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Discussion Starter #1
I rebuilt my whole ac system about 3 yrs ago with r12 and the system worked great. I am in the process of rebuilding my motor and painting my frame/firewall and will not use r12 this time the price is way to high. My question is for the ac guru's out there I have been told by several people to NOT use the poa valve setup with r134. I was told to use the later 73 and on orface tube style hose. This means I would have to cut my hose have a serviceable orface tube installed then connect the hose where the poa valve used to be is this correct? Or should I use the poa valve setup and just install r134, of course with new oil, evap, and system fully flushed.
 

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Can't answer your question, but from what I hear the R134 is considerably less efficient than the R12, maybe 25 %. Might check some local gas stations or AC shops and see if they will recover the R12 and refill when you get done. Might be cheaper in the long run. Sometimes they won't fool with it because they're afraid it may have some replacement crap in it, even though you know it doesn't. Worth a try. tom
 

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Hey Steve, Tom is correct! Go have a shop empty your system of R12 and have them hold it for you until you're finished with your project. R12 is too expensive to just let it go free into the air, plus it's illegal!
I don't buy into any of that crap about it hurting the ozone, but that's another story.

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Nick P.
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I just converted my wife's 90 olds to 134a
about 2 months ago it still works great. you don't have to flush the system, you just have to get at leas 50% of the old oil out of the systemI'm not sure about the 72 0n back cars. I havent checked into those yet, but I know they can be done.
eventually we will all have to do this sometime if we want a/c

Jeff

[This message has been edited by JSL (edited 08-20-99).]
 

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Discussion Starter #5
The r12 is already out of the system. My compressor had a leak in the front seal. I have since returned it and have a new one ready to go on but when I went to evac the system I had already lost most of my freon.
 

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Steven
There are some pretty knowledgable A/C gurus at www.aircondition.com They have a BB and lots of opinions. BTW-I just had my 72 changed over - all original type stuff- and while it is not as cool as the r-12 it does keep me cool at 100 degrees.

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Rick Schaefer
72 El Camino
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TEAM CHEVELLE #00038
 

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THERE IS a drop in replacement for R12. I don't know what all the names are that it goes by, but my uncle's garage use a refrighrant called FREEZE-12. He says all you have to do is just evacuate the R12 and put in the FREEZE-12. It's compatable with the oil and much cheaper than R-12. You might look into it. I'm staying with R-12 in all my cars as long as is practically possible.

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i have gone to airconditon.com for answers to my a/c questions, and they provided good advice. I was questioning converting to R134 in my 65 too. They told me to stay with the R12 because the conversion will not produce really cool temps.
There is supposed to be a poa valve calibrated for R134 available from classic auto air down in florida, but I think you might have to change the hose fittings to the more modern connectors if you have the type of hoses that have the worm clamps on them....
 

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Steve,
There is a new freon called freeze 12 for about 8 bucks a can works great on older a/c systems, can get it if you cant. This is not like fr12 that is flamble and is compatable with r12 systems. Let me know if you need any more help.

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Discussion Starter #10
Thanks for the info. I will check into freeze 12. I just dont want to do this again is my system and completely taken apart, and have all the new pieces and want to install what will work best for our old classics.
 

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you can pick up the conversion kit for 134a now at wal-mart believe it or not, you may try it since it's soooo cheap and if it doesn't work then have a shop do the rest. just my 2cents
 

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To all those interested; There is NO DROP IN REPLACEMENT FOR R-12, ALL THE SO-CALLED DROP-INS HAVE BUTANE OR PROPANE AS THE MAIN INGREDIENT. They are acceptable to the EPA because they supposedly don't harm the atmosphere. Use R-12 or convert to R-134a. WithR 134a you use 80% of the amount of system capacity and you gety 60% of the cooling. If that is what you want, go for it.

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Leo Paugh
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The Elky has 134a in it. Except for the fact that the blower system lacks puff-power, good cold stuff comes out the vents. Also my '92 F-150 Work Truck, and my dads '91 both got converted, and except for mine is dark red (and Texas Sun is BRUTAL!), it works well.
Still, I know nothing about the earlier models :-(

Dave H.

[This message has been edited by 81ElCamino (edited 08-21-99).]
 

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There is an A/C shop about three blocks from my house called Texas Compressor Exchange. I'll ask him about the 134 conversion and get back to you guys. I have a 71 that I'm getting ready to convert and I need to know about the POA valve as well.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I do have a friend who is a mechanic and will buy the r-12 for me. He has all the gauges and tools to help me complete the job. What do you guys think should I stay r-12 since I have a source for purchase or convert to r-134? I am also keeping in mind I live in tx and its been in the 100's forvever now and my car is also a convertable thats as you know AIR tight when going down the road. thanks
 

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Well, the fact there is no replacement for r12 some say, the freeze 12 has no butane or propane included. The 134a works well, but at idle it warms up. It works best in constant duty type compressors. The 134a also requires high pressure switch replacement and some cars require (on cycle type compressors) to adjust the cycle presures due to 134a runs at higher presures. We have been doing these change overs for about 5yrs. The internet has some good sights on all freons pros and cons most of the low buget 134a change overs work fine but we have found they last only a year or so due to for example: buttle rubber hoses absorb r12 oil for years and no amount of flushing will remove it from the rubber and it not compatable with 134a ester base oils causing corrosive chemical reaction to aluminum when these are mixed. Due to the price of components for our chevelles I would think twice about 134a and If I went with it dont take the short cuts.

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