[kettbo]

Gents,

do not confuse this with the PHR "BUDGET 468" thread that ran from Jan-Mar of this year.........

I went and opened my trap last fall. I told a pal who'd bought a 454HO I could make a nice healthy yet street-mannered 454 for about half the cost of his $5000 crate engine. I had some parts lying around, some favors due me, etc. No deviation from the components I have gathered.

Friendly grudge race this fall
Opponent 1968 SS Elky w/454HO/th400/3.31 posi
My ride 1970 Elky w/462"/th350/3.42 gears

REMEMBER, this will be my DAILY DRIVER even with the BBC

I have some 1968 101 cc closed chamber oval port heads. Though on the shelf for several years, they were pro-prepared w/3 angle valve job and healthy springs by Cope Bros in Tacoma. I'll be running a 40-over 2-bolt block and small dome Hyper-E pistons. CR should be 10.3:1. I'll run HD trk rods fitted with ARP rod bolts on a virgin std/std cast crank. This so far is comperable to the LS-5 engine in Chevelles and Elkys in 1970.

On top will be a Performer RPM A-G intake and improved 3310 Holley instead of an iron intake and a Q-jet. I have some new 1 3/4" primary tube headers. Under the car is a new 2.5" FlowMaster pipe kit fitted with MagnaFlow mufflers. Reference the other thread on 360 horse hyd cam with vintage hi-compression engines and excessive cyl pressure....I know a healthy cam with 230 deg dur @ .050" lift will be very happy. Something in this range will work well with the Perf RPM intake too.

OK, now for the variables:
Summit's House Brand K1302 has .540/.540" lift, 228/238 deg [email protected]" lift, 114 LSA. $79 with lifters. This appears to be the same cam GMPP sells, daily high perf driving, mild bracket, except GMPP wants about $180 for cam and lifters. GMPP literature says the grinding is done by Crane Cams.

Does anybody run these cams? Any reports on power and drivability? After I get some answers on this, feel free to throw me other cam suggestions on cams say .545" lift and smaller, performance data/ETs appreciated.

In closing, I could go hog-wild just to smoke my friend's Elky but the reality is that I must have manners, drivability, and some sort of mpg as I drive the Elky a lot.

 

[mr 4 speed]

George,we ran the 228/238 Summit cam in 454..read here:

http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=143288&highlight=budget+454

the 1980 Malibu we put this into ran a 13.43 @ 102 MPH with a Performer intake and a 2.25" exhaust so there is more ET/MPH with a swap to an RPM and a better exhaust.Car has 3.42 gears and a 2400 B+M convertor

Also,we just installed a 238/248 in a 8 to 1 454:
http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171688&highlight=budget+454

 

[Keith Tedford]

We took a $700 '74 454, added an Energizer 272 cam, Chevy rectangular port intake, 750 3310 Holley, and headers. With no special tuning the '69 Chevelle went 102.4 mph through 3.55 gears. 13.6s with 2.2-2.4 second 60 foot times translates into 13.2-13.3 with traction. Not killer but not bad for a $1000 investment. One nice thing about mild cams is that they don't need any special valvetrain pieces and won't be any problem breaking in. The engine also runs fine on regular gas and that's another plus for budget minded people. The potential is there without breaking the bank.

 

[kettbo]

Chris and Keith,

Thank you for the nice responses! Yes, staying mild means I ca re-use parts from the stockpile! I have a set of long-slot rockers and 3/8 guide plates from a neighbor, another guy threw in some spare 3/8 pushrods as part of another trade. I traded some old long-tube Vette BBC headers and a bare shell of a scattershield (stuff lying around the garage for years) plus small cash for a 454. My 30-over block and a set of 781s goes to Darryl so he can run his stash of 30-over 427 pistons and 427 crank assortment (combo like this in my 68 Vette)....I'm getting the 40-over block (not used since boring) and new small-domed Hyper-Es w/rings. My original 454 cast crank is toast, 20/20 with some wear on two rod journals......bought the low-mile std/std 454 cast crank last weekend for $50. I bought the headers 6 months ago, new but mildly rusty, $80...Blackjack 1 3/4" primaries.

The old 1968 oval port closed chamber Vette heads have been on the shelf about 4 years. I've had the 3310 since 1991 when I bought the Vette. The Perf RPM Air Gap is from a friend who likes low-buck projects. The HEI I'll upgrade came with the initial 454 deal above and I got some decent shape vintage CalCustom finned valve covers.

It'll make an accountant from Arthur Anderson (ref ENRON scandal) blush when I come up with the bottom line costs here. Proves once again some very important points:
1. any parts you ever remove MUST be kept for future use
2. help your friends with parts and your labor, what goes around, comes around
3. Patience is the watchword for deals on Craigslist! Generally people with C-L ads live close by so you can view the item/s first plus pick them up. Some people will meet you half-way up here in the NW part of the country!

I'll be packing 10.3:1 with the 101cc chambers and the small-dome Hyper-E.
Up quite a bit from the 1980 Malibu with roughly 9:1 CR you described Chris. Also have the larger 2.5" pipes. I believe the Perf RPM is better-suited to the 228/238 cam than you used. Certainly you'll agree that with traction, I should be in the very,very low 13 second category once I dial the car in. I'll be running 3.42 gears also.
I do not think I'll be running U/L Regular any time soon!!!!!

Thank you gents, your messages give me lots of hope!

George

Greater Tacoma, WA

 

[ddeennis]

maybe i can help.

3310 holley modified
rpm intake
390 cc heads ported myself 2.19/1.88 valves
compression 10.5
delta regrind cam hyd 233/239 @ .050 w/.551 lift 1.72 roller tips
headers from summit, 2 1/2" pipe full boar mufflers with 2 1/4" tail pipes
2.73 gears
2500 stall th350

87 octane fuel all day!!!!!

3900 lbs car

13.50 at 107 plus mph

pay attention to the mph this works out to be about 373 hp to the ground.

with a better stall 2800+ and gears. this would be an easy 12.80 car in street trim.

this was on stock tires with a 2.10 60 ft time.

one big difference this was a 396 bbc

so a 454 in same trim should be faster yet.

i did put this same trim into a 454, cam, heads, intake everything i just upped the cubic inches. all went in the same car

did feel a lot stronger and ran harder by the seat of the pants.......but i have no time slips to prove it.

delta cams , regrinds cams for 67 bucks to the front door of my house. i then buy lifters local.

 

[kettbo]

Gee,

Another low-buck Rat kicking butt! And you said this was in a 396! When you do get timeslips on the 454 version, please advise!
Seems the extra compression was good for overcoming that 2.7 gear. The 107 mph is encouraging too.....the writing is on the wall for much better numbers with the 454.

I appreciate the info! First up, swap my 2.56 posi for 3.42 and new 3-series posi. After that, I'll ge to all the pre-assembly tasks....

George

 

[69-CHVL]

Better watch them 454HO's!

I ran an un-tuned 107.5 mph in my 69 w/3.31's, 28" tires and no stall. A little gear, and some tuning 110 mph was within reach.

 

[kettbo]

I met Ben for lunch today. He's the guy with the 454HO in his 68 SS Elky. He has long Hemi-turbo mufflers on it....sounded pretty tame but sweet. Did not linger/check his timing, etc. Quick look at the cars then to lunch. Ben was also spying out my 70 Elky that I'll put the budget 454 into. He cares little for my wheels......

I'm encouraged with your 107 mph runs followed by 110 mph runs 69-CHVL. Ben, ya reading this? Sounds like your combo! He just switched to 3.31s.
He offered up a deal on his 3.07 take-out gearset....sure beats the 2.56 set I have. Already have the 3-series posi and master rebuild kit. I noted some of the fellas and their low-buck cars MPH-ing in the very low 100 range. Then we have ddennis running 107s with 2.73s!!!!! YIKES, from a 396!

Earlier in the thread or in private notes to Ben (can't recall and too lazy to research this) I told Ben in no way, shape, or form was I considering this a done deal.... I'm forced to keep within my rules of "street" as this is my daily driver! If I was just out to smack him down, this would be pretty easy. To make a competitive engine, having good manners, on a very limited budget...that is the challenge. I do like cruising this Elky so I may forgo the planned 3.42 and get the 3.07s from Ben, after all, BUDGET is my watchword! I am thinking with my greater compression, the few extra inches from the overbore, and the better port velocity of oval port compared to rectangular port....I should be making much more AVERAGE TORQUE though our PEAK TORQUE numbers will be similiar. Will sleep on 3.07s vs 3.42 gears.

What do you guys have to say?

 

[mr 4 speed]

Better watch them 454HO's!

I ran an un-tuned 107.5 mph in my 69 w/3.31's, 28" tires and no stall. A little gear, and some tuning 110 mph was within reach.

if you had an auto your MPH would have been less than 107.5

 

[69-CHVL]

But I don't, so there

 

[dreis454]

But I don't, so there

AAAAhahahahaha! you sure told HIM!

Mr4speed should hafta change his name, 'cause none of his cars are 4 speeds!
'cept maybe you could consider the GN as one:noway:

 

[mr 4 speed]

AAAAhahahahaha! you sure told HIM!

Mr4speed should hafta change his name, 'cause none of his cars are 4 speeds!
'cept maybe you could consider the GN as one:noway:

I always make sure I buy/sell at least one 4 speed car a year

we do have a 69 GS400 4 speed convertible in storage...
I had four 4 speed cars when I joined TC 8 years ago..

Vince,when you going to the track?

 

[69-CHVL]

Chris,

Maybe mid-summer. Wanna make sure everything is OK an no issues. Little more tweaking needs to be done hear and there.

 

[flink69SS]

George- It sounds like your going to end up with a very similar engine to mine.
there are a couple little differences but nothing too bad. This motor pushed a '68 12.04 @ 114mph with 3.89's and street slicks. I put this motor on the dyno last month and it put 394hp/ 429lbs tq. to the rear wheel. Here is exactly what I've got:

It's a Mark IV 468 with: Steel Crank, stock rods with ARP bolts, Keith Black Hypereutectic domed pistons @10.25:1 comp,Comp 1.7 Pro Magnum Roller Rockers, Comp Hydrolic Roller Cam232/232 @.050/ 578 lift, Comp Pro Magnum Hydrolic Roller Lifters. The heads are heavily Ported 702's, 99cc's with 2.19/1.88" Manley Valves, comp springs and Titanium Retainers. Wieand Team G Intake with a Quick Fuel 850 DP, HEI ignition and Hooker Comp. Headers with 1 7/8 pipes and a 3 1/2 collector.

DO NOT LET BEN WIN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[kettbo]

Vince,

Was your 107 mph HO stock or did it have the huge cam and Aluminum heads?

Frank,

Nice combo......you have more $$$ in valvetrain than I have in cash purchases so far in upgrades for my Elky. I saw your car last year at Smokey Point. I'll have very small dome KB hyper-e. Gotta link with Darryl get the parts, then get busy.

 

[flink69SS]

George- My point was that with a streetable cam and factory oval port heads you could do well...:yes:

 

[69-CHVL]

Vince,

Was your 107 mph HO stock or did it have the huge cam and Aluminum heads?

All stock baby, 8:75:1 and all. It was a nice motor, too bad it burned mucho oil.

 

[Mr Chevelle]

Gents,

do not confuse this with the PHR "BUDGET 468" thread that ran from Jan-Mar of this year.........

I went and opened my trap last fall. I told a pal who'd bought a 454HO I could make a nice healthy yet street-mannered 454 for about half the cost of his $5000 crate engine. I had some parts lying around, some favors due me, etc. No deviation from the components I have gathered.

What price range do you consider a budget build?

I did a budget BB last year that ran 8.044/85.53 1/8 mile with more left on the table (poor 60'). That should convert to about 12.50 1/4 mile. I hope to be knocking 11's door with tuning and better 60'.

 

[mr 4 speed]

What price range do you consider a budget build?

I did a budget BB last year that ran 8.044/85.53 1/8 mile with more left on the table (poor 60'). That should convert to about 12.50 1/4 mile. I hope to be knocking 11's door with tuning and better 60'.

Me personally less than 2K for a big block is a budget build

 

[kettbo]

Vince 107mph is pretty darn good for a stock 454HO.

Frank, acknowledged! Oval port heads w/hyd flat tappet make good street engines.

Forgot who but one similiar thread, a fella actually said that if in doubt, run the smaller of the cam choices! Good advice.

Pat, my defination of budget is "minimal outlay of cash"
Here is the estimate:
Bought 454 w/781 heads for $300 of old parts (Vette headers I could not use and a bare scattershield I had lying around). The 454 came with vintage CalCustom finned aluminum valve covers, HEI base, hd trk rods and a tired 20/20 crank. Bore 30-over in good shape.

Bought std/std cast crank for $50
Re-using 3310 Holley
Re-using HEI from the 454
Re-using the #063 closed chamber oval port heads I took off RatVette 3 years ago w/2000 miles on them.
trading 30-0ver block and 781s to a pal fr a freshly-bored 40-over block that comes with small domed Hyper-E slugs and rings
Sold 2nd pair of 781s for $100
Given 3/8 pushrods and H-stamped long slot rockers
Good deeds netted me a Perf RPM Air Gap intake

to buy
bearings and gaskets $150
believe the block needs cam bearings and service $100
Rod bolts and rod service $120
Balance $120???????? $200
Timing set $60
Cam and lifters SUMMIT $80
Some new but previously-owned headers, Blackjacks, $80.

Nice to have parts! Out of pocket expences $550$600$650?
Used value on trades and stuff off the shelf have me at under $2000 if I had to buy everything. Thinking bare minimum power on this is 450 horse,500 ft lbs torque. 454HO is over $5000 these days.....