489 Build Thread

12711 Views 55 Replies 14 Participants Last post by Blownchevelle68, Jul 13, 2013

Blownchevelle68

Discussion Starter · Jun 12, 2013

4

I'll be starting my 489 build Thursday morning and wanted a place to document the process and also to hopefully have some advise from members (ahhmm ahhmm Wolf, Straub, Carl

) as I know I will get stuck on some of this.

I've built several engines over the years but until I started researching alot here, learned there were somethings I should have been doing and others that I was.

Combo:

454 2 bolt main block-ARP main studs, ARP head studs, bored .030, torque plate honed, align honed, BHJ decked, cleaned, magged, etc.

Scat 4340 4.25 stroke crank, Scat H beam 6.385 rods and SRP -18.0 forged pistons, floating with Mahle file fit rings, Clevite H series bearings.

B&B (Stefs) 91488 oil pan and pickup, Romac balancer, Straub hydraulic roller 247/250 @.050 .631/.603 on 107, Morel 6403, AFR 290's, Air gap intake.

Block and rotating assembly just came back last night from machine shop. I washed the block and crank with soapy water, blew all the passages out, wiped down as much as I could with paper towels, then sprayed it all down with WD40 and wrapped in plastic.

At the machine shop they balanced the rotating assembly and mocked up the assembly. Rod clearance is .026-.027 and mains are .003 as of now. Here is what the shop recommended for the rest:

Torque rods to 62lbs (ARP bolts)
Torque main studs to 110 lbs (ARP)
Crank end play Min .005 and max of .012
Min rod bolt clearance to pan rail and inside block .050
Torque head studs to 70 lbs (they recommended silicone for threads into heads and gave me their assembly lube for the bolt/washer/nut on studs)
Bolt heads on with no gaskets, slowly turn over to see if any interference on piston dome and chamber
Install cam, degree and clay pistons-min .100 valve to piston clearance
Check coil bind on heads-min .050
Oil ring rails min .015
Top ring file to .019
2nd ring file to .021

So engine guru's.....Does this look right so far?

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El Guapo

· #2 · Jun 12, 2013

I was thinking similarly about such a combo. My 454 block is standard, and the thought of cutting it .060 right from the get go dont jibe. If it already was .030, then yeah. I know, cubic inches and all. The crank had a rod go bad, and it scored the crank pretty bad. By the time I found a new/good one or even fixed that one, I could have a new 1/4 stroker crank (like you have mentioned). I will be following your thread!

Dan Orgill

· #3 · Jun 12, 2013

Sounds like you know what you're doing!

OLDED

· #4 · Jun 12, 2013

Sounds a lot like my deal below - bolt er up and let her rip! You will be very happy with that combo, hope all the driveline is upgraded to match and you have a good tire source.
Good luck, Ed

Tom Mobley

· #5 · Jun 12, 2013

don't torque the studs into the block. you're just bottoming the threads in that case, the block will be cracked. yes on the RTV or other sealer in the block threads for the heads. you don't need .050 between the rods and block, .035 will do.

Blownchevelle68

Discussion Starter · #6 · Jun 12, 2013

Tom Mobley said:
don't torque the studs into the block. you're just bottoming the threads in that case, the block will be cracked. yes on the RTV or other sealer in the block threads for the heads. you don't need .050 between the rods and block, .035 will do.

Thanks Tom-when I brought the block home it had the studs already in the mains. When I loosened the nut the studs seemed just a little more than hand tight..So when I reinstall them, just snug the studs up and torque the nuts-Right?

GuysMonteSS

· #7 · Jun 12, 2013

If you dont have a stretch gauge for the rod bolts and use a torque wrench,IIRC ARP recommends "Burnishing" the rod bolts 4 or 5 times before the final torque is done.
Maybe someone else can confirm this ???
Guy

Blownchevelle68

Discussion Starter · #8 · Jun 12, 2013

GuysMonteSS said:
If you dont have a stretch gauge for the rod bolts and use a torque wrench,IIRC ARP recommends "Burnishing" the rod bolts 4 or 5 times before the final torque is done.
Maybe someone else can confirm this ???
Guy

I wish I had a stretch gauge, would love to learn how to do it that way. I figured I would do like you say and cycle the rod bolts a few times before going with final torque value.

Blownchevelle68

Discussion Starter · #9 · Jun 12, 2013

So in checking end play, I've read a couple different ways to do it-What I plan is to put the bearings in, torque all except the rear main, leaving it hand tight. Then pry crank forward and tighten down rear main. Measure endplay at this point while all are torqued to spec. Is that correct ???

Blownchevelle68

Discussion Starter · #10 · Jun 15, 2013

10

After getting the block and crank washed up, I re-installed the main studs and installed the cam.

Installed the Clevite H series bearings next, then the Scat 4.250 crank.

Checking crank end play was easier than I thought. After torqing the main caps down to 110 lbs, if then used a large screwdriver and pried the crank back, then forward again. While holding forward, I torqued the rear main down to 110 lbs.

On my initial end play check, I forced the crank backwards and zero'd the dial indicator. The pried forward and only had a reading of .002. Knowing that I needed to be .005, I loosened the rear main cap, placed a board covered with a towel against the rear crank flange and smacked it 6-7 times forward. Then while prying forward, set the rear main to spec again. This time around we got .007 crank end play.

(Note-Picked up this magnetic dial indicator base from Harbor Freight for $20)

Then I moved on to filing the Mahle rings. (Note Hi-tech ring squaring tool

Then finally I installed the first piston assembly in the #7 bore. Slowly turned the crank over and the rod is hitting the bottom of the bore....I was thinking the machine shop would have taken care of this but they didn't.

How hard is it to clearance this block even after the cylinders are finished honed? Any tips or tricks? I know that I need .050 clearance but do I also need to chamfer the area as well, so It does not create score marks on piston walls?

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sschevellefan

· #11 · Jun 15, 2013

Ive heard the H beam rods usually have more clearance but it should always be checked. Im in the middle of a 498 build myself and my machine shop doesnt want to finish hone the block till we mock up the crank and rods and make any clearances. Now, Im not a machinist but I dont see what the difference is if the cylinder is already honed. The piston will never be that low in the bore so I dont see why. You will want to re clean everything including even removing the cam bearings. The grinding dust will find its way everywhere and with the bearings in there you cant be 100% sure its all been cleaned out.

badrad

· #12 · Jun 15, 2013

In the picture it looks like your rod is installed backwards. The flat edges go towards each other and the bevel goes towards the crank. I had 5 of mine on the pistons backwards before I realised what I had done, spiral locks are hard to get out without a tool.

CNC BLOCKS N/E

· #13 · Jun 15, 2013

Blownchevelle68 said:
So engine guru's.....Does this look right so far?

If your using a Felpro gasket make sure you drill the required holes in the decks as there are 2 missing holes per side.

The machine shop should have picked up on this.

Looks like a nice build.

Also did the shop check the lifter bores for wear as I have seen many times on BBC need to be sleeved back to std. or just go to a .904 lifter 95% of the time.

Blownchevelle68

Discussion Starter · #14 · Jun 15, 2013

CNC BLOCKS N/E said:
If your using a Felpro gasket make sure you drill the required holes in the decks as there are 2 missing holes per side.

The machine shop should have picked up on this.

Looks like a nice build.

Also did the shop check the lifter bores for wear as I have seen many times on BBC need to be sleeved back to std. or just go to a .904 lifter 95% of the time.

Thanks Carl-I'm using Detroit Graphite head gaskets, wonder if I need to do anything for them???

I believe they honed the lifter bores ? I did not check with them on that. What would be the process for me to check them myself?

Blownchevelle68

Discussion Starter · #15 · Jun 15, 2013

badrad said:
In the picture it looks like your rod is installed backwards. The flat edges go towards each other and the bevel goes towards the crank. I had 5 of mine on the pistons backwards before I realised what I had done, spiral locks are hard to get out without a tool.

Good catch!! Yes they are installed backwards, I had them oriented the correct way initially but flipped it over to see if there was any difference at all, which there wasn't.

This morning with a set of fresh eyes, I went out and checked the clearance on the #2 cylinder at the bottom bore against the crank throw-have at least .060 clearance which should be good.

I also rechecked the rod that is hitting (installed on #7 and hits on the #8 bottom bore area) and it will pass once it hits, with just a little effort. It appears that since the #8 rod assembly is not installed that it slides over more to the center and does not clear the bottom of the bore, where there is a small notch area. Not sure if the notch is enough but will install #8 and see how it works out this afternoon.

badrad

· #16 · Jun 15, 2013

Good to know about the bore clearance, I have a 454 block I'm considering for a 496 and it has the scallops at the bottom. Now I'm thinking it will take a little clearancing.

CNC BLOCKS N/E

· #17 · Jun 15, 2013

Blownchevelle68 said:
Thanks Carl-I'm using Detroit Graphite head gaskets, wonder if I need to do anything for them???

I believe they honed the lifter bores ? I did not check with them on that. What would be the process for me to check them myself?

Don't know much about the Detroit gaskets. But if your using AFR heads I would guess they want the Felpro performance gasket. The Felpro gasket offer better cooling properties over stock gaskets.

Blownchevelle68

Discussion Starter · #18 · Jun 15, 2013

badrad said:
Good to know about the bore clearance, I have a 454 block I'm considering for a 496 and it has the scallops at the bottom. Now I'm thinking it will take a little clearancing.

I'll end up measuring each bore and counterweight area, along with rod clearance and post here as well-I would think that .060 (there is even a little more but stopped there) would be enough for crank throws.

CNC BLOCKS N/E said:
Don't know much about the Detroit gaskets. But if your using AFR heads I would guess they want the Felpro performance gasket. The Felpro gasket offer better cooling properties over stock gaskets.

Yeah these were recommended by Straub as a great gasket that I guess were just recently brought back into production, I'll double check with him on the extra cooling holes.

Edit:: They will hold up to 15.1 compression and work with Alum or steel heads and no retorquing after initial, researching a little here. Still not sure on the extra cooling holes if needed with them or not.

forcd ind

· #19 · Jun 15, 2013

lookin good-I would have done the rings before installing the crank, eliminates dirt falling down on the crank, just ck everything one last time for anything foreign

Blownchevelle68

Discussion Starter · #20 · Jun 15, 2013

forcd ind said:
lookin good-I would have done the rings before installing the crank, eliminates dirt falling down on the crank, just ck everything one last time for anything foreign

That is a good idea! I'm using the How To Rebuild Big Block Chevy book and they routed me that direction of throwing the crank in beforehand.

I have been wiping the journals down often and when filing I wipe down the rings as well before placing them in the cylinder.

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