[dwebb210]

An insurance adjustor sent me a sample of 110 octane racing fuel that came from the gas tank of a 1970 chevelle. The vehicle owner claims the fuel ruined his new $25,000 engine.

The insured claims he was allowed to fill his 1970 Chevelle with a tank of race fuel, but that it must have actually been kerosene because his engine is now toast.

The service station that sold the fuel acknowledges they sell kerosene out of the same storage tank in the winter, but claims the complaintant purchased the fuel prior to the change this year.

The adjustor feels the claim is bogus, because the chevelle was in very poor shape, and the engine appeared to be original.

I will be testing the fuel for kerosene content, and wondered if anyone was familiar with the intended formulation. Should there be any kerosene-like components which were added to increase octane?

This stuff is crystal clear, except for a slight blue tint. It doesn't smell like gasoline. It really doesn't smell like kerosene either. In fact, it doesn't have much of an odor at all.

The service stations in this area that sell race fuel have all stopped selling it for the year, so I can't obtain a sample for comparison.

Should 110 octane racing fuel look and smell just like regular unleaded?

Thanks,

Dave

 

[dave_silva]

The 110 we use is 76. It is a redish color, with different odor than regular fuel. It is hard to explain the smell, but go to any track of local track supplier where the fuel can be purchased. We use this all year in mutilpe race cars with regular engines with no major modifications and it works fine. We have ran a motor 30+ race days (oval track) and that is hell on a motor and they still run strong. I have used this also in my chevelle without any problems. It sounds like BS that the 110 cause the motor to blow. 110 has a lower flash point than regular fuel, and if anything i think his car would of ran richer casuing a lot of carbon and gas build up on the plugs.

just my $.02

Dave

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383 SBC 69 Chevelle 410HP/500Ft.lbs
Citrus Heights, CA
Team Chevelle Member #1070
http://www.x86Racing.com (Daves Pics)

 

[Byfield]

Dave,

Drive up to Cordova Dragway Park and get a sample there. It's just across the river from Clinton.

Here's the link in case you want the check hours or call beforehand (probably should to be sure thye have fuel on hand)

Link: Cordova

Kurt

 

[saulsss]

110 octane gas shouldn't hurt a thing, as a matter of fact that's a great rating to be running in our older engines.

As far a kerosene goes, it'll make the engine run crapy but niether fuels should destroy a motor.

 

[dwebb210]

I agree 100% that racing fuel should run good in an older engine, and shouldn't have caused problems other than maybe fouling the plugs. I also agree with the insurance adjuster that the guy is full of it as far as it blowing his new $25,000 engine.

I know it has been discussed here before (even in a thread I started) about adding diesel or kerosene to effectively increase octane. I know that some kerosene would not cause any significant distress, and if anything should help prevent an engine from "blowing" as it would reduce the flammability.

But this stuff blows me away. It doesn't really smell like gasoline. It certainly doesn't smell like kerosene. I've heard of a "blue race" or something similar with the word "blue" in it for a type of race gas, which by the color of this I assume it must be. So what is it really? A fuel with a bunch of xylene and blue dye? It smells a little like some xylene we have in the lab.

I can go to the service station up the street and get some kerosene. I can then compare chromatography peaks in the race gas to see if there is any kerosene in it. But as far as I know, there might be some by design.

My life would be easy if it tested negative for any kerosene. Problem solved. But I would still be wondering what this race fuel is, since it obviously isn't anything like the 87 octane I put in my daily driver.

 

[Byfield]

The service station should be able to provide you the the MSDS for the fuel. Wouldn't that indicate the chemical makeup of it?

 

[dwebb210]

I have checked MSDS sheets on similar things, and it seems they can get away with simply saying "contains petroleum distillates".

 

[dave_silva]

I have seen the purple fuel that is 118 octane and it leaves a serious discoloration in the pathways that it travels (carb, intake, heads). We run this type of fuel in a Modified with 13.5:1-14.5:1 compression SBC standard castings with a lot mods, but we have never had the gas blow the motor. I think they are scamming.

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383 SBC 69 Chevelle 410HP/500Ft.lbs
Citrus Heights, CA
Team Chevelle Member #1070
http://www.x86Racing.com (Daves Pics)

 

[Rich-L79]

And it would have to be one hell of a motor to be worth $25,000. I think that tidbit right there tells you the guys is full of it.

 

[66chevyIISS]

If you go to 76's webiste they explain there race gas and there formulas. By the way 100 octane is Blue and 110 is red.
I don't know how to do all the fancy links here so I am just gonna paste it:

Edit: The link was too long.
Go to http://www.76.com then click on product and services. Then click on racing fuel.

[This message has been edited by 66chevyIISS (edited 11-01-2001).]

 

[JYD71_454]

I wish I could add something to help with your question. If you discover that it is, in fact, gasoline I will be amazed. Amazed at the stupidity of some people. Not only trying to scam the insurance company out of enough money to buy a brand new NASCAR small block but dumb enough not to dump kerosene into the tank prior to calling their agent.

I hope they throw the book at these idiots. This is one of the reasons we pay so much for insurance...

 

[lucky3]

THe race gas they sell around here is called turbo blue and it has a kind of candy smell and its blue. I believe the octan rating is around 108.



------------------

lucky3
1968 Malibu
My 68 Malibu
Dale Earnhardt always

 

[dwebb210]

Sounds exactly like what this sample is. Almost sweet smelling. Tinge of gasoline smell. Slightly blue color.

A normal gasoline sample smells the place up with the lid on the bottle. This stuff could be sitting next to me with the lid off, and I'd never know it.

I'll pick up some kerosene tonight.

I won't get to the analysis for a few days because of other workload hogging the equipment. (28 oil samples for PCB analysis which take about an hour each to run)

 

[JWagner]

Of course, there is the "chain of evidence" to consider. How do we know that the fuel (if bad) was contaminated before he bought it? Did he screw up and add something to it after he got it. What bad stuff was in the containers he brought to the gas station ? Anyway, it sounds a bit weird. An analysis of the failed motor would be interesting, especially if a spun bearing is blamed on fuel octane.

 

[Guest]

Turbo Blue race fuel (110 octane) is blue in color. If it leaks onto the outside of the carb, it leaves green colored stains.

------------------
Malibumotorsports
79 Malibu, 414 ci BBC, 3550 lbs.
10.75 @ 125 mph, 1.49 60'

 

[Wooderson]

Kerosene is basically #1 Diesel fuel or Jet A fuel.

 

[67Sedan2dr]

I'm with JWagner,

I would like to see the analysis of what happened to the motor as well. Hmm...

-Nathan

 

[dwebb210]

That would be interesting.
I would like to see the engine too.

Funny though, we do all kinds of metallurgical work and failure analysis, but as far as I know, we have never evaluated an engine to determine cause of failure. We are qualified to do it, but the two largest race engine builders in this area have never came to us for help. I asked the owner of the shop that built my short block if he ever had a failure analysis done on an engine, or parts of an engine. He seemed to have the opinion that they could tell by themselves why an engine failed.
I have a feeling the vehicle owner doesn't really want anyone looking at the engine. Someone might discover it was the original motor, and has never been rebuilt.

 

[junglejimmie]

Also, there are fuel fragrances that make your fuel smell like all kinds of sweet stuff.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> From the Jegs Catalog

Neat For Street!
"Smells great and gets rid of that nauseous smell from your alcohol or gasoline fueled vehicle. Choose from 19 fragrances. With this many you'll have a hard time choosing which one you want. But at this price can get them all! One 4 ounce bottle treats 30-55 gallons of alcohol fuel or 20 gallons of gasoline. Works on non-catalytic-converter equipped vehicles"

Cherry Fuel Fragrance
Grape Fuel Fragrance
Super Charged Strawberry
Quick E.T. Chocolate
Super Sonic Cinnamon
Lemon Lightning
Radical Racin'Raspberry
Banana Blast
Victory Vanilla
Full Blown Bubble Gum
Rippin' Root Beer
Flyin' Hawaiian Fruit Punch
Peel Out Pina Colada
Wicked Watermelon
Rocket Cotton Candy
Atomic Apple
Light Em'Up Black Licorice
Burnout Blueberry
Turbo Tangerine
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

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"Laissez Le Bon Temp Rouler' Cha!"

Chevytalk Moderator
70SS396 & 70 Malibu
My Car
"I don't drive FAST, I just FLY low!"

[This message has been edited by junglejimmie (edited 11-02-2001).]

 

[Byfield]

Hey Dave,

Figure anything out on this fuel/engine issue yet?

Kurt