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Yep, this thing has strayed a bit. The orginal question was ethics/law? It seems that some folks felt that they could do whatever they want with THEIR cars. Maybe not, as local laws are still the law.It would be good if people actually checked on the local laws before they tried any radical parts swapping. It might be pretty easy to stay legal if the rules were known; it has been for me. Granted, some motor vehicle departments employ cranky doofuses that make it tough to find out what the rules are, but a few extra phone calls should get the info that we would need. In conclusion, if you are in compliance with the laws, then there is a pretty strong chance that you are being ethical, too.
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gandalf80:
Ahhhh, life is so much simpler when you drive a non #'s malibu


<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Boy, Chris, you've got that right! I thought this was all about having fun!




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MalibuJerry350
TC Member #1279
Original owner '70 Chevelle.
568,000+ miles on car.
Hey, if it's got wheels, DRIVE IT!
My Chevelle: http://hometown.aol.com/erie614/myhomepage/index.html
 

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you guys got that right. I've often wished I had been able to keep my original SS so that I would have a #s matching. But if I have to get that argry, defensive, anal... I'll keep my politically incorrect non numbers matching, not quite a clone chevelle.
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Professor_SS:
But if I have to get that argry, defensive, anal... I'll keep my politically incorrect non numbers matching, not quite a clone chevelle.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think we all figured out that you were angry and politically incorrect when you started hunting Christmas Elves


Sorry, but had to stray -really- off topic there for a second. If it helps, by 68 is numbers matching
 

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Well ya want to know what I think?

Too bad, I'm telling ya anyways


Original to me is just what it says, Original. The moment it's changed from factory, the originality goes out the window. Even if done by a dealer.

All the Restoration projects on our cars are just that, Restored. If you remove a piece of trim, then it's not original, it's just original parts. There's nothing like looking at factory because of the little differences from each year, each factory location, and sometimes from each week in that factory. The tolerances back then we're totally wacked by today's standards, and that IMO, is what makes a car Original.

Now taking a pile of rust, and keeping only the tags to put on another car is wrong to the hobby, and illegal in most states. But taking that same pile of rust and slipping all the parts necessary to make a new car under the tags, is perfectly acceptable, and it's called restored (as long as some of the original rust pile is kept in the glovebox
). I guess it's all how you explain what you did.

But this is more from a factory rat's perspective and not a restorer's
It dosen't matter how the cars get back on the road, as long as they get back.





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71-72 Malibu
"I'm high all right, but on the real stuff
High octane gasoline
A clean windshield
And a shoe shine"
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Byfield:
I think we all figured out that you were angry and politically incorrect when you started hunting Christmas Elves


<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Man, I'm still having nightmares about that..
Seems funny now, but at the time it wasn't. Man, what a strange year 01 was.

now back to the topic.. well almost.

What about these big time shops that completely rebuild these extremely rare cars. Often times they have to recreate parts for the cars. Ever see that my classic car show where he visited that restoration shop where they had maybe the last, or one of only 2 or 3 left cars and they had to sometimes resleeve (sp?) brake master cylinders. They even recreate sections of the body by hand shaping the metal. I guess they all have to be retitled as reconstructed. I guess that means there are no orginals left in some cases.

I had dinner with a co-worker last night, her huband is a state trooper and I brought up this thread up. He said that the only time he has ever heard of a MD car being numbers checked is when the car is part of a bust involving known car theives/chop shops, and it is only done to gather evidence to convict the criminals. I asked him about my Suburban and he laughed at the idea that it needed to be retitled as reconstructed. With my luck the FBI will show up tomorrow to pull the body off all my cars and trucks to check frame numbers because the guy ratted me out.


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70 and 72 Chevelle
ACES # 4051 MCC # 448
TC # 1549 81/70 Cruisers
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Professor_SS:
[B......They even recreate sections of the body by hand shaping the metal. I guess they all have to be retitled as reconstructed. I guess that means there are no orginals left in some cases.

[/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That would be a fair statement


Not about the new title (all depends if you have numbers to start with) but about there be no more originals, just original parts. Parts are only part of the car process. The other is the assembly.

But like I said, this is just the opinion of a guy that pounds flat sheets of composite metal into door & body panels - by hand.




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71-72 Malibu
"I'm high all right, but on the real stuff
High octane gasoline
A clean windshield
And a shoe shine"
 

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Restore:

1. To bring back into existance or use; reestablish - restore law and order
2. To bring back to an original condition - restore a building.

I think a good example of a "restored" car would be Rich's 65 L79 Malibu SS. I believe it started as a parts car, was rebuilt, got wrecked and "restored" to an original condition...not original, but an original condition. And a fine condition it is by the way.

To me anything else is really a modified (to change in form or character; alter) or custom (made to order). Some are just more modified or custom than others.



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Dale
TC Gold #92/ACES #1709
67 SS & 67 Elky
Dale's Place
Team 67
Integrity: If you have it, it doesn't matter - If you don't have it, it doesn't matter.
 

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Why go through the expense and labor to repair a "rustbucket" when it could be much more easily restored with a good body (from an SS, a Chevelle, or a Chevelle Malibu or a body available from the factory (Fisher Body) for that matter as indicated by Rainer) and with less labor involved as long as the donor body is not stolen and no illegal activity is going on. There are no physical differences between the bodies of an SS and non-SS body, only the added components of the car determine the type of classification of the car in question. A part is a part is a part... On just about every Chevelle out in the world now, something has been changed on it, unless of course a “factory-original” car was placed in storage somewhere and never changed one bit which BTW the probability of this happening is about nil. The numbers game sux and I believe that it hurts those that have real honest to goodness factory-built Chevelles, Malibus, and SSs the most in terms of devaluation of their cars. I’m referring to the fact that Chevelle Malibus and Chevelles are being converted to SSs when in fact they were not originally made that way in the factory. If one can use a body from non-SS or SS to replace their unusable (wrecked, rusted, etc) SS body or their non-SS body, no crime is committed and interpretation of the law will be justly determined if and when the time ever comes.

"Following the post below -- Links removed and enough said. Subject dropped!"


[This message has been edited by Super70 (edited 01-15-2002).]
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Beldarr:
Now taking a pile of rust, and keeping only the tags to put on another car is wrong to the hobby, and illegal in most states. But taking that same pile of rust and slipping all the parts necessary to make a new car under the tags, is perfectly acceptable, and it's called restored (as long as some of the original rust pile is kept in the glovebox
). I guess it's all how you explain what you did.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That was well put. Beldarr You never cease to amaze me.

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1970 Chevelle 454 Wagons haul A$$ in style! "The Chopped Suburban". to see some goto
www.EINSTYN.com FO_FDYFO = four-fifty four! TC#1460, VCEA#2
 

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I STILL say "rebodying" a rusted SS by putting it's tags on a malibu is just as bogus (if not more so) than putting SS trim on a malibu. Whether its a crime or not to rebody an SS car with a clean Non SS body isnt even an issue to me, i just know that if i bought a supposedly "true" SS car and later found out it was a malibu someone riveted SS tags onto because the original SS was a rustpile, i would be P*ssed, and would feel as though i now owned a fake SS. (maybe true SS tin tags, but not an SS CAR) Thats why the VIN is stamped in the body in several places... to show that it is the ORIGINAL body. If you put a trim tag and vin plate from an SS on a malibu its a fake SS... you wont convince me otherwise.
 
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