There's no replacement for displacement !


Nate

 

I'd go with the 350...even though it's a "mass production" rebuild,it should provide reliable service.JMO

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1970 Chevelle SS396/M20/4.10 My 70 SS396
Engine pic
My Black Cherry 70 SS454 13.74 @ 97.45/2.04 60 ft. with exhaust manifolds,radials and 2.73's
1968 Oldsmobile Cutlass convertible
1985 Cadillac Eldorado
Chris Corwel,TC Member # 785
Member # 141 AMCA

 

The 350 would be a cheaper build, and more readily available parts. But with the 327, you wouldn't have "another 350". Personal preference I think. The 350 from the parts store might also come with a warranty of some type.

 

oh another thing to mention.
if i wanted desired HP from the 350 i would have to buy diff. parts. prolly would get me above 1000 dollars with everything. With the 327 it has almost 300 hp to start with. so not much would hafta be done. The 327 is 850 dollars. But the warrenty is another thing. no warrenty with the 327.


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Steve

hey its not done but check out its progress.
http://stevelaser_1.tripod.com/

 

From the horror stories I have heard(and witnessed) if you go with the parts store motor you're gonna need the warranty

. BTW some of those warranties aren't worth the paper tey are printed on. I think you would better off if you find a local engine builder/machine shop that is reasonable and deal with them. Either that or get the targetmaster 350 from the general. It may cost a little more but there's nothing like FACTORY matched parts

Good Luck

------------------
Jeff Angerstein
ACES#841 TCG#158 CECCO #16
68 SS396(roller 454)
68 Pro Street
69 SSRS 396(427) 4spd For Sale
87 MC SS For Sale Too
99 K2500 Burb 7.4L(454)

My Chevs
OLD BLUE (12.27@109.9)
(10 second motor in a 14 second chassis)

[This message has been edited by ACE841 (edited 08-30-2002).]

 

What makes anyone think the 327 was rebuilt any better than the auto parts store 350? Follow up; how much ya wanna bet the 327 was bought rebuilt out of a parts store? Probably neither one of them is a prize. Both will easlily take a 3.75" stroke crank in the future.

If you can wait, why don't you start looking around to see if any other interesting possibilities make their way to the surface - at least I don't think there is any reason why these have to be your only two choices.

What proof or reason do you have to believe the 327 really is putting out 300 hp?

I'm not going to say that either engine would give you bad service, I just want to see more evidence before I would vote for either of these engines.

Thomas

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"Bomber" '67 El Camino, Beater comes back to life.
Was 350/TH350 14.90 @ 93mph, 360,000+ miles on car.
Now 406 roller, 340rwhp, more hp coming, 3.08 gears.
Street radials, left in drive, 13.20 e.t.@108.35 mph.
8/1/01 added Plum Mist '67 to collection
ProCharger D-2R 468 under construction.

 

Well the 327 was pro built by a shop not to far from here. The reason this guy has an exra rebuilt 327 is because he purchased the engine to put in his 68 camero. Then after he had the camero all rebuilt and everything he had a change of heart and decided he wanted to put a BB in it. ive brought up buying it once and a while so he said hed keep it until my car was done and i knew whati was doing engine wise. So i have this pro built 327 which was camed has a performer intake and other goodies. and i have a rebuilt 350 from an autoparts store WITH a warrenty.
people are telling my to go with the 350 and now im leaning towards that. Ill see what you say with this lil tidbit of info.

------------------
Steve

hey its not done but check out its progress. http://stevelaser_1.tripod.com/

[This message has been edited by feeblerboy (edited 08-31-2002).]

 

I'm not going to say that all of the store type rebuilt engines are this way but most of the one's I have seen tend to be filthy.Most of these engines dont have any tin or manifolds on them so if you get a chance take a good hard look at it.Look at the oil drainback holes in the back of the lifter valley...stick your finger in there and see what come out.... Do the same in dist hole..
and anywhere else you can see that might hide hidden grit and dirt.Since it may be in a crate it might be hard to look at the crank and rods but if you can get your hands in there also and see if it's clean or not.

Dirt in a brand new rebuilt engine is not a good thing...These type of engines are rebuilt on a mass scale and are not the best foundation for a performance engine.If you do go with one of these I would HIGHLY reccomond changing your oil and filter very fequiently.

Thats not to say they are all bad... There not but alot of them are quite dirty.They often times sit in a warehouse or store for a long time and even when crated and bagged can accumulate alot of dust and dirt.

At least with the 327 you have a chance of knowing what is inside of it as far as parts go... And at least you can stop by and check out the shop of the guy who built the 327.

What ever you decide check them both for cleanlyness.

------------------
1969 El Camino
69 LS1 335 HP 427
( not the origional engine)
M21 12 Bolt 3:07's.
Daily Driver work truck.

 

There is no "e" in Camaro.

You have a '72 ElCamino right? Does the 327 have cylinder heads with accessory bolt holes in the front? If not, then you will also be needing a complete set of early brackets to use this engine in your '72. Problem with the early brackets is that they cannot be used with a long style water pump. Which then means your fan would not be properly located for your fan shroud to be effective.
Now if it does have accessory bolt holes on the cylinder heads the choice gets tougher. I like the idea of the 327 being built by a shop you respect, and that it has some performance goodies already installed. I like the 350 because more cubes are always better when dealing with a non-lightweight vehicle.

On balance, I would go with the 327, unless it has the early style cylinder heads - which would make the 350 the only choice.

Thomas

 

haha oops my bad.
ill call him and ask about the bolt holes. and the problem wit the water pump is a big one. I was gonan relpace it anyways and teh fan shroud is all cracked so im replacing that to. But what do you think all the brackets would cost?
thanks bomber

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Steve

hey its not done but check out its progress. http://stevelaser_1.tripod.com/

[This message has been edited by feeblerboy (edited 08-31-2002).]

 

Ask me how thrilled I am with my Goodwrench 350...not much. Stump puller for sure, but the heads need umbrella seals, and the dealer and GM are giving me the runaround. I'm on their "oil consumption test". Sucks too, because they are telling me it's within tollerances. Hmm. So I get to look as smoke on a regular basis.

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David Reinecke - aka - FINE 68
1968 Chevelle 300 Sport Coupe Deluxe
http://home.att.net/~thereineckes/

 

If it has the early style cylinder heads with no accessory bracket holes, then I would pass on the 327.

You can do anything you like, but why buy something that opens a minor cluster mess in order to use. Go find some engine compartment pics of the differrent years and you will see what I mean. For starters, an early style small block mounts the alternator and a/c compressor on opposite sides compared to your '72. let's say you were clever enough to acquire all the brackets, pulleys, short water pump etc - then you will find out that there is no fan shroud designed to fit your '72 AND the short water pump. In other words, you would end up fabricating some parts and pieces to make it work - and then it would all look out of place on your '72. Too much trouble.

If you like the 327, then it better have the accessory mounting holes on the cylinder heads, otherwise pass on it.

Thomas

 

you are prolly right tom.
i guess i can ask around at this show im going to soon.
hopefully someone will have the setup.


------------------
Steve

hey its not done but check out its progress.
http://stevelaser_1.tripod.com/

 

Sell both of those SBC and get a BBC!!! You will definetly enjoy the mass tourqe from the BBC much better than the ugh of the SBC.

Just my $.02

------------------
70 454
TH350
12-bolt Car 4.56

 

BlazingChevhell, you are so right, it feels good to have a big block connected to the other end of the accelerator pedal.

So let me amend my advice, pass on the smallblocks, save up some more money, and get a BSE combo instead.

Thomas

 

I plan on doing that 2nd or 3rd year of college hopefully. I may have some extra money then. But right now i just need a daily driver just not a wimpy 130 hp one.

------------------
Steve

hey its not done but check out its progress.
http://stevelaser_1.tripod.com/

 

bomber
you said i would have to change all the brackets and the water pump prolly...would anything else have to be changed? only thing i could think of that would have to be changed is the power steering pump. also would teh engine mounts have to be for a 68 small block or could 72 small block mounts work?

------------------
Steve

hey its not done but check out its progress.
http://stevelaser_1.tripod.com/

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ACE841:
From the horror stories I have heard(and witnessed) if you go with the parts store motor you're gonna need the warranty

. BTW some of those warranties aren't worth the paper tey are printed on. I think you would better off if you find a local engine builder/machine shop that is reasonable and deal with them. Either that or get the targetmaster 350 from the general. It may cost a little more but there's nothing like FACTORY matched parts

Good Luck

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I couldn't agree more with this statement. If you want the 350, go find a core and have a reputable shop go through it, or call gm. These parts store motors are total crap. Not only have I heard infinite horror stories, but I work in a large chain parts store, and see the problems. These motors have no accountability, they are total crap. A guy I work with just went through his 87 Suburban at the same time I re-did my 84. I opted for the more hassle route, and he bought a motor from us. It was a long block, stock cam, dished pistons, cast rings... ect. The one I put together came out cheaper, and I have flat tops, mild cam, moly rings, double roller, steel shim head gaskets, ect ect... And on top of all of this, he just had a valve spring break!! They do the cheapest crappiest rebuild possible. His suburban is now in the shop as he dosn't do much himself. They pulled the head off, and it looks pretty bad, like he had a piston kissin the valve, and the head looks pretty bad from the valve beatin around in there. The funny part to me is that he brought the bill in to work, so the company would have to cover it... Guess what, it cost more than the motor.

Just my .02,
Brandon

 

I've had two engines from an auto parts store a 400 and a 350, they where both JUNK, I have learned my lesson, from now on it will eather be a new engine or I will rebuild it myself.
No more of the hassels of installing a motor to find out that it is no good so that I can go to all the work of taking it back out and putting another one back in.
If you had a engine builder that you trust that my be something to concider

 

*The problem with talking is that people only hear what they want to hear*

Oh yeah, ignore most of what follows IF you have actually found out that the 327 does or does not have the accessory bolt holes on the cylinder heads...otherwise we will just keep going in circles until you find out.

Please reread my replies and note:
..."then you will find out that there is no fan shroud designed to fit your '72 AND the short water pump. In other words, you would end up fabricating some parts and pieces to make it work - and then it would all look out of place on your '72."...

I'm going to guess that calling a water pump the long or short type has no meaning to you, so let me try: the short water pump places the engine fan CLOSER to the engine, the long type places it FARTHER away. If you install a short water pump where the design calls out for the long types, then your fan will no longer be inside the fan shroud. The reason why this is important is that if the fan is too far away from the radiator, and there is no shroud, then airflow will be weird and heating problems usually follow.

Your '72 engine mounts most likely will work, might not as this is one area where the 307's can get funky.

Thomas

[This message has been edited by Bomber '67 (edited 09-02-2002).]

 

ok bomber that clears some things up. I saw what you typed about the water pumps and thought that it would just lower the position of the fan not make it farther away. If it was lower i was thinkin it could work because i have seen people lower their fan shrouds. i didnt realize that the the short water pump made the fan closer to the engine. so all in all i just didnt know. i guess ill dish the 327 idea and wait till something pops up like you said.
and thanks for straightening me out, i guess i should better my listening skills.


------------------
Steve

hey its not done but check out its progress.
http://stevelaser_1.tripod.com/

[This message has been edited by feeblerboy (edited 09-02-2002).]

 

Do a little shopping with your local chevy dealers I bought my 350/300 hp gm performance motor pn at the time 12356644 came with 9.1:1 4 bolt mains cylinder heads even came with chrome centerbolt style valve covers and timing chain covers for 1650.00 brand new with a 12 month warranty. Some notes though it was a later style one piece rear main block which meant new flywheel and starter also new intake required or some careful massaging of 4 inner bolt holes otherwise its been running great for 7 years and I now have 65,000 miles on it. Lots of power runs on 89 octane gas. My car originally had a 327 and by the time I added up a decent **stock** rebuild it was well over $2000.00 Shop around a bit I called about 4 different dealers prices ranged from about 1900-2300 but one dealer I found had it in stock and it was ordered for a gu ywho never picked it up so the parts manager let me have it cheap 1650.Good Luck