[Rich-L79]

I have encountered many questions and have seen many '65 Leeds cowl tags that have a Group 4 code of "P" and to date I have never gotten a good answer as to what this code represents. Even my L79 car has a "4P" code and I cannot connect it to any specific option or piece of equipment.

Many places, Dale's Chevellestuff.com and Year One to mention a few, list this code as a right hand (passenger side) outside rearview mirror. I don't think this is correct because:

A - Chevrolet never listed a right hand mirror as an option in any sales literature nor, more importantly, in the Assembly Instruction Manual.
B - Of the many cars I've personally owned or looked at which have a 4P code, none of them have a right hand mirror nor any evidence of a right hand mirror having ever been installed.
C - More specifically, my documented L79 car came to me with all original sheetmetal and the right hand door never ever had a mirror on it.
D - Circumstantial: a right hand mirror is basically useless on these cars anyway.

I KNOW some car have these mirrors and I know some were probably delivered new this way with the dealer adding the right hand mirror, but I am 99.9% certain none were ever installed at the factory.

That leaves me still wondering what the Leeds tags' 4P code represents? Does anyone have any insight?

 

[DaleM]

The source I used is, "Chevy Cowl Tags" by Mark S. Allen and (what looks like a photocopy of this same data) by Chuck Hanson a few years ago. A problem I've found with this book is in the listings it doesn't always break out the Chevrolet models among passenger, Camaro, Chevelle, Corvair, etc.

There are two such tags from KC with 4P in the group codes on my site and both are very early production KC, 08D and 09A.

If anyone does know, or finds out, I will gladly change the data. I'd rather be right...:yes:

 

[Rich-L79]

Anybody?

 

[tar6569]

I was just looking at a 65 SS Framingham built car (138375G) at the GM Nationals yesterday and it has the right exterior mirror and 4P. It also had 2P which I believe it RPO Z01, comfort and convience.

We really need to see more examples of the code. I actually talked to mark allen last week about the codes in his book. The codes he has in there are mostly based off cars he has seen in person (at shows, junkyards).

You see it more on fullsize cars but only at certain plants in 65. I will look through my info and see what I can find. Tarrytoen as far as I know did not use the 4P code in 65 so I don't get the chance to check many 4P cars being in the northeast.

Warren

 

[DaleM]

I was just looking at a 65 SS Framingham built car (138375G) at the GM Nationals yesterday and it has the right exterior mirror and 4P. It also had 2P which I believe it RPO Z01, comfort and convience.
Warren

You didn't happen to get a body date or sequence number to tie it to a timeframe by chance?

 

[tar6569]

Yes. It was a 09B car. Do you have any others in your list with later build dates and the 4P code?

Warren

 

[DaleM]

Yes. It was a 09B car. Do you have any others in your list with later build dates and the 4P code?

Warren

Double checking my site (Duh), I have a 06B Framingham Malbu SS with 4P. In fact, all of the Framingham tags I have, 11D, 01A, and 06D have group 4P. Kansas City only 08D and 09A - after that anything in group 4 is "F". Atlanta I have only one occurance of group 4F and that's 01C; no other group 4-anything occurances.

 

[Rich-L79]

My car is 12D (Kansas City) and has 4P. It does NOT have a right hand mirror. The factory never offered a right hand mirror and any car with the 4P code and a right hand mirror is entirely coincidental. Any car with a right hand mirror had it installed either by the dealer or by the owner.

There has to be a different explanation for the 4P code, the right hand mirror just does not match up with a 4P code given numerous examples that exist, my own car being one.

 

[jeffschevelle]

Could it be a redundant code (sort of like the A's and B's in the interior trim codes)?

Every 4P I saw on Dale's site (on a quick skim) also has a P in group 2. Perhaps they both refer to different parts of what Fisher body workers at different points on their line had to do to the body to accomodate the Z01/Z13 options??? If anyone has a 4P without a 2P that would eliminate that idea, but if not then that seems plausible.

 

[RyanNilcea05]

I love these mysteries. it keeps the hobby so exciting, wouldn't you say?

 

[highlandlake]

I was just looking at a 65 SS Framingham built car (138375G) at the GM Nationals yesterday and it has the right exterior mirror and 4P. It also had 2P which I believe it RPO Z01, comfort and convience.


Warren

My Framingham car (also a 138 trim tag) has the 4P & 5L. It has a passenger side mirror and a glove box light, and day/night mirror & AM pushbutton radio if that is helpful information.

 

[DaleM]

Saw another 65 with 4P at the MCR show in Springfield; KC body date 08D. I have 3 KC tags, 2 are 08D and 1 is 09A, with 2P and 4P. No 4P tags after 09A but I have a 09B tag with 2P but all group 4 codes after that are F when there is a group 4. The car in Springfield did not have a remote right mirror - I think Rich is right on that.

I have 3 Framingham tags, 11D, 01A, and 06D and all those have 2P and 4P as well. ?