gallon of gas/diesel fuel. If you have a big, heavy SUV, it's going to take quite a bit of that energy to push it down the road, over hills, away from traffic lights, etc. If you want an engine big enough to get that done in any reasonable amount of time, it's even more energy that's going to be used. Internal combustion engines today are approaching the maximum efficiency that's physically possible to get the most energy out of that gallon of gas, and still be (relatively) affordible.

If any car company came out with a normal vehicle that can do normal stuff (in other words, not something as small as the Honda Insight) that got double the mileage of a similar vehicle for the same (or at least reasonably close) cost, there's NOTHING an oil company could do to stop it from coming out. The manufacturer would make a fortune on it, plain and simple.

The Excursion went out of production because it was too big. There wasn't enough of a real world demand for something that wouldn't fit in a garage. I'd still want one if I had too much money though

 

Do you really think it's the gas companies that dictate what kind of mileage the vehicles Detroit puts out should get?

But what about the 100mpg carb that the oil companies won't allow, huh, huh......

I'm just kidding of course. Gasoline in newer cars is being used at about 99% efficiency. The only way to get much in the way of a MPG increase is to decrease weight, wind resistance, etc. But it's a lot more fun to just blame the oil companies.

Around here most folks blame high prices on the oil companies, politicians, the Arabs, Halliburton, gas stations, etc...........always very low on their list, if at all, is their own wasteful use of fuel and desire to drive the biggest gas hog on the planet.

 

I wish that I could buy a new 1987 Chevy Sprint ER, (Suzuki Swift), 3-banger, 5-speed hatch with nothing on it!

It was quite a commuting corn-popper!!

50+ mpg running 70 to 75 mph ALL day long for years AND years!! (AND the EPA said it could get 72 mpg on their about 50 mph CAFE driving test!!!).....

I paid $6300 for the one I had and loved it!

I dropped the back seat and it swallowed my 454 core motor with the crank up front in the pass. seat foot well...

AND to top it off, when somebody would get to pushing me b/c they just didn't think I was going fast enough, I would wait until a curve came up, down-shift and squirt right around it running a lot faster then the DUDE behind me could b/c of his P/U's too high a CG!! He, He!! They generally backed off after that!!!

Sucker handled like a SK-8 Board!!

pdq67

Best Car Insurance | Auto Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote

 

Everyone got along just fine before there ever was an SUV, and I'm sure we can get along just fine without them.

 

i saw a thing on sunday a.m. about willie nelson, and a partner, had a place, (i think in the mid west) that sold alternative fuel. the drivers interviewed said the (corn based fuel) made thier rigs run better, and most, came out of thier way to get it. i don't think mileage really has anything to do with the way people drive, or what they drive. if your chevelles got 6 miles to the gallon, and thier was a corn based fuel that made them run better, and it was $1 a gallon, you'd all have nothin to bitch about. they say willie's tour bus runs on this fuel, and his benz runs on animal fat. i agree with who ever, a couple weeks ago, stated that alternative fuels, have come a long, and technology is getting better in the field. if somebody comes out with a fuel that burns 99% efficent, and it's comparable, or less in cost. most would jump at the chance. although i think we'd have 400 page threads like square or round ports, or synth or dino, but it would make things a lot more interesting. now i was just kidding, i know some of you are concerned about m.p.g.'s and it's taking a bite out of some budgets. and i'm really surprised, that an enterprising company, hasn't gone nation wide, with and alternative fuel. i mean, how hard is it to grow corn and beans, anyway?

 

how hard is it to grow corn and beans, anyway?

There are a number of problems with ethenol (corn fuel)

-It takes more energy to make it than it provides
-It's cheaper but your MPG goes down, so it's not entirely a benefit
-There's only X capaticy to grow corn, so if it starts going ot other uses, the price of other corn items will rise
-Ethanol plants emit quite a bit of stuff that can affect the ozone levels. Thats not a problem in Iowa but in populaed states, it can be a huge issue

 

I' still waiting for the "Canyonero". "It smells like a Steak and seats 35."

 

I' still waiting for the "Canyonero". "It smells like a Steak and seats 35."

Love that song

Song: Canyonero Lyrics

Can you name the truck with four wheel drive,
smells like a steak and seats thirty-five..

Canyonero! Canyonero!

Well, it goes real slow with the hammer down,
It's the country-fried truck endorsed by a clown!

Canyonero! (Yah!) Canyonero!
[Krusty:] Hey Hey

The Federal Highway comission has ruled the
Canyonero unsafe for highway or city driving.

Canyonero!

12 yards long, 2 lanes wide,
65 tons of American Pride!

Canyonero! Canyonero!

Top of the line in utility sports,
Unexplained fires are a matter for the courts!

Canyonero! Canyonero! (Yah!)

She blinds everybody with her super high beams,
She's a squirrel crushing, deer smacking, driving machine!

Canyonero!-oh woah, Canyonero! (Yah!)

Drive Canyonero!

Woah Canyonero!

Woah!


:thumbsup:
Jeff

 

Those things are a total waste. We got rid of our 1997 3/4 ton 4X4 tow rig and picked up a used 1999 durango 4X4 with trailer tow. It WAY out pulls the Suburban with our 12K lbs. off-shore boat. Of course if you need to carry more than 7 people at the same time well....

Dude.....pulling 12k with that little Durango!!! That's CRAZY! :clonk: I think those are rated at 7k. I'm glad I don't drive on the same roads you do. YIPES!

 

There are lots of neat tech to avoid the oil companies.

Theres a company that has a test plant that processes the organic crap from a chicken (turkey maybe, anyway...) farm and makes a 'synthetic' light crude oil out of it. It's the same basic thing as 'natural' crude, hydrocarbons, but can be made from any large ammount of organic material. One of these parked next to any plant that has to despose of organic waste could produce a LOT of gas and other oil products without pumping anything out of the ground.

Also, biodiesel is neat, and can be made cheaply from waste veggie oil from restaurant cookers. Add some lye and ethanol (I think) in the right ammounts and a bit of post-processing and you've got a 100% replacement for diesel. Burns cleaner too... Little more sensitive to cold, but thats a solveable problem. Biodiesel can also be made from lots of other organic material. One suggestion was algae beds out in the desert thats pretty unuseable now, setup shallow water tanks in the sun and grow algae for biomass diesel and oil production...

Also, we should be investing on nuke power more. There are technologies out there (Pebble bed reactors) that are clean, super safe (they CANT meltdown like a traditional nuke), and can be made in a modular design to keep costs down. But, OMG NO NUKES!!!!!!!!!... please people. I'd LOVE to have one in my neighborhood, they produce clean, economical, safe power in a SMALL building with no air, noise, or water pollution. Its tech like that that could produce the power needed to crack water for hydrogen in a clean way, and drive lots of other innovation.

People need to wake up and realize that the basic tech is there NOW, we just need to embrace it and BUILD the darn things.

Combine all the things I just listed, and watch dependance on foreign oil drop. We could make TONS of the stuff from converted 'waste' we make right now and just dump somewhere.

 

There is also technology to convert any carbon bearing material (coal, emissions, or even biomass) into clean diesel. Anyone ever heard of the fischer-tropsch (sp?) process? All it requires is an iron-based catalyst. Of course, there are exactly ZERO of these plants running in the US. One is being built as a demonstrator.

Sasol in south africa is a company that uses this process. They make money hand over fist. I believe they use their coal resources and a cobalt catalyst.

 

Andy69... how do you figure that? The SUV goes back almost to the start. The first Suburban was built in the early 30s. The jeep wagon, hell, all full size wagons of the 50s and 60s could be considered the SUV of their time. My mom always had a big full size station wagon, the most memorable were a ford with the rear facing third row barf seat and a monster of an olds with the vista roof windows.

Quite frankly I think we'd be better off with the elimination of any car that cannot haul 5 adults in comfort, take a moderate impact with a full size truck or van without crumpling up into a wad of aluminum foil and pull a 1000 pound U-haul. I make exception for true sports cars of course, but these friggen little pieces of crap that for some reason make the drivers think they're on a road course or something are a menus to those of us who aren't in the Indy 500 with you all. They zip in and out of traffic and you can't see the damn things. They get in to a 10 MPH fender bender and half of the damn car is lying in the road a week later. There is a front fascia off some little piece of junk lying along the road on my way to work that has been there for most of the summer. Two winters ago I was rear ended at a traffic light by a moron in a little compressor. She ran up under the back of my truck and hit my trailer hitch. It took out her hood, rad, broke the water pump, the grill and front fascia was gone, the fenders were back into the doors, she had to come out through he window and all the air bags went off, her face looked like she went three rounds with me before the cops got there. My truck got a little dent in the bumper and it broke off my trailer electrical connector bracket. It didn't even move my burb I didn't realize until I got out how hard she had hit me.

SUVs just make more sense for the vast majority of Americans that need to move people, pull trailers, haul loads, and want to protect their families. I wouldn't put my family in a econo can, I love them too much to risk their lives to save a couple of bucks on gas. I put all three of my kids into mid size cars or trucks when they started driving.

When our kids were young we pulled our travel trailer, had three kids and three or four dogs, as well as a couple of neighbor kids most of the time. These days we do run with only one or the two of us in it often, but we can take mom and dad, my brother and his wife, and their two kids and pull the boat when we want to. Do that in your econo can. I pull my two trailers around several times a week.

This week I'm taking 8 of my students to a meeting at another school. One comfortable 9 passenger truck that gets 15 to 18 MPG or 3 econo cans that get 25 MPG. lets compare. For a one hundred mile trip I get 100/15=6.66/9=.74 gal per person for the trip. For three econo cans it works out to 100/25=4x3=12/9=1.3. If I could stuff both econo cans, lets say 4 in one and five in the other, maybe someone could ride in the trunk. 100/25=4x2=8/9=.88

As for the comment, I assume suggesting that if my wife used her head a tractor trailer would not have crossed over into her lane and drove her into a concrete bridge support. Until we have the ability to control the brain in the other drivers on the road heads, and tractor trailers, vans and full size cars and trucks are no longer allowed on the same highway I'm on, I'll assume that the guy in the tractor trailer might decide to run over me and I'll keep my SUV.

 

SUVs just make more sense for the vast majority of Americans that need to move people, pull trailers, haul loads, and want to protect their families. .

Then why are a vast majority of SUVs and large pickups only moving 1 person, hauling no trailer, and carrying no load? And if the drivers of thses vehicles would stop at red light, put down their phones and drive the speed limit instead of acting like they're at the Baja 1000, they wouldn't have to worry so much about protecting someone

 

Then why are a vast majority of SUVs and large pickups only moving 1 person, hauling no trailer, and carrying no load? And if the drivers of thses vehicles would stop at red light, put down their phones and drive the speed limit instead of acting like they're at the Baja 1000, they wouldn't have to worry so much about protecting someone

You're right,

My recent issue of Automobile magazine said Ford is about to produce an even larger version of the Excursion, code name, Maxi-Excursion. I suppose this is for people who don' t feel safe in their humongeous SUV because there are others on the road just as big. Maybe we can have a "size" war until we all feel safer because our SUV's will get little Bobby to soccer practice in a vehicle as big as the one that delivers the Chinese junk to Wal-Mart.

 

Rick, I generally agree with most of your thoughts in your posts, but this one I can't.

Your math that you do makes little to no sense. Sure it makes plenty of sense in your one example. Now lets do the real math. How many miles are put on your 9 passenger SUV every year while their is only 1 or 2 people in it? Now the answer is way biased to the small econo car. I have a 7 person mini van that 7 adults can ride in very comfortably, and still gets well over 20 miles per gallon.

I also feel as though you have a very false sense of security in your "large" vehicle. I see way more SUV's laying shiney side down than I do econo cars. I truely hope you don't drive around thinking you are invinsible in your SUV, because you may just get a real wake up call someday. The damage to ones vehicle is not a true determining factor in the safety of a vehicle. Cars are built with specific crumple zones and such to protect the driver. More damage to the exterior does not always translate into more damage to the passengers. How many airbags does your SUV have? How many side curtain airbags does it have? Their are many more factors to safety of occupants in a vehicle than size of the vehicle.

Yes, I do agree that their is a place in our world for large SUV's. But that place is not as an everyday driver for one or two passengers.

Jeff

 

A few years ago I drove about 200 miles through black ice and then a snowstorm. 90% of the vehicles that slid off the road were large SUVs, probably with 4wd.

 

Plus there is something wrong with using the best farmland in to world to grow corn so rich people can drive around.

I didn't even know rich people were the only ones allowed to drive. When did that happen? Guess I better get my poor behind off the road before I get caught.