Hydraulic clutch in Muncie - Chevelle Tech
Transmission & Driveline Transmissions and Differentials

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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 10th, 19, 8:29 PM Thread Starter
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Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

So I’m debating on doing a hydraulic clutch conversion on my Muncie. I’m going to be purchasing a new clutch kit soon and thinking it would be a great time to do it. Anyone else here do the conversion? Seems to be a good upgrade for the money. Don’t get me wrong, I’m old school and love the classics but I’m starting to look into modern technology in the classics, but I still can’t bring myself to do the ls swap just yet.
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 10th, 19, 9:11 PM
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Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

Is there something wrong with your factory clutch linkage/operation?
My 70 was a factory 3sp car and the 3sp has been replaced with a Muncie. The clutch linkage still works like brand new.


It seems to me that this falls into the category of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 19, 6:51 AM Thread Starter
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No everything works good on my car. I actually purchased everything but the fork new 2 years ago. I’m just thinking of changing the clutch out. I purchased a new zoom clutch from summit and it just seems like it’s weak? I literally have it adjusted all the way out. The pedal releases it at 3/4 out! I think I cheaped out and should have purchased a higher quality clutch kit. So I thought while I have it apart, a hydraulic conversion would be beneficial on the leg, plus it’s a quicker smoother operation than the mechanical.
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 19, 9:18 AM
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Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

Check out the dirt track late model crowd. I think they use a hydraulic with the Munice.

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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 19, 2:36 PM
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Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

Quote:
Originally Posted by hessz24 View Post
No everything works good on my car. I actually purchased everything but the fork new 2 years ago. Iím just thinking of changing the clutch out. I purchased a new zoom clutch from summit and it just seems like itís weak? I literally have it adjusted all the way out. The pedal releases it at 3/4 out! I think I cheaped out and should have purchased a higher quality clutch kit. So I thought while I have it apart, a hydraulic conversion would be beneficial on the leg, plus itís a quicker smoother operation than the mechanical.



This is our 70 with pure, factory stock clutch linkage/Muncie.



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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 19, 4:53 PM
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Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

My 2006 GTO has a hydraulic clutch. If there was one system I would replace if I could it would be the hydraulic clutch. When it works, it works just fine, but when it doesn't it is a royal PITA. Then there is the maintenance, bleeding the system once or twice a year. It would still be a huge PITA to bleed if I hadn't installed a remote bleeder when I installed a new clutch and slave cylinder. Even new, the slaves are junk and allow for fluid contamination and they don't hold up well in the dirty and hot environment in which they have to live. They rarely last as long as the clutch.

My experience with hydraulic clutches makes me think the hydraulic clutch was a solution for problem that didn't exist.

If you do go with a hydraulic clutch, use the highest temperature rated brake fluid you can find (such as this: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/wil-290-6209) and bleed the slave regularly. Also, use no or as few rubber hydraulic lines as you can and if possible include a remote bleeding feature. And keep those hydraulic lines as far from sources of heat (such as headers) or at least insulate them well from heat sources.

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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 19, 5:16 PM
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Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

I'd have to drive one to compare. I have had linkage clutches, but only on slant-6 Dodge Vans, and this El Camino briefly when my did first got it. I have had cable clutches, GM HS Body (Monza/Sunbird) those sucked in every way possible, FWD Mopars (Shelby Charger Turbo, Rampage...) Those were great as long as the auto-adjust didn't get stuck between ratchet points and click. And hydraulic clutches (PT Cruiser, Chrysler Crossfire, XJ Jeep Cherokee) those were all excellent.
I have not driven a high torque car with hydraulic clutch, but I think I would like it. I have thought about it in my El Camino, since I still have a clutch pedal swaying in the wind down there, and keep kicking around the idea of going back to manual.

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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 19, 5:34 PM
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Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

I changed from a mechanical throw out bearing to a hydraulic throw out bearing on my Vegaís M22 Muncie years back. I used a McCleod (sp?) hydraulic throw out bearing that simply replaced the bolt on input shaft bearing retainer on the front of the trans. It works great, plus it eliminated the clutch cable/ pulley set up used on Vegas. Itís also much cleaner underhood.
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 19, 7:14 PM
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Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

I've had three vehicles with hydraulic clutches: 2002 Camaro SS, 2005 Corvette and currently a 2019 Corvette Z06 Convertible. No problems with any of them although the 2019 is only eight months old. I did replace the hydraulic fluid once on the 2005 Corvette but that's it. When the El Camino goes back on the road, it will retain the original mechanical linkage unless there are clearance issues with the Lemon's headers. Time will tell.

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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 11th, 19, 8:00 PM
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Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

Unless your leg gets too weak keep the mechanical, it will never blow a seal. Wish Id left the frame mount for my linkage.
Ive blown a couple its a pain, never know when its going to happen.

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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old Jan 12th, 19, 6:24 PM
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Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

I don't know a single modern car that uses a mechanical clutch disengagement mechanism. Without any further commentary and to answer the OPs question, here is what I would do.

Get a MC mount from Bowler. I believe it is made to work with the universal MCs from Wilwood (or Tilton). I'd probably start with a 3/4" bore MC, but keep in mind another size may work best for you. The bore MC size is a tuning tool to adjust pedal travel, engagement, etc...

Tilton makes a 6000 series TOB that is made to mount on the Muncie bearing retainer (they make versions for many transmissions). I don't have direct experience with this bearing, but looking at the design it look solid.

Connect the MC with the TOB with an appropriate length AN-4 hose. Add a remote bleeder to the other fitting. Bleeder goes on top.

I have used similar parts for my 70 GTO. I have a LS swap but using a Richmond 6 speed, which as far as TOB is concerned, is exactly the same as a Muncie. If I was to pick components over again, the above is what I would choose.

Andrew
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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old Jun 18th, 19, 1:45 AM
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Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

Found this thread via a search.
Intend to use a hydraulic clutch in my '68 EC build.
Had a ridiculous number of issues with my '59 EC linkage decades ago, the topper was the Z bar coming apart at the welds.
Thinking I may fabricate a mount for an external slave instead of the Z bar, if I have room.
Should be pretty inexpensive and keeps it all out of the bell housing.

At these gas prices I want it 100+ octane, leaded, and my windshield washed!
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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old Jun 18th, 19, 3:52 PM
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Cool Re: Hydraulic clutch in Muncie

Quote:
Originally Posted by hessz24 View Post
So Iím debating on doing a hydraulic clutch conversion on my Muncie. Iím going to be purchasing a new clutch kit soon and thinking it would be a great time to do it. Anyone else here do the conversion? Seems to be a good upgrade for the money. Donít get me wrong, Iím old school and love the classics but Iím starting to look into modern technology in the classics, but I still canít bring myself to do the ls swap just yet.
"Seems to be a good upgrade for the money."

Good? In what way?

Money? How much?

Fixin' stuff that ain't broke strikes me having idle time and money on one's hands. A luxury. But, that's just one man's idle opinion. FWIW, my 11 yrs old Corolla has a hydraulic clutch. I'd hate to have to try to design a mechanical clutch release mechanism for that application. Hydraulic is probably the cheaper way to go for Toyota. Just like Aluminum and plastic radiators are. Toyota did get it right from what I've seen. Eleven years, 150,000 miles. I glance at the brakes and clutch reservoirs once in a while when I have the hood up. Factory fill. Still full, Still clear. I wonder if the aftermarket stuff will give you that kind of value? I'll bet that if the Chevelle was originally equipped with a hydraulic actuation system, and someone came along and designed the OE manual actuating system, he'd be hailed as a genius
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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old Jun 19th, 19, 7:34 PM Thread Starter
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This is why I feel its a good upgrade for the money.
https://youtu.be/FVLGOSMTjrU
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