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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Greetings and Hope everyone had a great Christmas !

I just purchased GM zz502 Deluxe crate engine 508hp/580trq and will be installed in my 67 Chevelle Malibu the next month or two.

My question is the auto transmission and what is recommend ?

The shop is suggesting 700r4 with 2700-3000 torque converter.

Now the current is a SBC 350 w/ TH350 3 speed AT. this will be removed and sold next week.
I asked several questions in the forums back in September when I first purchased the car and appreciate all the assistance !

The 700r4 is a 4 speed with overdrive and I my Chevelle has 10bolt w/ 3.73 but currently houses the TH350 3 speed...how much is involved with this upgrade from 3 speed to 4 speed AT ?

Concerned with the cost, reliability, and parts needed to swap from 3 speed to 4 speed ? note " i know that shop will steer me correctly, but just doing some research since I am not familiar.

Will I have to change the steering column also ?

I had a meeting with the reputable shop that is going to do the work, discussed the plan and confident with their work since they do High End $200K cars and restorations + our local premier circle track sales shop and builder..

Thanks in advance !

Greg
 

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Turbo 400


-Period correct transmission
-Can handle the torque of a BBC
-Simple swap from existing turbo 350------move crossmember and change yoke on driveshaft
-Gearing (2.48/1.48/1) works well with 3.73 spirited performance driven BBC
 
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FWIW,a good friend of mine runs 9.5-10.00 ET @ 135-138 MPH with a 700+ HP 496 with nothing more than a TH350,been using it for years. 3600 lb. 1965 Chevelle.
My LS6 Chevelle runs 11's and I have nothing more than a stock TH400 that was freshened up 15 years ago.And that is when I started racing it.

I would NOT put a 700r4 behind anything that makes any kind of strong torque/HP

Sounds like that shop is spendy...and a 700r4 is a poor recommendation IMHO and experience.
Keep it simple and you'll be happier in the long run.
Even if you never go race the car,I wanted to illustrate how well a TH350 and TH400 hold up racing- meaning it will live a long,long life on the street.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Curious why you do not recommend the 700r4 ?

While I wont be running the strip, I will bust some tires now and then...

Still not clear why or the difference ? what about durability and issues ?

Have not problem going to a TH400, but why since what I read the 700r4 handles the higher torq better..
 

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The 700r4 not a performance transmission. period.Not matter how well its built. good for small block cruiser IMHO and experience.
I would get a TH400 if you want something real strong.
A 700r4 does not "handle the higher torque better" :noway:
 

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A 200-4R will bolt right in using same driveshaft and just have to move the crossmember back about 6 inches.

My $0.02 - that is what I would recommend.
 
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If you're just the street warrior, I wouldnt hesitate to go with a 700R4. Call Greg @ Phoenix Trans, I have sold hundreds of his transmissions and plenty were his built 700R4 for cars with more power than you have there, never had an issue. I've run his TH400 fully built for the last 6 years and its never missed a beat. I did a swap for a buddys 66 GT0 installing a custom 502ci I built and Gregs 4L80E, man was it tight! Great transmission and getting the fitment right with new engine mounts was a task, but once it was all said and done and you didnt have to try to fit your hands in there to get to the bell housing bolts it was just fine lol

GM Transmissions ? Phoenix Transmission Products

Part #PT700R4SX
 

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If it were me starting from scratch though, I would go with a TH400 with a gear vendors....this is in my future as I have the bullet proof TH400 now.
 

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Being realistic, a th400 is the correct choice. Unless you plan some serious cross country driving for a couple extra mpg it's a no brainer. The th400 is easily the strongest big block friendly transmission on the market. An overdrive just doesn't make much sense in this build. Again..... Unless you are seriously considering an abundant amount of cross country driving. The gear spread on the 700r4 is for an anemic small block with no torque.
 

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TH400 if not a lot of Hwy cruzin

2004R for Hwy & city

The 2004R has a better Gear Ratio split than the 700R4
and can be made stronger
 

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As was mentioned if your going 3 speed the 400.
If you want OD. The 4L80E.
I'm doing this swap as we speak with a rebuilt trans and a custom 9.5 triple disc 5C Circle D converter.
IMO the best of both worlds.
My buddy drove his GS with the 80E to the track with me trying to follow him towing my car.
I gave up when he was doing 80+
He ran mid 11's and did 80 home.
This is with 3.42's
It does get pricey but to ME it's well worth it.
I wouldn't waste my time with the 200.
My son's 406 ate the first one.
The second one made it to the track and worked ok but he selling it and putting the cash a side for rebuilding the 80E core I got for him.
 

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As was mentioned if your going 3 speed the 400.
If you want OD. The 4L80E.
I'm doing this swap as we speak with a rebuilt trans and a custom 9.5 triple disc 5C Circle D converter.
IMO the best of both worlds.
My buddy drove his GS with the 80E to the track with me trying to follow him towing my car.
I gave up when he was doing 80+
He ran mid 11's and did 80 home.
This is with 3.42's
It does get pricey but to ME it's well worth it.
I wouldn't waste my time with the 200.
My son's 406 ate the first one.
The second one made it to the track and worked ok but he selling it and putting the cash a side for rebuilding the 80E core I got for him.
Are you going to a 4L80E in your 406 Nova?
 

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What do you think your car will run with that combination?
Don't know. We'll find out in the spring.
Ratio's are only .04 different and converter can be locked in 3rd at WOT if needed.
The converter is "supposed" to be very close in stall and the way it hits to my treemaster with great efficiency on the top end .
So hopefully the 60's should be very close.
I'm going to check/change my valve springs also this winter. They have been in there for 4.5 years now with countless beatings.
If you asking do I think it will be quicker with the 80E?
I would think it could be the same or maybe .1 or 2 slower.
Which would be fine for me.
There's a lot info out there where it either remained the same or was a tiny bit faster.
Time will tell.
I know it's heavier then the 350 but as my car sits with only the driveshaft and the exhaust from X pipe back to be installed yet , it sitting an easy 1.5" higher in the front!
I tried bouncing it and it seems to settle the same.
 

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-Your least expensive and most reliable option is the TH400 and it fits in the stock 66/67 tunnel.

-I don't know about the 200r4 but regarding the 700r4; it is a great trans behind a stock 502 with 3:73's. I ran one (street/strip) for a few years and it pushed my 66 to 11.50's @ 115. It can and will hold that power but needs to be modified to do so which will drive up cost but the bonus is OD and simplicity of a non-electronic trans. The 1st to 2nd gear spread is a non-issue with that 502 torque and as a bonus, the steep 1st gear with 3:73's effectively make the rear end ratio the equivalent of a 4:56 (compared to a 2.5:1 fist gear trans) which make for some wicked holeshots. I started out with a 2400 stall with mechanical lockup and ended up with 3500 stall with no lockup as I went more strip than street...shorten driveshaft ~3", relocate trans crossmember (simple), it will need a kickdown cable and the tunnel modified to clearance, what I think they call, the 4th gear servo.

Your 10 bolt should hold up fine on the street.

Steering column is fine but be careful, some headers fit better than others in headers in that area.
 

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Dale, how much did it cost to be modified?
I'm at 350 for the core, 1000 for the rebuild,1200 for the converter( would have been 900 for the single) 300 for used controller, 275 for the cross-member (could be home made but I'm lazy) and 250 for the driveshaft work with new joints. $3375
So yeah it's pricey but some stuff can be done cheaper IE xmember/converter and that $ put towards the controller and if the trans is a "known" to be good just thrown in not rebuilt.
I wasn't going to roll the dice.
Plus the ratios are close as it the same as the 400
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Monk,

What you explained is exactly what the shop told me as well...the plus is OD with the added bonus of the lower 1/2 gearing. I live in Iowa so to go to some car shows will require hitting the highway and that was the thinking on my part.

I am concerned about cost since i have a specific budget, but the caveat is I want it done right the first time, smart with the ability for upgrades/improvements as money permits.

The TH400 really sounds like a better option all the way around plus no change to linkage or steering column.


Yes, the headers are a concern and something that is going to be addressed next week.
 
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