Who uses above on their SBC/BBC’s ?
This is the stand alone, not using separate box.
Has anyone lost fire ?
This is the stand alone, not using separate box.
Has anyone lost fire ?
MSD RTR 8360 Reliability Opinions
Reelysalty
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
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1,461 Posts
Who uses above on their SBC/BBC’s ?
This is the stand alone, not using separate box.
Has anyone lost fire ?
This is the stand alone, not using separate box.
Has anyone lost fire ?
Joined
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7,406 Posts
I have lost 2 of them and will never buy another distributor from MSD. The first was the one in my Son's 409, all it did was pop and sputter so I replaced the module with one from a known good dizzy, MSD would not warranty the thing. The 2nd was a SBC that failed on the road, when I got the car home I took out that crap module and just put a pigtail on the pickup coil and added the MSD 6A and the car has had no trouble since. I guess the the thing not to do is leave the key on for long periods of time, seems it cooks the module. Hope this helps.
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8,349 Posts
Used a couple no problems.
68Chevele was yours the 8360?
68Chevele was yours the 8360?
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1,461 Posts
I’ve heard the “key in ignition left on” before. Can anyone confirm this as a way to destroy ignition module?
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113 Posts
Yes, 5 of RTR, 2 the Pro Billet "E" units.
Loving all my many many MSD products since the earliest AUTOTRONICS days, 40+ yrs. :thumbsup:
Loving all my many many MSD products since the earliest AUTOTRONICS days, 40+ yrs. :thumbsup:
Joined
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7,406 Posts
Pretty sure the were, I buy then at the swap meets now when the burn out. I tale out the module and just use the magnetic trigger with the MSD box, works great and cheap. Just put one of the reworked ones in the race car last fall, timing is spot on now.
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1,461 Posts
Dave Ray calls those RTR things RTQ, "ready to quit". You can get a cheap china junk fake HEI for about $50 on ebay or amazon, just make sure your AAA is paid up before leaving the driveway. You'll be needing it.
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1,461 Posts
Looks like Dave Ray blames the coil, not distributer, ?
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7,406 Posts
So true.
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7,406 Posts
My Son's was new out of the box and never fired with a Mallory coil, put in a module out of a known good MSD dizzy fired right up with the same coil. Been ok so far.
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2,229 Posts
I bought an 8360 in 1998 for my '65 Malibu. No problems with it. In 2000 I bought another one for my '69 GMC. This one was defective...right out of the box. MSD replaced it and I never had a problem with it after that. Both these vehicles were SBC powered. In 2016 I bought another 8360 for my L78-powered '69 SS car. I have had no problems but am wary of the Blaster II coil I bought at the same time. Are oil-filled coils still available? Do you know a source, Dave Ray?
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1,461 Posts
Blasters ARE oil filled for the most part. Howeve, before 2002, all Blasters, and most other il filled round coils, stock and performance, including MSD Blaster 2, 3, were made at Andover Industries, Andover, Indiana, good stuff. Then, the EPA came out with the oils inside coils were murdering billions of people, wich stopped Andover from building oil filled coils, they still build some epoxy filled junkers. Oil filled coil production went all over the world, Crane and Accel to Taiwan, Mallory to China, and MSD, well, to a company named Pro-Bobbin in Juarez, Mexico, straight across the Rio Grande from El Paso. Pro-Bobbin elected to use a very inferior wiring rounds insulation that degraded and disintegrated when oil hit it, and fell off the windings spools.
When that insulation fell off the windings, it was called a :Layer Short", layer was the windings layers, and short was those windings touching together, shortening the windings lengths to the point of coil failure, and overworking modules of all sorts to failure. Sometimes the coils were assembled faulty, sometimes it took a while gradually failing the coils. Ever seen posts that said "Those darned HEI modules (or, MSD box) are sure junk, I had 4 in a row fall FOR NO APPARENT REASON"? Well, NOTHING fails for NO APPARENT REASON, NOTHING. That is why the MSD coils were so bad for a few years after manufacture went to Juarez, Mexico. Blasters are now ALL made n China, mediocre coils now, didn't use to be.
This is also why old resistance tests are no good to test a coil these days. Resistance will tell you if a coil is possibly functional, or, dead on arrival, but not if it is good any place else. RUNNING THE COIL ON AN OFF VEHICLE ELECTRICAL TESTER IS THE ONLY WAY TO DO IT RIGHT. Most coils work just fine when dead cold, with the faulty ones showing failure along the way to full operating temps, Ever had module failures when the coil ws cold, not often at all, the failures always seem to happen when the ignition gets to some level of heat as it warms up, or, gets to full ops temps.
MOST good auto parts stores have the off vehicle testers, tell the parts drone to leave the tester on, get the coil hot, not a simple 5 second blast, and "hey, man, it's just dandy".
How did I find all this out, not on a web board. I had one customer have a few module failures, and asked to have the entire system and coil back. I ran the system on my distributor tester, failed 3 modules straight off, about 30 seconds operation each. I then swapped another new module into the system, added a new coil, ran it for an hour, not even a sneeze. Then, swapped the original coil, same module, module failed in 30 seconds. Another new coil, back to user, and that conversion is still running, over 18 years now, not one more fart, belch, backfire, bang, boom.
Yes, I blamed the coil, rightfully so, and have seen a lot more Blasters take all sorts of modules out, all those Blaster coils, and ACCEL, Crane, Mallory from faulty manufacture.
About the RtQ distributors, I have converted more RtQ units than any other MSD unit, very close to the same number of PerTronix failures, more than any of you would ever believe.
Now you all know why I am staying away from posting on boards. I am forced to defend every post I make, from a small handful of people that just do not know what they are talking about. Most of you are great, there are always a small few that only cause never ending trouble, and I am fed up with it, see ya, until the next time I am told I don't know what I am talking about, but actually do.
When that insulation fell off the windings, it was called a :Layer Short", layer was the windings layers, and short was those windings touching together, shortening the windings lengths to the point of coil failure, and overworking modules of all sorts to failure. Sometimes the coils were assembled faulty, sometimes it took a while gradually failing the coils. Ever seen posts that said "Those darned HEI modules (or, MSD box) are sure junk, I had 4 in a row fall FOR NO APPARENT REASON"? Well, NOTHING fails for NO APPARENT REASON, NOTHING. That is why the MSD coils were so bad for a few years after manufacture went to Juarez, Mexico. Blasters are now ALL made n China, mediocre coils now, didn't use to be.
This is also why old resistance tests are no good to test a coil these days. Resistance will tell you if a coil is possibly functional, or, dead on arrival, but not if it is good any place else. RUNNING THE COIL ON AN OFF VEHICLE ELECTRICAL TESTER IS THE ONLY WAY TO DO IT RIGHT. Most coils work just fine when dead cold, with the faulty ones showing failure along the way to full operating temps, Ever had module failures when the coil ws cold, not often at all, the failures always seem to happen when the ignition gets to some level of heat as it warms up, or, gets to full ops temps.
MOST good auto parts stores have the off vehicle testers, tell the parts drone to leave the tester on, get the coil hot, not a simple 5 second blast, and "hey, man, it's just dandy".
How did I find all this out, not on a web board. I had one customer have a few module failures, and asked to have the entire system and coil back. I ran the system on my distributor tester, failed 3 modules straight off, about 30 seconds operation each. I then swapped another new module into the system, added a new coil, ran it for an hour, not even a sneeze. Then, swapped the original coil, same module, module failed in 30 seconds. Another new coil, back to user, and that conversion is still running, over 18 years now, not one more fart, belch, backfire, bang, boom.
Yes, I blamed the coil, rightfully so, and have seen a lot more Blasters take all sorts of modules out, all those Blaster coils, and ACCEL, Crane, Mallory from faulty manufacture.
About the RtQ distributors, I have converted more RtQ units than any other MSD unit, very close to the same number of PerTronix failures, more than any of you would ever believe.
Now you all know why I am staying away from posting on boards. I am forced to defend every post I make, from a small handful of people that just do not know what they are talking about. Most of you are great, there are always a small few that only cause never ending trouble, and I am fed up with it, see ya, until the next time I am told I don't know what I am talking about, but actually do.
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1,461 Posts
Don’t leave yet !
What do you recommend for a coil ?
What do you recommend for a coil ?
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4,059 Posts
Dave - I think people were genuinely asking you what a good brand of oil filled coil to purchase is. I don’t think anyone (at least in this thread) was questioning you that it’s the coil most of the time frying the modules. At least I didn’t read any posts that way.
I know I’ve been following this thread hoping you would weigh in on what brand of oil filled coil is good to purchase nowadays so I know what to buy (and what to avoid.)
I know I’ve been following this thread hoping you would weigh in on what brand of oil filled coil is good to purchase nowadays so I know what to buy (and what to avoid.)
Any good quality oil filled coil for, and I KNOW this will cause a lot of consternation, a stock point set for a GM system. I have used NAPA IC12, NOT THE IC12SB EPOXY VERSION. Shake the coil, if it soounds like it has liquid in it, go for it, but, stand it up, don't lay it on its side.
That said, it is what I use on my conversions. Seems GM took the tack that they didn't want ignition system failures when they went to 12 volt systems, so, they designed the performance coil of all time for their systems, ones that would run with a larger rating resistor for their point systems than others like Ford and MOPAR used. GM coils used a 1.80 ohm porcelain resistor, or same rating resistor wire, silver stranded and 7.50 feet long to get the right resistance, to make their coils work. Ford and MOPAR used very much different coils, a lot less quality than GM, with as low as .60 ohms resistance (MOPAR), and a lot more failures.
The GM coils will work just fine with most electronic ignitions, including MSD multi-spark CD, and no problem running on a full 12 volts, or with the later single and 3 wire alternators at system volts of 14.60.
And, just stop all the "60K volts spark output" stuff, once coils get to operating temperatures on all systems NOT CD, they don't put out nearly those voltage numbers. CD does, because a capacitor stores the volts, not the cil, and when triggered, tells the cold coil to make the voltage the capacitor stores, that is the reason a multi-spark like MSD works, no CD, no fast storage, no large spark output volts. Be aware, most of or older cars were quite happy with a dirt simple points ignition system, at 6K volts, nothing more.
As far as not being around here much, and not wanting to do much with the boards, the last go-around, where I was attacked constantly by two people, took it all out of me, I have other constructive things to do than never ending defense of attacks by a very small handful of people that only want to make trouble. Almost everyone here is top notch people, and I do enjoy a constructive disagree with me, discussion is great with someone that is a good person, but, that small handful makes it not worth even coming here any more. I will just go with my two personal Chevelle's, the Z16, and the 1967 big block, and leave the rest at that.
What started it was my own failure to get jobs done in the last 14 months from health issues. I was called a liar by three people when I posted pictures of my left hand after the Brown Recluse spider bite, and it was not nice at all. I still can't use the hand to work. I still have a problem with my left hip frm the dehydration damage, but that is on me, the time frame on the unfinished distributors is the main issue I fight with myself about, nobody deserved the wait, nor the small amount of distributors I sent back unable to get to them frm the health issues. so, I will just slip in and look every once in a while,and if it is about something I said previously, not accurate, or being attacked, I will step in to clarify, then leave it at that, and go back to my cars and motorcycles, they are actually fun to be with.
I just got so mad at myself for letting a few people down, it really aggravated me. Then, one of the people I sent a distributor that I hadn't started, and full payment back to, called me a liar about the hand, and that was it. His board name is there to see in the older topic. I also added that I would support any response to those send back situations, as it was my fault, but an outright liar I will never be, nor even a lair of any kind. He didn't even give me the benefit of the doubt.
Long dissertation over. Best to all here, go enjoy your Chevelle's and other older cars.
That said, it is what I use on my conversions. Seems GM took the tack that they didn't want ignition system failures when they went to 12 volt systems, so, they designed the performance coil of all time for their systems, ones that would run with a larger rating resistor for their point systems than others like Ford and MOPAR used. GM coils used a 1.80 ohm porcelain resistor, or same rating resistor wire, silver stranded and 7.50 feet long to get the right resistance, to make their coils work. Ford and MOPAR used very much different coils, a lot less quality than GM, with as low as .60 ohms resistance (MOPAR), and a lot more failures.
The GM coils will work just fine with most electronic ignitions, including MSD multi-spark CD, and no problem running on a full 12 volts, or with the later single and 3 wire alternators at system volts of 14.60.
And, just stop all the "60K volts spark output" stuff, once coils get to operating temperatures on all systems NOT CD, they don't put out nearly those voltage numbers. CD does, because a capacitor stores the volts, not the cil, and when triggered, tells the cold coil to make the voltage the capacitor stores, that is the reason a multi-spark like MSD works, no CD, no fast storage, no large spark output volts. Be aware, most of or older cars were quite happy with a dirt simple points ignition system, at 6K volts, nothing more.
As far as not being around here much, and not wanting to do much with the boards, the last go-around, where I was attacked constantly by two people, took it all out of me, I have other constructive things to do than never ending defense of attacks by a very small handful of people that only want to make trouble. Almost everyone here is top notch people, and I do enjoy a constructive disagree with me, discussion is great with someone that is a good person, but, that small handful makes it not worth even coming here any more. I will just go with my two personal Chevelle's, the Z16, and the 1967 big block, and leave the rest at that.
What started it was my own failure to get jobs done in the last 14 months from health issues. I was called a liar by three people when I posted pictures of my left hand after the Brown Recluse spider bite, and it was not nice at all. I still can't use the hand to work. I still have a problem with my left hip frm the dehydration damage, but that is on me, the time frame on the unfinished distributors is the main issue I fight with myself about, nobody deserved the wait, nor the small amount of distributors I sent back unable to get to them frm the health issues. so, I will just slip in and look every once in a while,and if it is about something I said previously, not accurate, or being attacked, I will step in to clarify, then leave it at that, and go back to my cars and motorcycles, they are actually fun to be with.
I just got so mad at myself for letting a few people down, it really aggravated me. Then, one of the people I sent a distributor that I hadn't started, and full payment back to, called me a liar about the hand, and that was it. His board name is there to see in the older topic. I also added that I would support any response to those send back situations, as it was my fault, but an outright liar I will never be, nor even a lair of any kind. He didn't even give me the benefit of the doubt.
Long dissertation over. Best to all here, go enjoy your Chevelle's and other older cars.
Just a question, has anyone replaced a RtQ module? Let me elaborate, the modules are in the taper between the cap body area and the post, and to get to them, one needs ato take the entire distributor apart, and a soldering iron, because the pickup wires are soldered to the module. Do all that by the side of the road, it will be a very frustrating challenge. And, the RtQ isn't a very powerful ignition system to start with, not much reason to go with one.
1968 Malibu Sport Coupe, 489c.i. 590hp 600tq, TCI 200r4 Freakshow 3,600 stall, 3.73 12 bolt posi
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15,653 Posts
Dave I'm glad that damn spider didn't kill you, my good friend and electrical partner of my company, 37 yr. union Jman let a brown recluse bite on his foot go unattended other than him trying to fix it, waited 2 weeks to go to the hospital later got mersa while there and died within a week, you take care of your hand, we can't lose a guy like you :thumbsup: and THANK YOU again for helping me with my ignition problem, rick. :thumbsup:
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