Weird Alignment Issue - Page 2 - Chevelle Tech
Brakes, Suspension & Steering Conversion questions & more.

 8Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
post #16 of 24 (permalink) Old Nov 7th, 19, 1:24 PM Thread Starter
Tech Team
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Valencia, CA
Posts: 59
Re: Weird Alignment Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldcutlass View Post
I think they are on the wrong sides also. Don't those arms have some pos. caster built in?

Yep, +3-4* according to QA1. I just got off the phone with them again. Sent them the photos and measurements of the arms (front and back). QA1 tech believes they are installed correctly. For visual reference, they said that the center of the ball joint (red grease zerk cap) should line up slightly forward (towards the front of the car) from the snubber bolt on the gusset. Mine does. If the arms were switched left to right, that visual reference would line up towards the rear of the car.


I'll take it to another alignment shop, but this one has been really good in the past...independent shop, good equipment, willing to set up to aftermarket specs, etc. They set up my 69 Camaro (full Global West front) and last month did my 57 Chevy (tubular uppers/stock lowers/tall ball joints) with perfect results. Still not sure what's going on here. I guess I could try swapping the a-arms left to right and see what happens.
Frank69 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #17 of 24 (permalink) Old Nov 7th, 19, 2:03 PM
Senior Tech Team
Steve
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Central MA
Posts: 1,352
Re: Weird Alignment Issue

If they have caster built in, the upper ball joint should be more towards the back of the car, not the front of the car.

Clearly right now (based on the alignment measurements and the visual pictures) they are pushing the upper ball joint forward of the lower ball joint, not backward, and they are doing the opposite of what you want.

My $0.02 - I would swap em if it were me and see what happens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank69 View Post
Yep, +3-4* according to QA1. I just got off the phone with them again. Sent them the photos and measurements of the arms (front and back). QA1 tech believes they are installed correctly. For visual reference, they said that the center of the ball joint (red grease zerk cap) should line up slightly forward (towards the front of the car) from the snubber bolt on the gusset. Mine does. If the arms were switched left to right, that visual reference would line up towards the rear of the car.


I'll take it to another alignment shop, but this one has been really good in the past...independent shop, good equipment, willing to set up to aftermarket specs, etc. They set up my 69 Camaro (full Global West front) and last month did my 57 Chevy (tubular uppers/stock lowers/tall ball joints) with perfect results. Still not sure what's going on here. I guess I could try swapping the a-arms left to right and see what happens.
71350SS likes this.

1972 Chevelle, 454, 200-4r non-lockup, 12 bolt 3.73
1981 Camaro Z28, 355, TH350, 3.73
lucifershammer is online now  
post #18 of 24 (permalink) Old Nov 7th, 19, 3:13 PM
Lifetime Premium Member
Steve
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Near Reading PA
Posts: 3,900
Garage
Re: Weird Alignment Issue

This is UMI, but the geometry should be close. You have an angle above the ball joint, not parallel, and it's canted to the front, not the rear. They look backwards. Here's how mine sit.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
ZZ69chevelle is offline  
 
post #19 of 24 (permalink) Old Nov 7th, 19, 4:03 PM Thread Starter
Tech Team
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Valencia, CA
Posts: 59
Re: Weird Alignment Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZZ69chevelle View Post
This is UMI, but the geometry should be close. You have an angle above the ball joint, not parallel, and it's canted to the front, not the rear. They look backwards. Here's how mine sit.



Thanks for this. Now I’m definitely going to switch them around and see what happens. I’ll report back.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
lucifershammer likes this.
Frank69 is offline  
post #20 of 24 (permalink) Old Nov 8th, 19, 4:11 PM Thread Starter
Tech Team
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Valencia, CA
Posts: 59
Re: Weird Alignment Issue

QA1 sent me schematic diagrams of the arms, that included measurements from various reference points. Basically the front and rear arms are .5” difference in length and .3” difference in height. There are angle differences too. I measured mine and they match the diagrams. Now what, haha. I’ll get it aligned again and if that doesn’t work, this winter I’ll strip the whole front end down and start from scratch. The bushings in the LCA’s look shot anyway. That will give me a chance to do tubular lowers, drop spindles and new shocks. More $$...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Frank69 is offline  
post #21 of 24 (permalink) Old Nov 8th, 19, 4:34 PM
Senior Tech Team
Steve
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Central MA
Posts: 1,352
Re: Weird Alignment Issue

If it were me, and given the pictures and angles you posted - I would still swap em and see what happens. Doesn't take long.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank69 View Post
QA1 sent me schematic diagrams of the arms, that included measurements from various reference points. Basically the front and rear arms are .5” difference in length and .3” difference in height. There are angle differences too. I measured mine and they match the diagrams. Now what, haha. I’ll get it aligned again and if that doesn’t work, this winter I’ll strip the whole front end down and start from scratch. The bushings in the LCA’s look shot anyway. That will give me a chance to do tubular lowers, drop spindles and new shocks. More $$...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

1972 Chevelle, 454, 200-4r non-lockup, 12 bolt 3.73
1981 Camaro Z28, 355, TH350, 3.73
lucifershammer is online now  
post #22 of 24 (permalink) Old Nov 8th, 19, 10:08 PM
Lifetime Premium Member
Randy
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Central Alabama
Posts: 4,264
Re: Weird Alignment Issue

They look to me to be backwards too.

Randy
TC # 5401
67 Project SS Clone

Owning a Chevelle project is like having a giant-size piggy bank that you keep pouring money into....but you can't get it back out.
pnugene is offline  
post #23 of 24 (permalink) Old Nov 9th, 19, 12:57 AM
Lifetime Premium Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: In the Shadow of GIANTS stadium,N.J.
Posts: 7,713
Garage
Re: Weird Alignment Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank69 View Post
Here’s some photos of the driver’s side upper control arm. Some of the guys over on the pro-touring forum say they’re mounted on the wrong side, but QA1 tech doesn’t think so. Any opinion?

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZZ69chevelle View Post
This is UMI, but the geometry should be close.
here's both pictures in the same post to make it easier to look at one vs the other.

John
71 El Camino SS
406 SBC M21 3.31 12 bolt
"Quality is always remembered,long after the price is forgotten"
71350SS is online now  
post #24 of 24 (permalink) Old Nov 9th, 19, 9:54 AM
Senior Tech Team
Jeff
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Pittsburgh, Pa.
Posts: 2,233
Re: Weird Alignment Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by 70montee View Post
I bring no good advice or knowledge, other than to ask a question.....does the steering return to center? My alignment shop is not top notch (i didnt know this before hand), when they first did my alignment, they set it back to factory specs, and it really didnt return much. When i went back with numbers i got from people here, return to center improved, and is almost 100%, but they could only get +2 degrees with factory control arms.

The steering box has a lot to do with return. I never realized this until I installed this latest box from Lee. Its a 14:1 with a 30 pound valve. It returns like a manual even with only 1 degree of positive caster.
I think most power boxes over assist and the tech from Lee I was talking to agrees. Lee is owned by new people but they still have many of the old timers working there. That said these new owners are making some changes to the box and the changes are great!! This new Lee box is a dream. It does everything well. It gives my 69 el camino such a nice feel, kind of like a real nimble go cart..
I had a 12:1 I bought from Lee years ago and this one too over assisted.. I needed 6 degrees or more positive caster to get the steering wheel to return fast.. When you think of it, cars with manual boxes only have one or two degrees caster and they return fast..
hydro462 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Chevelle Tech forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address. Note, you will be sent a confirmation request to this address.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome