Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey - Chevelle Tech
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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 12th, 20, 10:21 AM Thread Starter
 
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Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

Hey , First Post please be gentle. lol

68 SS 396/325 Chevelle i have had since i was 17. Now im 58 who knew .
Car has sat for along time , did a little reconditioning and had it running 5 years ago

OEM "ET" code 396 long gone

I have always wanted to know what 427 i bought and put it .
When i changed engines i swore it was a two bolt main . I remember being disappointed . But that was along time ago.
Its a CE block so its NOT easy .

Info i have so far

Front Engine ID Pad CE950409

Back of engine :
3935439 Block casting #
GM 1 , CONV2
Block Date ? unkown yet

Top of timing chain / block machined spot , blank

Square port heads : unknown # yet . AND not sure if the heads came on this engine. just dont know yet .

There are more numbers next to the oil filter , i will get soon.

Sooo , it quite a journey
I was SOOO happy about that #3935439 Block casting ID thinking i had the ultimate 427/435 , till i found out that 3935439 also could very well be a 1969 L36 390hp twobolt main. Arrg.

ANY addl info greatly appreciated

I need to know exactly what it is , what it was installed in ect ect
I "think" the numbers down at the oil filter will be the partial VIN , since on a CE block they arnt on the usual location ?

Thanks , 24hrsparkey

1968 396/325 SS Chevelle Car. Non original 427 engine now.
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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 12th, 20, 10:47 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

Just found GM1 CONV2 , means over the counter / crate engine . But already assumed this because it is a CE block to begin with .
So this is of little importance i reckon.

1968 396/325 SS Chevelle Car. Non original 427 engine now.
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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 12th, 20, 12:44 PM
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Dale
 
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

Quote:
Originally Posted by 24hrsparkey View Post
Hey , First Post please be gentle. lol

68 SS 396/325 Chevelle i have had since i was 17. Now im 58 who knew .
Car has sat for along time , did a little reconditioning and had it running 5 years ago

OEM "ET" code 396 long gone

I have always wanted to know what 427 i bought and put it .
When i changed engines i swore it was a two bolt main . I remember being disappointed . But that was along time ago.
Its a CE block so its NOT easy .

Info i have so far

Front Engine ID Pad CE950409

Back of engine :
3935439 Block casting #
GM 1 , CONV2
Block Date ? unkown yet

Top of timing chain / block machined spot , blank

Square port heads : unknown # yet . AND not sure if the heads came on this engine. just dont know yet .

There are more numbers next to the oil filter , i will get soon.

Sooo , it quite a journey
I was SOOO happy about that #3935439 Block casting ID thinking i had the ultimate 427/435 , till i found out that 3935439 also could very well be a 1969 L36 390hp twobolt main. Arrg.

ANY addl info greatly appreciated

I need to know exactly what it is , what it was installed in ect ect
I "think" the numbers down at the oil filter will be the partial VIN , since on a CE block they arnt on the usual location ?

Thanks , 24hrsparkey
CE950409 is the serial number of the engine. The first letter "C" designates the GM division, or Chevrolet in this case. The second letter designates the type of unit "E" for engine or "T" for transmission. So, CE stands for "Chevrolet Engine," the "9" is the year the engine was built, 50409 is the engine's serial number. The Tonawanda engine plant used sequence numbers from 50000 to 79999 so this is the 410th sequenced engine built in 1969 (the first engine would be 50000, second would be 50001, etc.) This numbering system applies to service engine assemblies, partial engines, and fitted cylinder cases. When an engine was warrantied with a CE engine, just how much of was replaced was dictated by the damage done. There will (or should be) a date stamped on the starter pad that should give the date the engine was replaced.

GM1 and CONV2 are casting mold data and of no significance and have nothing to do with a warranty engine. My resources indicate casting #3935439 is a 427 block used in passenger cars and Corvettes in 1969. Unless the dealer stamped a partial VIN on the replacement engine, there should not be a partial VIN since the Tonawanda engine plant had no idea (and didn't care) what the engine would be replacing. The casting date should be on the side of the block next to a freeze plug.

Factory partial VIN location will vary. Up through 1968, the typical location was on the engine pad. In 1969 Chevelles, both Atlanta and KC stamped it by the oil filter while other plants kept it on the engine pad. In 1970, plants again differed in location and some might have a partial VIN in either location; it depended on the person stamping it.

See https://www.chevellestuff.net/qd/eng...mp_numbers.htm for details.

TC Gold #92 ~ August 1998
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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 12th, 20, 1:25 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

Wow , Thank you !
Learning allot here !

I will look for the block casting date , side of block near freeze plug .

Replacement Date , starter pad area

And i think i remember stampings around the oil filter area , IF so,, would this be the partial VIN ? AND then we could tell what model car it was put in ( as a replacement )

thanks for your time and patience
Engine is still in the car and she sits low in a very crammped narrow garage. ,, This may take a day or two . I am used to working on pickup trucks , just crawl under type of thing lol.

24hrsparkey

1968 396/325 SS Chevelle Car. Non original 427 engine now.
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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 12th, 20, 1:59 PM
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

Quote:
Originally Posted by 24hrsparkey View Post
Wow , Thank you !
Learning allot here !

I will look for the block casting date , side of block near freeze plug .

Replacement Date , starter pad area

And i think i remember stampings around the oil filter area , IF so,, would this be the partial VIN ? AND then we could tell what model car it was put in ( as a replacement )

thanks for your time and patience
Engine is still in the car and she sits low in a very crammped narrow garage. ,, This may take a day or two . I am used to working on pickup trucks , just crawl under type of thing lol.

24hrsparkey
Unless the dealer stamped a partial VIN on the replacement engine, there should not be a partial VIN since the Tonawanda engine plant had no idea (and didn't care) what the engine would be replacing

TC Gold #92 ~ August 1998
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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 12th, 20, 2:32 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

True the engine plant had no idea. So no partial VIN on the top engine pad area as per "reguler " oem engines .

But assuming someone ( dealer ) hand stamped the "replacement date" near the starter , and i remember stamped in numbers around the oil filter ,, i mean these have to indicate something ?

1968 396/325 SS Chevelle Car. Non original 427 engine now.
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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 12th, 20, 10:32 PM
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

since it is a CE block check down on the starter mounting area for the month and year assembly code,it will be T for Tonawanda followed by two digit month and single digit year. example would be T069 which would be assembled june 1969.

based on the CE number you are likely to find T 10 or 11 and 8 (Oct or Nov 1968), at least from the list of CE numbers and assembly dates i have indicate this.
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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 13th, 20, 8:36 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

Quote:
Originally Posted by SS69Chevelle View Post
since it is a CE block check down on the starter mounting area for the month and year assembly code,it will be T for Tonawanda followed by two digit month and single digit year. example would be T069 which would be assembled june 1969.

based on the CE number you are likely to find T 10 or 11 and 8 (Oct or Nov 1968), at least from the list of CE numbers and assembly dates i have indicate this.
Cool thanks !

So the stampings near the starter boss are going to be engine assembly date , and probl not the replacement date ?
Im hoping the stampings near the oil filter will be a partial VIN of what model car it was put into ,

Ayyy there s a lot to this casting date , assembly date ect ect .

Say its a 427/390 ( because its a 2 bolt main ) would that have originally had oval port heads ? This engine has iron square ports .
Glad i have help !

1968 396/325 SS Chevelle Car. Non original 427 engine now.
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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 13th, 20, 4:00 PM
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Dave
 
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

I believe 4-bolt have a larger size oil plug on the side of the block than a 2-bolt has. A factory square port engine would have a higher domed piston (more compression) different from an oval port motor. Also most (except Z-16) if not all square port engines had soild lifter camshafts.
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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 15th, 20, 4:15 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

Well I jacked her up and flashlighted

Oil filter area . No stamped in numbers . None . Some, but not allot of room to do so. Oil pan installed .
Did find a Cast in K HiPerf 2 symbol right above the oil filter pressure port where I tapped in for the mechanical OP gauge .
Also , this engine originally had the metal can , long bolt up thru it oil filter . I bought a piece to convert it to a spin on years ago. Very odd. Especially for most likely a 1969 passenger car engine , not an old truck engine. Confusing .

Starter area , starter covers any visibility .

Did not find block casting date nor assembly date near freeze plugs , could have missed them though.

So I guess because of no partial Vin anywhere I will never know what car this engine was in , as a replacement .
I got very little out of this deal , except rust in one eyeball.

1968 396/325 SS Chevelle Car. Non original 427 engine now.
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post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 15th, 20, 4:34 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

Quote:
Originally Posted by 25C 70 View Post
I believe 4-bolt have a larger size oil plug on the side of the block than a 2-bolt has. A factory square port engine would have a higher domed piston (more compression) different from an oval port motor. Also most (except Z-16) if not all square port engines had soild lifter camshafts.
Thank you , yes this engine has square port iron heads and a solid lifter cam . But who knows if they came on it ( did a 427/390 2 bolt main come like this ? ) . I have no,idea .

1968 396/325 SS Chevelle Car. Non original 427 engine now.
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post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 15th, 20, 5:24 PM
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

A factory square port intake can be used with oval port heads. GM made aluminum oval port intakes, these were used on some 427-390 HP big block Corvettes, but will not work on square port heads. The best way would be pull a valve cover and check the casting numbers and dates.
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post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 15th, 20, 5:49 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

Quote:
Originally Posted by 25C 70 View Post
A factory square port intake can be used with oval port heads. GM made aluminum oval port intakes, these were used on some 427-390 HP big block Corvettes, but will not work on square port heads. The best way would be pull a valve cover and check the casting numbers and dates.

Will do .

These heads are def iron square ports , I've seen them . These intake ports are huge I remember thinking when I put my intake on .

But yes I will def get the numbers

Thank you

1968 396/325 SS Chevelle Car. Non original 427 engine now.
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post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 17th, 20, 8:31 PM
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

The stamping on the starter mounting surface will give you the date that engine (or partial engine / fitted block, etc.) was assembled at Tonawanda. It will not tell you the date the engine was actually replaced in the car -- except that obviously the replacement date had to be after the engine was actually built. But there could be just a couple weeks, or several months, in between.

As to the format of that stamp down by the starter -- T### -- I am having trouble remembering for sure but I think I determined once before that from and after 1-1-1967 that stamp was a Julian date code. So for instance 017 would be the 17th day of an unidentified calendar year, but then the casting date and the CE year stamp tell you what year it was. Again, not positive if I am recalling correctly, but I believe that is right.

Easiest way to tell in the car whether 4 bolt or 2 bolt is to check the size and number of the holes with pipe thread plugs above the oil filter. Take a good pic of those and post it here and we can tell you which you have.

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post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old Mar 18th, 20, 9:29 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Non oem 68 SS Chevelle engine ID CE block journey

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffschevelle View Post
The stamping on the starter mounting surface will give you the date that engine (or partial engine / fitted block, etc.) was assembled at Tonawanda. It will not tell you the date the engine was actually replaced in the car -- except that obviously the replacement date had to be after the engine was actually built. But there could be just a couple weeks, or several months, in between.

As to the format of that stamp down by the starter -- T### -- I am having trouble remembering for sure but I think I determined once before that from and after 1-1-1967 that stamp was a Julian date code. So for instance 017 would be the 17th day of an unidentified calendar year, but then the casting date and the CE year stamp tell you what year it was. Again, not positive if I am recalling correctly, but I believe that is right.

Easiest way to tell in the car whether 4 bolt or 2 bolt is to check the size and number of the holes with pipe thread plugs above the oil filter. Take a good pic of those and post it here and we can tell you which you have.
Thanks much !

Numbers near the starter :
Are they cast in or stamped
Can they be seen with starter installed

Above oil filter there is ONE oil pressure pipe plug place . And that is where i put in my mechanical OP gauge tubing , years ago. I read somewhere that those pipe plugs were not 100% accurate for determining 2 or 4 bolt main caps . Admittingly it WILL indicate a damn near all of them though.

One thing that will always confuse me is it had the olden big can and long bolt up thru it oil filter , and i converted it to a spin on with some sort of adapter . Ill get those block date codes BUT if its a 1969 block ( as indicated by the CE 950409 pad stamping ) i had no idea a 69 engine would have that old azz oil filter set up .

I think where all this is headed is :
I have a 427 2 bolt main 390 or 400hp replacement block . Out of what car , ill never know probl.
Square port iron heads and a solid cam , someone put on it .

So i still have to revisit and find :
Block casting date and the assembly date ,, and the clyd head info.

I thank you all for the expertise helping a new guy out , this aint over yet . lol.

1968 396/325 SS Chevelle Car. Non original 427 engine now.
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