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I've been searching the site, but opinions ( & price ranges ) seem to vary. Morel seems to come up alot, as well as Isky Red Zones. I see some calling them Isky Dead Zones.

I've seen Howard's lifters for around $300 on Ebay, but some of the others seem to get into the $500 range.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BBC-CHEVY-454-RETRO-FIT-HYDRAULIC-ROLLER-CAM-LIFTERS-/380224218849?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item58872126e1

This is for my 496 project that will be 99.9% street driven, most likely never to see the track, and only a maximum of about 500-1000 miles per year. What have you guys used?
 

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I am building up a 496 right now and Mike Lewis recommended Morel's for my car which is a pretty mild street build. His recommendation was enough for me based on all the builds he does on here.
 

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Howards = Morels. What size camshaft are you running?
Just ordered a Howard's today, as a matter of fact!

235/241, .618/.618, 110 LSA.

The $300 Howards claim to be for street applications up to 6500rpm. Are they a cheaper version that Morel puts out? I see some Morel lifters at over $600....
 

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Sounds like u ordered the street series. Morel makes a few series street- race and private labels them. Ive have used that series on many engines without failure yet, but per Chris Straub/Morel anything over a 230 duration cam and longevity is in question...Robert @ Howards stated they havent had problems....so its debatable....if for a race app or street/strip id step it up, cheap insurance..
 

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The good Morels (600.00) were recommended to me too by Chris for my 489 with a similar sized cam and the springs necessary to control the valves.

I didn't want to worry about the lifters. Ever.
 

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Just ordered a Howard's today, as a matter of fact!

235/241, .618/.618, 110 LSA.

The $300 Howards claim to be for street applications up to 6500rpm. Are they a cheaper version that Morel puts out? I see some Morel lifters at over $600....

To much cam for that lifter!!!!!!!
 

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I've been searching the site, but opinions ( & price ranges ) seem to vary. Morel seems to come up alot, as well as Isky Red Zones. I see some calling them Isky Dead Zones.

I've seen Howard's lifters for around $300 on Ebay, but some of the others seem to get into the $500 range.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BBC-CHEVY-454-RETRO-FIT-HYDRAULIC-ROLLER-CAM-LIFTERS-/380224218849?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item58872126e1

This is for my 496 project that will be 99.9% street driven, most likely never to see the track, and only a maximum of about 500-1000 miles per year. What have you guys used?
That is an encapslulated lifter meaning the body of the lifter surrounds the lifter wheel. This means the wheel is .700" which is OEM. Fine for OEM cams and factory performance cams but aftermarket cams are designed using a .750" wheel.

Another thing. If I wanted to make more money I would sell the cheap lifters as there is more profit in them then the high dollar ones. Over all cost to the consumer is more but the profit for me is more on the cheaper ones. So if I wanted to just worry about lining my pockets I would just sell the cheap ones, but I don't I select the products best suited for the customers build. Now if this cam was say 218/228 at .050" then by all means use the lifter.
 

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Chris, why on earth would the manufactures/retailers not make it WELL known the design limitations of those lifters? Were talking engine-ruining consequences here.

Seems to me your the only one warning folks!
 

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That is an encapslulated lifter meaning the body of the lifter surrounds the lifter wheel. This means the wheel is .700" which is OEM. Fine for OEM cams and factory performance cams but aftermarket cams are designed using a .750" wheel.

Another thing. If I wanted to make more money I would sell the cheap lifters as there is more profit in them then the high dollar ones. Over all cost to the consumer is more but the profit for me is more on the cheaper ones. So if I wanted to just worry about lining my pockets I would just sell the cheap ones, but I don't I select the products best suited for the customers build. Now if this cam was say 218/228 at .050" then by all means use the lifter.
I agree...
The Howards lifters shown in that Ebay link is the same lifter I'm using in the mild 408 I just built using GM's 454/502HO cam...218/230 @ .050"
Any more cam than that and I'd have used something else.
I was thinking the street roller lifter limitation was well published...I've read about it on numerous others sites.
Used that info to guide my purchase.
 

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Chris, why on earth would the manufactures/retailers not make it WELL known the design limitations of those lifters? Were talking engine-ruining consequences here.

Seems to me your the only one warning folks!
Vince,
Morel has had tech seminars on this matter.
 

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Chris, why on earth would the manufactures/retailers not make it WELL known the design limitations of those lifters? Were talking engine-ruining consequences here.

Seems to me your the only one warning folks!
Vince it's because for these businesses it's risk verses reward. As stated they can make more profit on the cheaper lifter and not scare away customers with sticker shock. It easy to risk your motor for their reward and they know a lot of them will hang in there but it's up to each of us to assess the risk. I'm not calling them out or saying they're bad businesses, it's a simple business decission that's done all the time....Big O Tires house brand or Michelin's...you make the call....;)
 

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It isn't the duration numbers that dictate what lifters to use, is it? I thought it was lift, ramps, and mostly spring pressure that determine how high up the lifter quality ladder someone needs to climb.

If I'm interpreting Vinces' post correctly - why don't most manufacturers/vendors detail that such-n-such component is, or is not, suitable for a particular application. Like Comp's XE hydro line of cams for example - well known to make noise in BBC's, yet no mention of that anywhere on Comp's site.

Answer? Sales.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Thanks for all the great replies. Certainly frustrating that a product isn't being as truthful as they need to be with their advertising.
 

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I went with the 91161 lifters instead of the 91167, they are sturdier! I am running 150 seat and 400 open pressure on my 427. I've had it to 6200 RPM with no issues.
 

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Do the Comp Cams 854-16 have the larger wheel?
No. but Comp still suggests those & the 887s for all their HR cams.
no issues with the 887s on my cam.
 

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Thanks for all the great replies. Certainly frustrating that a product isn't being as truthful as they need to be with their advertising.

Dan,
The tech support that I and Wolfie and many others give to board is based on experience. If a customer comes to me then it is my job to solve his problems, not create them. We all have budgets and first and foremost they need to be set and from there the project can be built. If a customer doesn't need something I will tell them, but if they do need something then I will insist on it. Your case you need to do one of two things. Get smaller cam or get the better lifter.
 

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It isn't the duration numbers that dictate what lifters to use, is it? I thought it was lift, ramps, and mostly spring pressure that determine how high up the lifter quality ladder someone needs to climb.

If I'm interpreting Vinces' post correctly - why don't most manufacturers/vendors detail that such-n-such component is, or is not, suitable for a particular application. Like Comp's XE hydro line of cams for example - well known to make noise in BBC's, yet no mention of that anywhere on Comp's site.

Answer? Sales.
It's really more about how aggressive a lobe is. The highest load on the lifter is on the acceleration ramp and is dictated by how "fast" the lifter is being accelerated. On the nose of the lobe there can actually be zero load on the lifter. How do we control a more aggressive lobe and more rpm? Spring pressure. What's the hydraulic lifter's worst enemy? Spring pressure. We can't control the lifter on an aggressive lobe if the lifter collapses under the necessary spring pressure.
Part of what we need to understand is the manufacturing process. Hydraulic lifters were never intended for high performance (spring pressure and rpm) and in their intended application, a 12% bleed rate is perfectly acceptable. The bleed rate is controlled by the internal tolerances and clearance between the lifter body and internal piston. The tighter these clearances, the less the bleed rate. The bleed rate for the Morel high performance hyd. lifters is 3%. The problem is, it takes better machines, a lot of quality inspection and a lot of time to manufacture a hyd. lifter of this precision, and maintain these tolerances, and that adds cost. Mass produced hyd. lifters just can't be held to these tolerances and therefore won't tolerate the needed spring pressure to control more agressive lobes and increased rpm. IN the end, the price if the lifter is pretty much it's "advertizement" as far as what to expect performance wise. Many will also tell you what spring pressure they recommend. Look at the Edelbrock hyd. roller kits and the springs they recommend with them. That right there is a good indication of the ability of the lifter.
The information is out there, and then we have sites like thses. Isn't the internet great! ;)
 
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