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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I posted on SNS to but I'd figured I would share here too as it's a Malibu.

Matt sold his 200R4 Friday and we had to remove it to get the rest of the money.
While it (Malibu) was up in the Air on our lift we put my TH350 with the 8" treemaster in.
We used an aftermarket cross member which we had to tweak and the exhaust had to be contoured too to clear it.
After all of that we fired it up and checked the level then took it for a rip.

1st time he stabbed the throttle, tires screaming/smoking and looked to me and says "that was only 1/3 throttle" and a big :D on his face.

I will say the converter drives pretty dam good with 3.42's.
Ya get what you pay for I guess.
Was a good 1.5 days spent with my son and seeing him be proud of his ride is priceless!
He's never afraid to get his dirty and listen to advice I would give him.
Now it's heads and a cam for him ! (Chris S)
He "might" give the old man a run for his money when he's done!
 

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Nice!!! Gonna rip. He wont miss the OD?
 

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Sounds like you need some sticky mickies.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Nice!!! Gonna rip. He wont miss the OD?
Naw. We had very bad luck with the 200 and I'm not a big fan of them.
It was working fine and we worked the bugs out of it but it was just a basic rebuild and trying to tell a 19yr old that grew up in my nova to "take it easy on it" with a 406 was very hard. :D
I know there's people out there running quicker then me with them but I'd bet that most of them arre not stock and have a lot of $ in them to make them hopefully reliable and to me not worth the gamble when a 80e would take it in stock form.

He's got 2yrs left of college so he won't be driving it that much during that time so my 350 was the logical choice and the $ he got from the trans is going towards his heads.
He can beat on the th350 if he wants and I don't have to worry.
Between now and graduation he has a 80E core in the basement to have rebuilt if he chooses.
 

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Several friends tried using 200r4's in cars they bracket raced in the street on Wednesday nights, these were typically mid-12 second and ran 30-40 times a year, 200+ passes a season. Every single one switched them out for non-overdrive transmissions when they needed a rebuild. For a car that will see a lot of track time they don't seem to be a good fit.

I hope you and your son are able to try out his new combination soon.

Steve R
 

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I had a customer that wanted me to build a big block for his Chevelle, he informed me he would be changing his trans from a turbo 400 to a 200 at the same time, I told him I would'nt be interested in building the engine because I knew what would happen to the performance, back then every dyno test I performed the numbers were questioned through out the internet world. My customer agreed to keep the turbo 400 in the car with my engine along with my converter, I believe the car ran 3.73 gears. After racing the car with the Vortecro 496 and the turbo 400 along with my converter the car ran 10.67 in his Chevelle which was far from optimum on the setup. Next went in his beloved high dollar 200 along with the speced converter with no other changes, the car never saw the 10s ever again, but he able to run a little less RPM driving to the track in his now 11 sec car. As a side note this customer took the 496 out of his 200 equiped Chevelle put the engine in another Chevelle along with the turbo 400 along with my converter, the car then ran 10.2s at his altitude track. My point, if driving to the track at a lower RPM is more important than the car running 10s then your going to be happy, but your not going to have it both ways, cause you will not see any more 10s with that 400 over drive.
 

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Vortec Pro on the 200R what do you think it is the wide gear package of the 200R that is causing it to slow down too much drop between shifts? I presume the 200R is just as much a power hog as the T400.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Ok, I don't know how this got to me using an 80E in my nova and my son and I swapping transmissions.
What is it Mark, my pathetic little 406 won't/doesn't have enough power to do a 10.99 with the new heavier transmission?
To do an apples to apples comparison I'd have to put the 850 DP back on with a return style regulator.

I tried to see what it would do with FITECH a few weeks ago but the S clip that goes to the valve to the gear selector fell off into the pan and ended my day.
Then they cancelled TNT for the rest of the year.
I spent the rest of the day watching my son run mid 12's with a 2.0 60' as he was on street tires and had to go .5 throttle then floor it 30' out with his 200
My friend was there also running his GS with the 470/80E.
Which is easily 300+ # maybe more then my Nova
He was going 11.65's spinning the DR's and a 3k 12" converter.
1st time to the track for both of them.
1st time ever for my son.

All things considered, as I mentioned to you in someone else's thread, other then the +75 pounds, the gear ratio's are .04 less then the 350 and a converter with very similar stall and STR you still think it isn't possible to squeak a 10.99?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Vortec Pro on the 200R what do you think it is the wide gear package of the 200R that is causing it to slow down too much drop between shifts? I presume the 200R is just as much a power hog as the T400.
My take out of it the OD trans's are power hogs.
He didn't say how much it slowed up going to the 200. Was it a second. or .5 slower ?
Track conditions DA
 

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Vortec Pro on the 200R what do you think it is the wide gear package of the 200R that is causing it to slow down too much drop between shifts? I presume the 200R is just as much a power hog as the T400.
First you need to look at the converter.

1. Weight
2. Case design
3. TQ multiplication

The ATI treemaster converter is one of the few bad as _ converters a person can pick up a phone and order that really works, again its light weight, 18 LBS, the case design is right, and they multiply TQ like only a Munsinger would. You will never get some heavy lock up converter to work like a ATI. ATIs duplication is second to none.

I'm not an expert on 200R trans, but heres what I would look for:

1. Internal weight
2. Gear stack
3. Efficiency
4. No TV cables
 

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My take out of it the OD trans's are power hogs.
He didn't say how much it slowed up going to the 200. Was it a second. or .5 slower ?
Track conditions DA
It lost 4 tenths in better conditions, now racing at Atco will help your situation, in the spring Atco will be 3 tenths faster than 99 percent of the tracks across the US. Atco's big advantage is, when the baro goes over 29.92 observed its super charging the engine with out turning a power adder, the baro often gets over 30.20 or even 30.30 at times at Atco, spring will be your best bet. I believe the 400 will be slower than the 200R due to the weight, but I don't know for sure.


Conditions as of today @ Atco

temperature = 42.0 deg f
relative humidity = 53 %
uncorrected barometer* = 30.06 Hg
corrected barometer* = 30.16 Hg
density altitude = -1214.40 ft
View forecasted data
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I've never been to atco. Island and Englishtown are the closest tracks to me. Atco I think is 2hrs south of me.
English town is at 75' and Island is 575' so my son's and buddy's car could have went quicker at Englishtown ! :D :thumbsup:
 

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I've never been to atco. Island and Englishtown are the closest tracks to me. Atco I think is 2hrs south of me.
English town is at 75' and Island is 575' so my son's and buddy's car would have went quicker at Englishtown ! :D :thumbsup:
You asked if 10.99 was possible, I don't think so due to the 75 extra pounds which most of it is turning weight, that will be devastating. I hope you can run 10s, your testing will be very interesting. One thing for sure, you kids probably pretty happy right now, its hard to beat a turbo 350 with a ATI. I run a pretty nice T350 with the best ATI has to offer, A metric 200 is about .10 quicker in my car and thats due to one thing.....internal weight.

temperature = 47.0 deg f
relative humidity = 42 %
uncorrected barometer* = 30.06 Hg
corrected barometer* = 30.14 Hg
density altitude = -872.46 ft
View forecasted data
dew point = 26 deg f
saturation pressure = 0.324 Hg
vapor pressure = 0.136 Hg
grains = 19.8
air density (w/o water vapor) = 103%
air density (w water vapor) = 103%
Check out Pro-Calc to get
more frequently updated weather!
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)

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After racing the car with the Vortecro 496 and the turbo 400 along with my converter the car ran 10.67 in his Chevelle which was far from optimum on the setup. Next went in his beloved high dollar 200 along with the speced converter with no other changes, the car never saw the 10s ever again......
(sorry to hijack this thread)

Would this same phenomenon happen when comparing a TH400 to a 4L80E transmission?
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
(sorry to hijack this thread)

Would this same phenomenon happen when comparing a TH400 to a 4L80E transmission?
If you google it, it seems like it effects the really fast cars more then the slower cars. most of the time it's I lost et or it stayed the same.
Crap shoot I guess.

Mark what am I looking at the baro is only .47 from the 2 tracks today and the da is almost the same?
 

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If you google it, it seems like it effects the really fast cars more then the slower cars. most of the time it's I lost et or it stayed the same.
Crap shoot I guess.

Mark what am I looking at the baro is only .47 from the 2 tracks today and the da is almost the same?
30 HP + on the dyno, DA means very little compared to the baro. And thats with both tracks well below sea level conditions.
 
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