Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle - Chevelle Tech
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post #1 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 8:05 AM Thread Starter
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Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

Folks, put Superior axles in the 12 bolts years back, maybe near 18 yrs. Found the wheel studs on pass side axle all loose in their bores last week a the track. Drivers side fine. ( i did have a loose wheel incident a few years ago, and cant fathom how a few hundred yards of easy driving could do that but. there it is)

Anyway, do I replace axles as a "wear" item after 18 years? Or simply replace the loose studs? The flanges are also drilled for 1/2" screw in studs, but assume that would mean different nuts etc?

So studs or two new axles? I'll know in a while but think I only painted a white stripe on my stock axles, not the replacements. Hope i did , will make the choice easy.

What do the expert proctologists recommend? TIA.

Gene
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post #2 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 8:32 AM
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

I am no expert, but if it were mine, I would pull the axles and check the bearing surface for wear. This wear would determine if they need replaced. If it looks ok and the stud holes are not extremely ruined, I would just weld the studs to the flange on the back side.
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post #3 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 8:47 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

and I just did. No extreme wear at bearings surfaces. the oil seal may be weeping a bit. splines look mint. Wish I painted a stripe onto them, but if I had, I'm sure it'd be laser straight.

Bores measure .445 so should be able to simply R&R the studs. Trick may be finding non-Chinese metal.


NOW, I can go to work! as I know what to order.

THNX Bill.
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post #4 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 9:27 AM
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

If new studs fit in the holes tight then that's great. If not then I would use the holes for the screw in studs and get studs to fit them. You should never weld on any part of an axle. It's heat treatable steel and the metal will get brittle around the weld.
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post #5 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 10:15 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

I was hoping you would pipe in Freddie. Thank you.

The Strange stock replacements ( 1.5") have a .472 knurl and I'm measuring .445. They may not be impact gun seatable is all. I'll call the local auto machine shop; they may even have some in stock. And definitely have a big arbor press!

These old Superior axles actually look mint.

PS, one of my buds said weld them to the flanges. When I mentioned it to my kid, the millwright wannabe, he said no way. Could distort the flange. The kid is becoming a pro!
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Last edited by 427L88; Jun 23rd, 20 at 10:32 AM.
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post #6 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 10:53 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

Freedie,one more thing. the bores are @ .450" and the smallest knurls I see are .472". 28 thou press fit????? seems way excessive.

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Last edited by 427L88; Jun 23rd, 20 at 11:20 AM.
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post #7 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 11:03 AM
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

Look at the Moser stock replacement axles. They are like $270 a set.

Ray

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post #8 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 11:31 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

If I cant find studs @ .460 max knurl I may have to.

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post #9 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 11:45 AM
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

Quote:
Originally Posted by 427L88 View Post
Freedie,one more thing. the bores are @ .450" and the smallest knurls I see are .472". 28 thou press fit????? seems way excessive.
Yeah, a .007-.015" press is going to be about it for a knurl like that.

Best practice would be to measure the diameter of the stud just before or after the knurl, so you know the original size of the stud shank before they rolled the knurl into it...size the hole no tighter than .002" smaller than that shank size.

If your going to try to pound them in, or draw them in with an impact gun(I don't recommend, easy to gall a thread that way) the hole is going to need to be a little bigger than the shank or you'll have a hell of a time seating it.

You can always drill the holes in the axle flange to take a bigger knurl
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post #10 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 12:51 PM
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

Is there a number on the head of the old studs, like 610-360?


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post #11 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 1:19 PM
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

Gene, I'm definitely not an expert on this, but FWIW, two things come to mind (nice thread title BTW hahahaha ):

#1. OK so you've measured the diameter of the bearing surfaces of the axles, but I'm guessing that you'll also need to check for run-out with the use of a dial indicator. However IDK what the maximum allowable run-out would be, (maybe up to .008" or so???) and I'm also thinking that the only accurate way to check for run out would be to bring the axles to a local machine shop to have them chucked onto a lathe.

#2. I've used an impact gun to draw the wheel studs in without damaging the steel threads at all. I used wheel bearing grease on the threads as well as a little bit on the splines, along with grease on the nuts and washers I also used, and I froze the studs in my kitchen freezer for a couple hours prior to installation in order to shrink the O.D. a couple thousandths to aid installation. However if I remember right, that was only with a .005" interference fit on the spline surface. Certainly NOT a .017"+ interference fit.
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post #12 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 23rd, 20, 9:44 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

So I went to the local speed shop K&S Auto, and the racer there Mike set me up. You can swedge ( 5 lb mallet) a Dorman .462 knurl stud into a .450" hole I would never have thought. But I done it> Bang Bang Maxwell's silver hammer.

I was with Billy 100% until I done did it. When Mike put the .462' Doemans into the hole you could tell they wanted to be there. one 5 lb mallet and heavy vise for flange support was all she took.

but the lesson here is, when you pound the snot out of your 1967 12 bolt, you best pull her apart and check stuff. I did last year before the MJ467 arrived, But I never pulled the pin. So the moral of the story is, a 12 bolt is like a contra-hand grenade. If you DO NOT want it to grenade, PULL THE PIN for inspection.

because as I halfway re-inserted the pin after C -clipping my repaired axle in , it slipped out, ( gear oil bath all over my hands at that point) and this little guy somehow magically appeared.... and we definitely have a loose spider gear. Diff is out for service!

PULL THE PIN FOR A COMPLETE INSPECTION!!!!! Drop the clips and back out the axles to check your spiders. And their washers!

This would have fragged old Red's original and lazer-straight beautiful sheet metal if the axle unassed itself. OY VEY! Got lucky.
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post #13 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 24th, 20, 7:59 AM
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

That's common with the Eaton Posi. I keep some of those washers for that reason. It wouldn't have caused your axle to come out, but it would have worn your Eaton case and could have caused a gear failure. I would guess that your clutches are worn and need to be shimmed, but that's another project. The trick to getting that washer back in place without disassembling the unit is to put it in through the small hole instead of the big one.


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Last edited by big gear head; Jun 24th, 20 at 8:20 AM.
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post #14 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 24th, 20, 10:53 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

That shim is FUBAR'd Freddie. Brought the diff to our local "azzman" for service. His comment was" if you really have 600 HP, you really need to upgrade the center section". I have no idea what he is talking about, but when you say Eaton case, I presume that is part of it. . But Billy is pulling it apart. He rebuilt it maybe 12 years ago. Feel like I am falling down a rabbit hole!

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post #15 of 39 (permalink) Old Jun 24th, 20, 11:48 AM
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Re: Expert proctologist advice - replace or 'repair' axle

I'm pretty sure that thrust washer is from a Eaton Posi. Yeah, the Eaton is probably not up to handling 600 HP. When Chevy built the COPO Camaros and Chevelles they used special gears and clutches in the Eaton Posi and special heat treated ring & pinion gears in the 12 bolt for those cars.


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