Tired of having 700 R4s fail behind my BB should I do the 4L80E or gearvenders TH400. - Chevelle Tech
2002 General Tech questions from 2002

 
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post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 3:51 PM Thread Starter
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Rob
 
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My 66 CHevelle seems to be eating 700 R4's. I have had 3 of them in it and the last one the best tranny place around did but it seems to be breaking them. I have almost 1000 to 2000 miles on the last tranny rebuild with a Trans Go shift kit and Corvette servo and govenor. It also has a 2400 rpm stall.

My engine is a 454, 9.5:1, 781 oval ports fully ported and polished. Comp cams XE 274, Edelbrock Air Gap intake, 870 Holley Street avenger, MSD billet distributor and 6AL box, 1 7/8" headmen, to 2 1/2" Flowmasters. 3.55 gears pushing 255/60 15s.

Does my engine combo eclipse the 450 hp/ 450 torque on the 700 R4?

Do I need to bite the bullet and go 4L80E, or spend $3,400 on a TH 400 with a gearvenders unit on it?

What to do?

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1966 Chevelle Malibu Sandalwood, Gold color
454, .30 over, 770 Holley, Edelbrock RPM Air Gap, 781 oval ports,
700 R4 transmission
12" disks up front and hope to have disks in the rear soon.

13.575 @ 100.22 mph. Second run ever.
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post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 4:52 PM
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Considered a switch pitch 400 and 3.31 or 3.08 gears?

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post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 6:06 PM
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I have one in my chevelle and camaro, the camaro runs low 11's and mine runs low 12's. We have hundreds of passes on both cars plus several thousand street miles and they have held up just fine for two years now. We got them from bowtie overdrive. Also, the camaro dyno'd at 425rwhp, not sure what the crank HP is. It appears that there are ways to make them hold up.

Lee

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post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 6:56 PM Thread Starter
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I have read that the 700 can be built to handle close to 700 hp. But that the cost of getting it there is prohibitive. I'm not sure the local places can grasp the torque put on it, but there is so little drive time and it was just shifting flawlessly. Then like it is jumping out of gear but it is slipping. The TV cable is still in the same position, the tranny has not been hot. It has only made one pas down the track over a month ago.

I know I can get a low mile 4L80E from aa salvage yard for under $1000, then the TCI controler is $800 roughly. Are there other trans controlers out there?

I read about having a tcu from a 90's diesel truck that has a stand alone controller and having a chip burned for it.

Should I just skip the overdrive and let it suck 10 mpg or less? And let it rev higher than 2200 doing 65-75?

What does a car with a TH 400 rev at doing 65-70 with 3.55:1 gears and 255/60 or so tires?

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1966 Chevelle Malibu Sandalwood, Gold color
454, .30 over, 770 Holley, Edelbrock RPM Air Gap, 781 oval ports,
700 R4 transmission
12" disks up front and hope to have disks in the rear soon.

13.575 @ 100.22 mph. Second run ever.
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post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 7:40 PM
 
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You would be at about 3000 rpm at about 65 mph. a good site to find stuff like that out is www.ring-pinion.com
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post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 7:53 PM
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If fuel mileage is a concern, figure how much you'll drive the car and how long it would take in fuel savings to pay for the overdrive.

Some say the 2004R holds up better under torque. I know Wes Colby has one behind his 502 (which now has nearly 800 horsepower with the blower). I'm curious to see how long the 200 holds up behind that mill.

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post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 8:00 PM
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If you have the $$$ why not go for the Turbo 400 and GV? Should solve your problem,plus you get od in all forward gears. My .02

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post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 9:36 PM
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Forget the 700R4, not many will live for a long time in a high torque application. They are not too fond of 6,500+ rpm either. The 700R4 has several design issues, some of which are worsened when using a lock up torque converter. I only know of one guy who has reliably made it into the mid 11's with a 700R4 (not a big block), and he rebuilds his every few hundred runs. EVERYONE, and I mean EVERYONE else that I know just blows them up.

Thanks to the dedicated (some would say rabid) Buick Grand National Turbo enthusiasts a good, but often overlooked, overdrive trans can be built. Notice I said built, because in stock form the 200 4R trans is perhaps a bit weaker than a stock 700R4 - but fortunately the 200 4R does not suffer from the design issues of the 700R4.

Check out http://members.rogers.com/roguevette/ he is using the same trans (minus the trans brake), built by the same guy, that I am putting behind my supercharged big block. And since he runs 9.7's at 142 mph, I'm pretty sure you would have great reliability in your far milder combo.

Thomas

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post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 9:57 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Whittaker:


What does a car with a TH 400 rev at doing 65-70 with 3.55:1 gears and 255/60 or so tires?

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

With 265/60 on the rear,(28.5 inch diameter if memory serves correct) turbo 400 and 3:42 gears, I am just shy of 3000 at 65 mph. I would think with your combo you would be a bit higher.

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post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 10:28 PM
 
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I have 600+ torque and 600+ HP going through my 2004R from Performance Transmission.
http://www.ptsnctb.com/



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post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 24th, 02, 10:29 PM
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I have a PROSTREET 65 chevelle with a BB and a 700R4 running a 9" rear with 456 gears and M/T 18.5x29x15 tires it has about 650HP.The 700R4 has had the hardened shafts and corvet servo installed it is a non lockup with a 3000 stall conv it is a 1991 year model.Anything before 89 was junk and anything after 92 was comp controled.I run at the local drags with Hoosier 18.5x30x15 slicks and run consistant 10s and have not had any problems with the tranny.It has been in the car for 2 years.My tranny guy told me up front that I needed to get the 89-91 model so I would not have any problem.So you may want to check what year core your tranny is.

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post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 25th, 02, 8:05 AM Thread Starter
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My core is the correct year. The tranny before this was not and it was replace for free by the tranny shop. The warrantied it all the last two times. But my 6 months are up. They first replaced a valve body and then built a whole different tranny, the best year core. I know the valve bodies are different between years. They had offered to do a TH400 in its place.

No I don't really have the money for any of it. But if I have to spend it once is better than putting another 700R4 in it and having it fail in less than 2000 miles.

If I bought a 4L80E fron a salvage yard, a low mile one, and put a shift kit in it and bought the TCI controller, and most likely a 2500-300 rpm stall I can do that cheaper than the GV and TH400.

cjlandry, Chad you are probably right that I really don't hit the highway enough to totally justify the cost.

I would like to make some cross country trips in it, and it is why I have focussed on drivability. The 12" discs, the Hotchkis suspension, polygraphite suspension, huge radiator, AC, PB, PS, cruise.

I regularly drive it 250 miles and hit the Interstate on shorter trips. Also Chevelle-abration t\drive of 900 miles round trip each June.

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1966 Chevelle Malibu Sandalwood, Gold color
454, .30 over, 770 Holley, Edelbrock RPM Air Gap, 781 oval ports,
700 R4 transmission
12" disks up front and hope to have disks in the rear soon.

13.575 @ 100.22 mph. Second run ever.
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post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 25th, 02, 9:42 PM Thread Starter
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https://www.chevelles.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/003509.html

Bump, and my local sho says it may be too much torque and HP but the 4L80 E also requires a lot of up dates and costs about $1,700 or more to rebuild on top of a core and the TCU.

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1966 Chevelle Malibu Sandalwood, Gold color
454, .30 over, 770 Holley, Edelbrock RPM Air Gap, 781 oval ports,
700 R4 transmission
12" disks up front and hope to have disks in the rear soon.

13.575 @ 100.22 mph. Second run ever.
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post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 26th, 02, 6:04 PM
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IMO,go with a TH400 and B&M 11" or TCI 11"..I have about 10,000 miles/2 years on my local tranny shop rebuild TH400/2400 B&M Holeshot,and its been down the track quite a few times with drag radials..tranny is nothing special,just a stock rebuild.TH400's are one tough unit,and where designed to be behind big blocks.I guess I'm just cheap and old fashioned

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post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old Nov 27th, 02, 12:12 AM Thread Starter
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I would love a TH 400 and since I have a core it would be cool, but no overdrive.

Gotta run on the highway at 80-85.

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1966 Chevelle Malibu Sandalwood, Gold color
454, .30 over, 870 Holley, Edelbrock RPM Air Gap, 781 oval ports,
700 R4 transmission
12" disks up front and hope to have disks in the rear soon and a 9 inch with 3.70s.

13.575 @ 100.22 mph. Second run ever.
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