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I don't claim to know everything. If you are down to bare metal there is no need to use POR. Just epoxy and topcoat. POR is good product for it's intended use of not removing rust if you like leaving rust on your car. Some have no option or inadequate cash and they are stuck with it.
or they have a car that has so much rust it is impossible to get rid of it all.

Correct me if I'm mistaken but I believe rust will creep underneath epoxy primer. That means if you have rust in the seams between panels, it will eventually creep out if all you use is epoxy. That's where POR15 is useful, places like that. Well, unless you are skilled enough to separate each and every panel, get ALL the rust, and put it all back together again.
 
Bryan,

If your floor is down to bare metal, no need to use POR. IMO, POR is a bandaid. Too many guys including myself have had the stuff peel off, even when following their directions to the letter.

Epoxy primer will still to bare metal & protect the surface better than POR without all the prep work that POR requires. Plus you can spray it without having to worry about ruining your gun. POR sucks to clean up.

Just my 2 cents..
xylol works as a POR solvent and reducer
 
What's the difference? Will POR wick into the pinchwelds? For some reason, all the cars we've done in the past twenty years that were sandblasted and epoxied have not rotten out. If there is substantial corrosion between the pinchwelds that the car will rot in a short time after proper prep and epoxy, the car was a POS from the start.
Rust doesn't creep under properly applied POR15. Sometimes it's not possible to get all the rust and I'd be concerned about it creeping out again particularly on outside seams like the rocker panels, tail panel, and cowl area.

Really though, with a lot of the cars we're talking about, they get stored inside and driven sparingly so really there is not much of a concern either way. It's just that some people don't have access to sandblasting equipment nor do they have a place to do it anyway so other means need to be employed. POR15 is a viable alternative. When properly applied to a car that's stored inside and driven sparingly it will outlive the owner most likely anyway.

Some people are working on a "POS" because that's that they have to work with. Plus, some cars, even if they are a "POS" by your standards, are worth rebuilding - such as an SS or perhaps a car that's been in the family since new, etc.

I'm not slagging on your way of doing things, it's just that some people don't have the nice warm cozy shop with tons of room, a rotisserie, an area for painting and an area for blasting, and a compressor the size of Texas with which to restore their car. Products like POR15 and RE give the driveway and garage restorers who don't have a bodyshop attached to their house nor the money to have someone restore their car for them a few other options that make the restore a little less costly.

To the OP, unless you CAN get the underside sandblasted and perfectly clean of ALL rust, I would use POR15 first and then put epoxy over the top while it's still a little tacky. I did that on the rear wheel area of my 69 4 years ago and did some test removal in places when I was getting the underside ready for the final coating last month, and it was pretty tough to get off. I'm not the least bit worried that it will fail anytime soon. Just follow the directions for POR15 and make sure you have a nice rough and CLEAN surface and it will never come off on its own. POR likes rough surfaces. I personally would not use it over any other paint, only bare metal sanded well with 60 or 80 grit, rusted surfaces that have been wire wheeled and sanded with 60 - 80 grit, or freshly sandblasted metal (although this is the perfect surface for epoxy). I do trust the POR on formerly rusty surfaces that have been sandblasted more than epoxy because unless you get ALL the rust off it will come back under the epoxy.

It took me several years to finish up the underside of the car. I replaced main floor in 2006 and the trunk floor in 2007 and that's when I cleaned up and painted the area between the trunk and the main floor. I was pretty confident I had the wheel houses clean (they were half new anyway as I sectioned in the lower part) so I used just plain epoxy on those. I had POR and epoxy on the area between the tunk and floor, ecoat on the main floor, and epoxy on the toe kicks. It sat inside for about 3 years after this as I was working on other things. Then this winter I cleaned up the ecoat and bare metal areas left from welding the floors and patching the inner rockers, scuffed the crap out of everything, seam sealed, shot RE over the main floor and inner rockers and then applied Herculiner over the entire underside. It looks great and I'm not expecting any problems.

For areas that you will see, like the firewall or the forward part of the frame, I'd use Rust Encapsulator rather than POR.
 
What's wrong with Zero Rust, SEM Rust Shield or MasterShield? Is POR superior to these forms of rust covering/conversion products? Permatex makes a converter/coating that can be painted over. Seems there are more options than POR. How about Cosmoline? Why does it not get any mention? There is life outside of Eastwood.
POR15 isn't an Eastwood product.

I've never used any of those, but they're probably good if used properly.

I've used spray bomb rust converter before and had excellent results. I used it on the rear drums on the convertible back in 2005. I cleaned it, and sanded it to get all the loose rust off, and sprayed two coats then used a spray bomb cast iron paint from O'Reilly's. When I took the chassis apart in 2008 it was still like the day I painted it. Then I threw the rear end out in the weeds and rain and when we sold the house in 2011 they still looked like they did the day I painted them.

Not all this stuff is crap. Rust converters and so forth work well you just can't ask them to do things they weren't designed for.
 
i beleive if you use POR 15 on bare metal it needs to be eched first. They make a metal etch that goes with the POR.
Not always. I think if you read the directions they say for freshly blasted metal just blow off the loose dirt. I've found I get excellent adhesion by sanding the surface with 60-80 grit, too. The trick is to give the metal a rough surface for the POR to grab onto.
 
Freshly blasted metal should have no rust, so why bother with POR15? Isn't the idea of POR to stop & contain existing rust? Blasted metal to me is a no-brainer, Epoxy primer would be my choice.

If I sound like I'm biased, I am. I think POR is very inconsistent. Sometimes it sticks, sometimes it peels, no rhyme or reason. Please don't tell me I'm not using it correctly, I follow their directions to the letter each time. I still have their Marine Clean & Metal Ready on the shelf. I actually still use them as rust converters; I just cover the affected spots with epoxy instead.

My results aside, there a more than a handful of people here that have had the same things happen. I'm sure POR has its place for some guys, but for me it's in the trash.
I'm just passing along what the POR people say about their own product. They say freshly blasted metal is the best surface. I'm with you, if I have freshly blasted metal that I'm sure is completely free of rust, I'll use SPI.

I don't know why some people have problems and some don't. I've never had a problem. I do know that POR15 is very sensitive to a wet surface, any grease or contamination including silicone, and smooth surfaces. It's like any surface prep - when you think you are done go back and do it all over again twice.
 
I know, they just sell it. My point is that an entire car can be restrored without confining oneself to an Eastwood sold product. Unfortunately, their marketing has led hobbiests to believe they are the be all and end all.

I agree with the last part. Not to bash SPI, but they are not the only ones who sell good epoxy either.
But Eastwood stuff is good in general, not the greatest, but their whole line is generally pretty decent. You could do much worse than to buy all your restoration supplies from Eastwood. For people without extensive knowledge of products available it's a good place to get what you need.

And no, I'm sure there are other epoxy primers besides SPI but SPI is very good (better than DPLF) and I see no reason to experiment.
 
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