New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags! - Chevelle Tech
Tag Team De-coding cowl tags and vin numbers.

Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
post #1 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 7th, 07, 10:04 PM Thread Starter
Gold Founding Member
Dale
 
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Lawton, Oklahoma
Posts: 19,805
Exclamation New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

Just read this on the Oklahoma States Court Network web site.
This Statue Will Go Into Effect 11/01/2007
Quote:
A. It shall be unlawful for any person to:
1. Knowingly and intentionally destroy, remove, cover, alter or deface, or cause to be destroyed, covered, removed, altered or defaced the trim tag plate of a motor vehicle manufactured from 1953 to 1977;
2. Knowingly affix a counterfeit trim tag plate to a motor vehicle;
3. Manufacture, offer for sale, sell, introduce, import or deliver for sale or use in this state a counterfeit trim tag plate; or
4. Offer for sale, sell, introduce, import or deliver for sale or use in this state a trim tag plate that was affixed to a motor vehicle at the time of manufacture but has since been removed or become dislodged.
B. Paragraph 1 of subsection A of this section shall not apply to:
1. Any person who engages in repair of a motor vehicle, provided that removal of the vehicle's trim tag plate is reasonably necessary for repair of a part of the vehicle to which the trim tag plate is affixed, and provided that such trim tag plate is not intentionally destroyed, altered or defaced; or
2. Removal of a trim tag from a motor vehicle which is being junked or otherwise destroyed, if the removal is being done for historical documentation purposes by a person actively involved in judging events or for historical documentation of classic motor vehicles and reasonable precaution is taken to ensure that the tag is not sold or affixed to another motor vehicle.
C. Any person convicted of violating the provisions of this act shall be guilty of a misdemeanor. Any person convicted of violating the provisions of this act a second or subsequent time shall be guilty of a felony.
D. In addition to any other civil remedy available, a person defrauded as a result of a violation of this act may bring a civil action against any person who knowingly violated this act regardless of whether that person has been convicted of a violation of this act. A person defrauded as a result of a violation of this act may recover treble their actual compensatory damages. In any action brought pursuant to this subsection, the court may award reasonable costs, including costs of expert witnesses, and attorney fees to the prevailing party.
E. As used in this section:
1. "Trim tag plate" means a plate or tag affixed to a motor vehicle by the manufacturer which displays numbers, symbols, or codes that identify characteristics of the vehicle including, but not limited to, date of manufacture, body style, paint color, engine option, transmission option, trim option, general option, interior option, and interior color;
2. "Counterfeit trim tag plate" means:
a. any trim tag plate manufactured by a person or entity other than the original manufacturer of a motor vehicle upon which the trim tag plate is designed to be affixed, unless the trim tag has been permanently stamped, in the same manner as other information on the trim tag, with the words "REPLACEMENT TAG" in letters measuring at least one-eighth (1/8) of an inch in height, or
b. any trim tag plate which has been altered from its original manufactured condition so as to change any of its numbers, symbols, or codes; and
3. "Motor vehicle" means the same as defined in Section 1-134 of Title 47 of the Oklahoma Statutes.
Wow! They're not talking about VIN plates here but TRIM TAGS.

http://www.oscn.net/applications/osc....asp?id=450125
DaleM is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 7th, 07, 10:36 PM
Senior Tech Team
Eric
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: SW Ohio
Posts: 1,245
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

That is FANTASTIC news!

Carburetor Rebuild & Restoration
Engine & Driveline Parts & Services
www.vintagemusclecarparts.com

Check out Vintage Musclecar Parts on Facebook
Vintage Musclecar is offline  
post #3 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 7th, 07, 10:40 PM
Tech Team
JOHNNIE
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: oklahoma
Posts: 861
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

WOW that is what i have been thinking the last two days i have been reading the statutes.

i need motivation
BIGBLOCK70Z is offline  
 
post #4 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 7th, 07, 11:41 PM
Tech Team
JOHNNIE
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: oklahoma
Posts: 861
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

An identification number may be placed on a vehicle or engine by its manufacturer in the regular course of business or placed or restored on a vehicle or engine by authority of the Oklahoma Tax Commission without violating this section; an identification number so placed or restored is not falsified.

Historical
this is from oklahoma statutes. this is not saying that it is against the law to reproduce a like original vin bearing original numbers. what does this really mean.

i need motivation
BIGBLOCK70Z is offline  
post #5 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 7th, 07, 11:48 PM Thread Starter
Gold Founding Member
Dale
 
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Lawton, Oklahoma
Posts: 19,805
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGBLOCK70Z View Post
An identification number may be placed on a vehicle or engine by its manufacturer in the regular course of business or placed or restored on a vehicle or engine by authority of the Oklahoma Tax Commission without violating this section; an identification number so placed or restored is not falsified.

Historical
this is from oklahoma statutes. this is not saying that it is against the law to reproduce a like original vin bearing original numbers. what does this really mean.
I read it as it's NOT against the law if the number is placed or restored by authority of the Oklahoma Tax Commission. Aside from the manufacturer's initial stamping, legally, if a block is decked and restamped without the OTC authority, it's against the statute.

Any other takes on the reading?
DaleM is offline  
post #6 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 7th, 07, 11:55 PM
Tech Team
JOHNNIE
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: oklahoma
Posts: 861
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

if you restamp the original the indentical the same # you are not changing nothing. by gosh decking a block is illegal. dang got to arrest all the machine shops in the US. i know sounds stupid. now all the machine shops will not deck a block until they varify that it is not stolen. thats gonna cost alot.

i need motivation
BIGBLOCK70Z is offline  
post #7 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 8th, 07, 12:16 AM
Senior Tech Team
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: tucson az
Posts: 13,423
Send a message via AIM to Jim Mac
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

You know, big brother keeps passing all these laws, do you think they will actually enforce something like this? Unless it makes the press, makes them money, I really dont think anyone in city hall really cares.
Heck I was reading in the local paper. Did you know in Arizona if your caught smuggling less than 500 pounds of weed across the border, they just confiscate the drugs and let the mule go? Unless the persons got a weapon, or past convictions, we dont have the prosecutors, of the jail space. Now in Tenn. they raised the cig. tax. so if your caught smuggling 25 cartons of cigs from a neighboring state, its a fine plus the confiscate your car and jail time! Now this is for a legal product, its just that the state isnt getting their tax! If you ask me, its total BS!!!! Jim
Jim Mac is offline  
post #8 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 8th, 07, 12:23 AM Thread Starter
Gold Founding Member
Dale
 
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Lawton, Oklahoma
Posts: 19,805
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

I'm sure that 999 times out of 1000, the state isn't going to pursue a legitimate machine shop because in the course of rebuilding an engine the block is decked and the original ID is restamped. Just like the trim tag issue, they simply don't have the time, expertise, or resouces to investigate and look at every tag.

Other statues do give law enforcement the authority to visit any type of body or other repair shop and physically inspect cars there but, again I assume, it'd be done in the course of an overall investigation and not just on a whim. The new statute gives them some teeth to charge and/or prosecute if they find suspicious activity. Like selling VIN rivets, if they find some persons selling trim tags at $250 each as 'collector items', they may get busted as well.

It also gives the buyer of a high-dollar restoration of any car some protection against not only altered VINs to represent that high-dollar car but altering or changing trim tags as may show a car as one would like it to be instead of what it was before a restoration some added assurance...not much, but some.

Personally I think the trim tag issue may be hard to enforce, especially for items like trim and paint. If there's no history of the information on the trim tag being recorded, if a white car with blue bench seat interior and Powerglide transmission is completely stripped and painted red and retrofitted with black bucket seats, console and a 4-speed, who would know? Unless one could prove the 'new' trim tag that says it's a red/black/4-speed car is from another vehicle, I think it'd be quite difficult to prove.

Anyway, like it or don't like it, care or don't care, it's interesting to discuss.
DaleM is offline  
post #9 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 8th, 07, 12:25 AM
Tech Team
JOHNNIE
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: oklahoma
Posts: 861
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

i would say amen brother. but i dont want to infringe on someone belief. so i say, RIGHT ON DUDE. i sure hope you arent mad cuz i called you a dude. i am sorry. if i offended you.

i need motivation
BIGBLOCK70Z is offline  
post #10 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 8th, 07, 12:49 AM
Lifetime Premium Member
 
Join Date: Sep 1998
Location: Brooklyn Park, MN, USA
Posts: 18,160
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

Even if its not enforced. Its a step in the right direction in preventing fraud in the sale of bogus restored muscle cars.

Chris.

When the Boogeyman goes to bed, he checks the closet for Chuck Norris.

If it aint broke, just give me a minute.
Chris R is offline  
post #11 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 8th, 07, 9:12 AM
Senior Tech Team
Mike
 
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Michigan,USA
Posts: 3,000
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

Quote:
Personally I think the trim tag issue may be hard to enforce, especially for items like trim and paint.
BUT its does give an avenue to prosecute anyone who does that. So if you get screwed out of $100,000 buying a bogus made up COPO you have some consolation that the ones who did it could go to jail and/or be held liable. Today you are stuck proving they did anything wrong because there are not laws against it.

Its big business making these bogus cars and selling them for big bucks.
elcamino is offline  
post #12 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 8th, 07, 10:31 AM
Team Member
Hey!
 
Join Date: Sep 1998
Location: Lake Granbury Texas
Posts: 3,797
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

Dale, any ideas on how this statute was initiated? Were there some cases of fraud? Do you know who sponsored the bill? I'd like to see this roll over into Texas!

1969 Chevelle SS 396

A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.
..........Thomas Jefferson
Jimmy P is offline  
post #13 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 8th, 07, 11:36 AM Thread Starter
Gold Founding Member
Dale
 
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Lawton, Oklahoma
Posts: 19,805
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

I don't have any history on it other than what's on their website. I'd guess someone or some group with influence probably got ripped off and pushed for something like this. The 1953 to 1977 model year range is kind of odd but maybe that's the range that has info like interior and paint on the trim tag.

It may well have started as something smaller and more personal and for 'legal' reasons expanded to encompass all these years. Like many laws, it'll probably take a complaint before anything bears fruit. I'm sure nobody is going to be setting up roadside checks for 'trim tag compliance'
DaleM is offline  
post #14 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 8th, 07, 11:37 AM
Tech Team
mike
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Oklahoma City, OK
Posts: 504
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

A step in the right direction, but I think it should have been added with the intent to defraud. The current law as shown is too broad and left open for interpretation.

Mike
Musclerodz is offline  
post #15 of 78 (permalink) Old Oct 8th, 07, 12:15 PM Thread Starter
Gold Founding Member
Dale
 
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Lawton, Oklahoma
Posts: 19,805
Re: New Oklahoma law pertaining to trim tags!

Would there be any other reason? Section A1 says, "Knowlingly and intentionally..." so I imagine if someone already owned a vehicle with a swapped or replacement tag and wasn't aware of it when the car was sold may not be liable. The question then becomes proving they knew the tag was not correct for that car.

I wrote to trimtags.com to see what effect that may have on their selling reproduction trim tags.

I wonder how many other states have laws like this burried in their code that neophytes do not know about?
DaleM is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Closed Thread

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Chevelle Tech forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address. Note, you will be sent a confirmation request to this address.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Old Thread Warning
This Thread is more than 4182 days old. It is very likely that it does not need any further discussion and thus bumping it serves no purpose.
If you still feel it is necessary to make a new reply, you can still do so though.

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome