Team Chevelle banner
  • Hey everyone! Enter your ride HERE to be a part JULY's Ride of the Month Challenge!
1 - 18 of 18 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
54 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I bought this car recently and the starter has been getting noisier as time goes by. I realised something wasn't right when the grinding sound got bad and a friend noticed sparks coming from under the car so I took a look and found evidence of metallic particles around the starter gear and the flywheel ring gear looks chewed up. I'd appreciate any advice as to what is happening here (see photos).

I don't know much about the engine other than it's a 350 replacement motor that may be new or possibly high compression as it stops dead after failing to start.
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
54 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
So after a more educated look and following the above advice:-
- it doesn't have a brace on the back of the starter
- the correct bolts with knurled section are installed with no washers
- the bolts weren't torqued properly so I tightened them to 40lbs ft.
- there appears to be two shims already installed

However, the clearance between the armature shaft and ring gear teeth is nearly 1/4" so my question is will installing half shims make up the 1/8" discrepancy or should I look at a replacement unit?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,416 Posts
Remove the shims to get it closer first.
 

·
Boldly procrastrinating
66 El Camino 57 Chevy pickup 2004 Tahoe
Joined
·
29,318 Posts
it's already too close, see the second pic where the starter drive teeth are bottoming out in the flexpplate.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,416 Posts
Shim it until a 1/8 drill bit will slide in the mating surface of the starter gear drive point to flex plate hollow area.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
39 Posts
I may be wrong but is your flywheel installed incorrectly.. it appears your starter need to go deeper into bell housing and shims will not correct that. Flipping flywheel over will put cower to motor and allow better starter contact. I had a similar issue on a 1985 monte Carlo at work someone built with similar issues or the wrong fly wheel
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,445 Posts
Wrong snout, wrong starter, wrong flywheel or installed improperly.

You have a different problem than shims.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
39 Posts
So after a more educated look and following the above advice:-
- it doesn't have a brace on the back of the starter
- the correct bolts with knurled section are installed with no washers
- the bolts weren't torqued properly so I tightened them to 40lbs ft.
- there appears to be two shims already installed

However, the clearance between the armature shaft and ring gear teeth is nearly 1/4" so my question is will installing half shims make up the 1/8" discrepancy or should I look at a replacement unit?
bracket on back of starter is not needed none are used today starter bolts have shoulders then your good . You prob have the wrong fly wheel is what I am looking at the gap between engine and flywheel should be pretty close finger gap maybe.
 

·
Boldly procrastrinating
66 El Camino 57 Chevy pickup 2004 Tahoe
Joined
·
29,318 Posts
the flywheel is installed correctly with the mount pads for the converter on the back side.

the brace on the front of the starter was factory installed on these cars when new. recall that the General was not into installing unneeded parts.

need to check the knurl on the bolts. it should be half in the starter and half in the block, otherwise the they don't actually locate the starter.

check that the knurl on the bolts is not sloppy in the holes in the starter nose. Some of newer noses seem to be coming through with 10mm holes. chevy starter bolts will be loose in those, even if they're new and never used before. 10mm is .394, 3/8" is .375.

pull the starter and carefully inspect these parts yourself. post pics.
 

·
Boldly procrastrinating
66 El Camino 57 Chevy pickup 2004 Tahoe
Joined
·
29,318 Posts
and pull the shims, both of them and see how it does. sometimes inexperienced mechanics install those things when there's another issue because it's all they know.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
54 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Thanks again for all the help. Turns out the shims installed were way too thin and the bolts weren't torqued correctly. I've installed new shims (takes a while to find them here in the UK) and the clearances at the bendix shaft/ring gear teeth and top to bottom tooth gap are now correct. It took nearly a 1/4" of shims to achieve!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
820 Posts
Thanks again for all the help. Turns out the shims installed were way too thin and the bolts weren't torqued correctly. I've installed new shims (takes a while to find them here in the UK) and the clearances at the bendix shaft/ring gear teeth and top to bottom tooth gap are now correct. It took nearly a 1/4" of shims to achieve!
you need that starter brace on i kept chewing up starters until i put brace on :thumbsup:
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
4,739 Posts
I pulled a 4 year old high torque starter from a BBC (10:1 compression) due to grinding sound and discovered that the bolts were slightly bent where the threads start on the bolt.

These bolts came with the starter when new. (DB electric supplier)

I ordered an identical new DB Electric staggered bolt pattern starter and new Stainless Steel grade 8 bolts. But as mentioned in another post, the holes in the starter base are slightly larger than the 3/8 bolts and I suspect that I will have issues in the future unless I can shim the bolts with approx .010 tubular sleeves (if I can find them)
 

·
Boldly procrastrinating
66 El Camino 57 Chevy pickup 2004 Tahoe
Joined
·
29,318 Posts
those tubular sleeves are often installed in rebuilt alternators as a way of correcting the 10mm hole to 3/8".
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,136 Posts
A tip. For those of you who have starter issues and are faced with checking just how well your bendix drive is working and getting it's teeth meshed into the flywheel.

Instead of using a screwdriver to pry the bendix forward simply take the primary positive cables off the solenoid stud (With the Battery DISCONNECTED ) while leaving the purple start on its solenoid post. Carefully wrap the battery cables with electrical tape such that there is no danger that they will touch any metal and short the battery to ground. Then reconnect the battery cable at the battery end.

Now using a hand held remote starter button (Every auto parts store sells them ) connect one of the clip leads to the positive battery cable at the battery and the other clip lead to the start post on the solenoid. To do this you need not disconnect the purple "Start" wire from it's post.

With this setup you can now actuate the starter bendix without cranking the starter.

Sounds slightly complicated but once you have done this you'll realize that it only takes a few minutes and makes things like starter drive gear to flywheel depth checks a snap. Particularly so if you are laying on the floor under your car.
 
1 - 18 of 18 Posts
Top