[snippy256]

When I brought this car in the garage, only three of the body mounts were actually present and had bolts holding the body to the frame. Others were missing completely, or missing the bolt. The rear-most mount on the drivers side was tweaked up about 1/2", but it was hard to tell if it was body, frame, or both. Under the premise that a good frame is the foundation of a good build, I braced the cabin with 1x1 and pulled the body off. AS it turns out, the frame was actually pretty good, and a little persuasion on that rear corner, and the frame was level and square. I carefully installed a Hellwig FX frame kit welding it in over the course of three days. Lay a bead or two, wait, repeat. Come out at 1:00am when you cant sleep and lay a bead and wait. You get the picture. I was careful. The frame stayed straight, square, and level. Once I knew I had a good frame foundation, a sandblast and rust coating, I rolled the frame back under the car. Imagine my surprise, dismay, shock, horror, etc. when I say the 1.5" gap under the #1 Drivers side body mount. The body is sitting flush on all of the other mounts. View attachment 726886 View attachment 726886

An aside - While the frame was out and just for giggles I laid my new floor pan down on it with the body mounts and everything was perfect, so I know this is not a frame issue. SO the question becomes what to do? This is a little beyond what I planned for, but I know anything is fixable. I'd like to hear your thoughts.

Another aside - I have just about every piece of new sheet metal for this car - Trunk pan, floor pan with inners, firewall, complete lower cowl, and cowl end caps and hinge panels, quarter panels, and rear tailight section. I'm not sure how this problem will be resolved just yet, but I can tell you that the new floor pan sitting flat on the shiny clean frame is giving me some radical ideas. Thanks for reading, and as always your responses are welcome.and appreciated.

 

[snippy256]

For some reason,pics did not post correctly. Likely user error

 

[chevyman0429]

Wow that a lot are u sure something is not laying between frame and body keeping it from sitting flat? How did the doors line up ?

 

[67_LS1]

I too would be curious about the door fitment. I‘ve seen dimensioned drawings for frames and There must be equivalent dimensioned drawings for bodies. Body shops would need them to pull bodies back into square. I’d track the appropriate one for your car down and break out the tape measure.

 

[SFD]

Set up a line laser as a datum line and use the frame drawings, pull the dimensions and check the frame for twist. If it’s not that it’s the body.

 

[Bonkerman]

I would suggest you have a frame shop check the frame to confirm it is straight before you do anything. After that is confirmed maybe remove all the bracing you put in and see if the body settles. You may have braced it while it was in a twisted position. Confirm the frame first. It won't cost much.

 

[snippy256]

I too would be curious about the door fitment. I‘ve seen dimensioned drawings for frames and There must be equivalent dimensioned drawings for bodies. Body shops would need them to pull bodies back into square. I’d track the appropriate one for your car down and break out the tape measure.

Thats the really strange part is the door lined up reasonably well. It's hard to understand how that's possible and I'm going to see if I can find some older pics.

 

[snippy256]

I would suggest you have a frame shop check the frame to confirm it is straight before you do anything. After that is confirmed maybe remove all the bracing you put in and see if the body settles. You may have braced it while it was in a twisted position. Confirm the frame first. It won't cost much.

That makes sense, and your right - it's not expensive. I can tell you that I checked the frame myself across all body mounts for level and diagonally for squareness. I also checked heights from a known datum, and was within 3/16" on all dimensions. Add to that having laid in the new floor pan on top of the frame where it sat flat, and I was convinced the frame was ok. But I suppose it's probably not that easy which is why they have frame shops. Good advice Also, removing the bracing is also an excellent idea - I think I was too shocked to even consider it. Thanks for the suggestion. For the sake of conversation, let's assume that 1) The frame is straight and level, and 2) Removing the bracing addresses some, but not all of the twist. How does one go about making this right? I'm tempted to start laying the new trunk and floor pans on the frame and building the car up from there. Ugghhhh I hope I don't have to go there. Really appreciate the advice and suggestions - Thanks

 

[snippy256]

Wow that a lot are u sure something is not laying between frame and body keeping it from sitting flat? How did the doors line up ?

I wish. It seems to be a section about 24" from the door pillar back thats tweaked up. Funny thing is the door fit reasonably well. Not perfect by any stretch, but it closed and latched. Of course, this car was 1/2 bondo and 1/2 iron oxide, so anything is possible

 

[Bronze68]

Having worked on numerous Chevelle frames in assorted conditions, I highly recommend you download a copy of the factory frame dimensions and take it to a GOOD shop. Spending that money to know you are starting with a good foundation is paramount.

Diamond shape or bent horns are not uncommon on a non-molested frame that’s never been in an accident. Factory frame fabrication/assembly/welding was hit and miss in terms of dimensional correctness.

 

[snippy256]

Frame goes to the frame shop later this week. Fingers crossed, but I'm not sure if I'm hoping the frame is straight, or the body is crooked. Neither frame or body bent is good news. But, this hobby is not for the faint of heart or faint of wallet. I'll post when I know the result. Thanks for all the input.

 

[drivejunk]

My knee-jerk response is that theres something in the way of the body sitting down completely. Theory 2 is the body took a hit on the right rear.

Looking at the side view of the A pillar, I am suspicious wondering hows the length compare at that mount point.

I've done bodywork for awhile and think you'd be hard pressed to come up with any published body dimensions for a body-on-frame vehicle. If lucky, there will be such for modern unibody rides but with very few reference points. Comparative measuring, one side of the body vs the other, confirmed by panel fit, is the approach to take. Trouble is, it may require some experience to interpret the results and plan the correction. That'd be tough for us who can't touch and look at.

There are good points in the other posts. Like the bracing thing. Laying a new pan over the frame... yeah. But that doesn't indicate theres no height problems. Assume nothing, measure everything carefully using common sense, see what you find. The trouble could be a stack of small things, or one larger error thats just not obvious. Once a frame is satisfactorily confirmed, I start at the rockers and work my way up. There are such things as major factory side-to-side rocker mismatches with beautiful gaps but those workers could try twenty new doors on if one didn't fit. If one did, out went the car and here you sit trying to unravel a mystery.

Good luck and good help to you.

 

[rpol78]

The two center body mounts are different than the rest since they have clearance for the "protruding nut" on the center body brace. Have you checked that all of the other mounts are snug (i.e. body to mount and mount to frame)?

Also it looks like you're using the solid mounts, correct?

 

[snippy256]

The two center body mounts are different than the rest since they have clearance for the "protruding nut" on the center body brace. Have you checked that all of the other mounts are snug (i.e. body to mount and mount to frame)?

Also it looks like you're using the solid mounts, correct?

I am using the solid mounts recommended by Hellwig. I'm not sure I'm following you in the "protruding nut", but there are several different mounts in the kit I bought - I'm quite sure I've got them in the correct locations. In any event, I need to re-check to make absolutely sure there's nothing underneath preventing the body from coming down to rest correctly. And hopefully by this time next week I'll have a verdict on the frame.

 

[Alwhite00]

I second the right rear hit. Bolt the cowl down and see what the rear looks like.

 

[snippy256]

I second the right rear hit. Bolt the cowl down and see what the rear looks like.

That theory is making sense - before work began, the right rear mount was pulled up and away from the frame about 1". And recall that only three of the body mounts were actually bolted in. Currently both rear mounts are flush on the frame.

 

[Alwhite00]

That theory is making sense - before work began, the right rear mount was pulled up and away from the frame about 1". And recall that only three of the body mounts were actually bolted in. Currently both rear mounts are flush on the frame.

Throw a level across the cowl mounts and then the rear mounts. I'll bet you find the problem. This would obviously be with the body off the frame.

 

[snippy256]

Thanks all - I'll be back on the car day after tomorrow. I'll let you know what I find. Great suggestions. Thanks again.

 

[msmith1.wa]

Also a straight edge front to back on the frame rails and if possible the body.

Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

 

[rpol78]

I am using the solid mounts recommended by Hellwig. I'm not sure I'm following you in the "protruding nut", but there are several different mounts in the kit I bought - I'm quite sure I've got them in the correct locations. In any event, I need to re-check to make absolutely sure there's nothing underneath preventing the body from coming down to rest correctly. And hopefully by this time next week I'll have a verdict on the frame.

I have ABC Performance solid mounts and if you look at the picture the two circled go in the mount position by the front seats. The nut that the bolt goes into protrudes below the mounting surface so the mounts have a larger hole partially cut in them to allow this. The others are flat across the top like the mount below the one circled on the left side of the picture.

If the mounts are all in the correct locations, I'd set the car on jack stands and start measuring from the floor up. You may have gotten some warpage when you welded in the Hellwig kit. I know we had to watch that on my frame since we welded in the inner structures from an El Camino frame to my Malibu frame.