Chevelles.com banner

Status
Not open for further replies.
1 - 16 of 16 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
115 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I am a chevelle owner and hobbiest, but I am also working on a newer ('98 Cavalier) repairable. I know some of you are technicians, so maybe you can help me with my current problem.

The car was hit lightly on the drivers side. I was running a drivable before I took it apart. Once I put it on the frame rack and straightened everything out, I started putting it back together. To straighten it I removed the entire dash and unhooked everythng including the steering column. I think I have everything hooked up right, but I have a problem. The car will start and run for 5 seconds and then will just shut down. I think it has something to do with theft system. Does anyone know what the problem might be. By removing the column and rotating the wheel past its normal rotation, could I have broken an internal coil or something? Also, I don't have the plastic cover on that surrounds the column, but it doen't appear to have any sensor or ground or anything on it. Any help would be appreciated. I appologize for the non chevelle related post, but I like turning to my chevelle friends when I need any type of automotive help. Thanks!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
174 Posts
well make sure you have a fuel. I am betting you do. Have you tried calling a dealer or maybe a collision place?

------------------
OWNER OF 66 CHEVELLE MALIBU
Check out page dedicated to resto of my chevelle. still being made.
www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Shop/9801/
Team Chevelle # 424
Canadian Classics Chevelles and Beaumonts #393

Fav Quote: Second place is the first loser...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
115 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
I do have fuel because it starts every time. I don't think the problem is caused from the accident, because it ran and drove before I disassembled the dash. I haven't tried calling anyone yet, but I will probably run to the chevy dealership before too long. I was just curious if anyone knew something about a coil or something in the column that I don't know about. I am taking the dash apart again and inspecting all the wiring. I know it has to do with the anti theft. Like I said, it will start and run fine for about 5 seconds, then it is like turning the ignition off, it just shuts down. These newer cars are such pains to figure out. Thanks for the reply!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,973 Posts
Don't know about your application, but "most" new cars have a "collision" switch somewhere (normally in the rear area, trunk etc.) that must be reset after a collision. This shuts down the fuel pump to prevent large fires due to high fuel pressure on the FI cars. It is inertia driven. I also don't know if it would start at all with this disabled, but its worth a look.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
97 Posts
I work at a Gm dealer (non-chevy) and it sounds like a a problem with the ign key being read. I know that on many of our newer vehicles, you can't duplicate a key and have it work properly unless a proper procedure has been followed when inserting it into the ignition lock.

Have you switched keys and are not using the one you had been normally using??

Try this: turn the ignition to on for 10 minutes. Cycle the key off for 30 minutes. Then, repeat this procedure of on & off 2 more times. After all 3 cycles, try starting the engine and see it if stays running. If it does, you've relearned the memory from the key. I don't know if this system is used on your car or not, but it is on some of our Oldsmobiles.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,962 Posts
David, do the newer cars still have to have a reference signal from the distributor to keep them running? Most of the fuel injected cars I have dealt with in the past will shut off the pump if the ECM does not see the reference signal. That's why you hear the pump run for a few seconds and then shut off if you turn the key without cranking the engine. Once the engine is running or being started, then the ECM sees the reference signal and keeps the pump running. That particular wire could be severed or pulled out of a connector. I would need to see a wiring diagram to see the best place to start looking for the problem.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
115 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Well, I disassembled the dash again and made sure all the wiring was uncut and connected properly. Then I went and talked a chevrolet technician and he said that the problem is the theft system. He said the once the theft system is tripped in the computer, it will shut off both the ignition and fuel. He said that it will need to be reprogrammed. The puzzling thing is that the fuel will turn on and so will the ignition, but after 10 seconds it will shut down. He couldn't be sure if the theft system completely shuts the fuel and ignition down or if it is a delayed signal every time the car is started.

This particular car does not have the chip built into the key itself. I am using the original key, so I don't think that is the problem. I think I might have activated the theft protection when I disassembled the car, because I started unplugging wires before I unhooked the batery. I put the dash back together and I am going to have it reprogrammed. Thanks for the help! I did try reinitiating the key just in case, but no luck!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
106 Posts
Assumably your car has VATS Vehicle Anti Theft System on it. The key ahas a little resistor in it. Under the dash there are 2 little tiny wires one blk & one wht. They are the sens wires to the lock cylinder for the resistor in the key. Make sure they are plugged in. If they are, unplug the connector, use a jumper wire from each wire to one side of the resistor on the key, so that you are completing the circuit between the wht and the blk thru the key resistor. Have someone else use your spare key, and crank the car. Continue to jump the key until 30 secs have passed (if it will stay running) If it stays running, then the harness or connector in the Lock cylinder is broken.

HTH
 

·
Gold Founding Member
Joined
·
63,098 Posts
I'm wondering if maybe the fuel pump might be timing out. The fuel pump automatically times out and shuts off if the oil pressure sending unit does not complete the circuit in time.

When I had a problem with the chip in the ignition key, the engine would't even crank at all.

There is another Forum "Ask Chuck" (Powered by the Ultimate Bulletin board)
where you can get free advice also.
http://www.freeautoadvice.com/board/

------------------
Dean Call
Overland Park KS
Team Gold member #3
A.C.E.S. # 00235
N.C.O.A. # 4350

macc.chevelles.net
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
66 Posts
I know it has been a long time since this post, and hopefully you have figured out the problem...

I have to agree with Dean. I installed an electric fuel pump in my '70 Chevelle, and it would run consistently for about 5-7 seconds, and then stop. Each time, I could hear the fuel pump humming (before and after it was running). Turned out that the oil pressure safety switch was faulty. I don't even want to get into what I had to go through to find that out.... I thought that I had no oil pressure... but that is a different story...

Let us know what you find out. I know I am interested to hear what it was.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
722 Posts
Always recheck the last place work was done .Always unhook the battery before unpluging anything. More than likley it's related to the last repair . Check fuel pump pressure w/ a guage.It never hurts to hook up a scanner. After the basics have been checked. In older EFI GM products , whem I had a no start or cut out for no reason . I usually found a bad ECM.I never ran across a bad ECM that would "tell on itself " . If a wire shorted under the dash or " backfed" the ECM , which takes very little current to do , it could have shorted the ECM. Good luck, Jay
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
115 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Today I talked to the shop that did the straightening on the door jam area. They had the car up on the frame rack. He suggested that I check the oil pressure sending unit and wiring. He said that when they were doing the straightening they may have pulled the wire loose. I am going to check that out first before I take it in to have the computer reprogrammed for the theft system. If those two options fail, I am just going to take the car to the crusher!!! Just kidding, but these new cars do make me feel like that sometimes!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
27 Posts
try to start your car and look at the anti theft light afterit kills.If the anti theft light is flashing,leave the key in the on position untill the light quits flashing and goes out. the car should stay running. Be sure that you have the three wire connector at the key cylinder still plugged up.THis car probabley doesn't have a vats key but a resistor built in the lock cylinder. The system doesn't usually need to relearn unless you change the ignition switch,body module, or PCM. CHECK ALL YOUR CONNECTIONS AGAIN. Hope this helps.
 

·
Premium Member
1967 Chevelle Wagon
Joined
·
311 Posts
Hugh,
This car has a passlock theft deterent system. Anytime that the IP cluster,the ignition lock cylinder, or the ECM is disconnected, you have to "relearn" the system. This is usually done by just turning on the ignition key to the run position, and leaving it set for approx. 30 minutes until the theft light stops flashing. Then turn it off, and it should start and run O.K.

------------------
Dan Dolin
Dolin's Garage
ACES Member#603
67 Malibu Convertible
70 SS396
67 El Camino
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/downs/2849
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
115 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Ok guys, I tried both of the above tricks to relearn the system and I didn't have any luck. First, I turned the key to the on position. When I do this, the theft light comes on but does not flash. I left it in the on position for 45 minutes and then I started the car. (should I have turned it to the off position first before I started the car?) The car started, but just shut off after 10 seconds, like it has been doing.

Next, I tried starting the car right of way and then when it died, the theft light flashed. Once the flashing stopped, I started the car, but again it died. Is my procedure correct! It sounds like you guys know the solution to my problem, but I do not know if I am doing everything exactly right. Should I always switch the key to off before after the relearning period and then try starting it? Thanks again, Hugh
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
27 Posts
Hugh,I just changed a lock and key on a 98 Malibu.I cranked the car untill it started and died, when it died the theft light was flashing,it stopped flashing after about10 or 15 minutes.i then turned the key off, waited about 30 seconds and the car started.i looked in alldata at work this morning but they didn't give the procedure to relearn your cavalier.i am pretty sure this is the right procedure because i also did a Sunfire this same way.i may be mistaken but diconnecting the battery and pulling the dash doesn't usually require a relearn ,just if you changed a part with the system.if you don't get it going i may be able to send you some info on your system.let me [email protected]
 
1 - 16 of 16 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top