Why does my 509 ping after a long ride? - Chevelle Tech
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post #1 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 3:30 PM Thread Starter
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Vinnie
 
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Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

My 509 will ping after about an hour of driving around. We changed the thermostat and got the temps down to 160 and the issue is still there. This is a bowtie block, 291 heads, 569 intake , 870cfm holley street avenger, a Pertronix III distributor/coil/wires. Straub hydraulic roller cam, and factory exhaust. It should be right at 9.8:1 compression, and I'm running pump 93. The car does fine for a while, and then while in 4th gear giving it throttle it will start to sound ugly. What are my next steps in this case? Any suggestions would be appreciated.
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post #2 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 3:46 PM
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

We need more info to help you. What is your initial timing, total timing at max mechanical advance and rpm? Are you running vacuum advance and how much, ported or manifold? What is your quench measurement? BTW running at 160 is a little too cool for optimum performance, 180 is ideal for a BBC.

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Last edited by pnugene; Nov 30th, 19 at 3:48 PM. Reason: Added text
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post #3 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 3:55 PM Thread Starter
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Vinnie
 
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

I should have mentioned that I've tried the timing at all different places between 34-40 degrees. I've tried the vacuum advance pulling from both positions and I've had the same issue. The vac advance adds I believe 11 degrees. It's the pertronix "stock cast look" distributor with the preset curve, and vac advance settings. I believe it's a 25 degree curve all in by 2800 but I will have to get the timing light out to double check all of that.

I'll be putting a 180 thermostat back in it. I just had it running 200-210 (pulling from the head sensor) and I wanted to rule temp out completely.

Quench is .048 if I recall correctly. .007 in the hole.

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post #4 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 4:00 PM
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Chris
 
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

any chance it's not pinging? Maybe just a misfire?

Have you pulled the plugs? Maybe they are fouling.

Maybe some heat soak in your ignition system (dizzy, wires, etc) is causing some irregularities with your spark.

I doubt it would be hot spots on the piston, as I would think those would show up pretty quick not just after a long drive.

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post #5 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 6:42 PM
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnievega View Post
My 509 will ping after about an hour of driving around. We changed the thermostat and got the temps down to 160 and the issue is still there. This is a bowtie block, 291 heads, 569 intake , 870cfm holley street avenger, a Pertronix III distributor/coil/wires. Straub hydraulic roller cam, and factory exhaust. It should be right at 9.8:1 compression, and I'm running pump 93. The car does fine for a while, and then while in 4th gear giving it throttle it will start to sound ugly. What are my next steps in this case? Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Check your fuel to make sure it's really 93 octane and not lower. Have had that happen to me before. Just like E-85 if you don't check it there are times you can get E-70 rather than the good stuff, if the station has some leftover reg fuel the dump it in whatever tank to get rid of it, they don't take it back with them. Had it happen this year, my BBC was running hot with the 91 non-oxy form the new station here in town, switched back to the old place where I always got it from prior and the running hot stopped. Car did not run as well either.
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post #6 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 7:14 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

I'm going to try to run some non-ethanol 93 through it and see what I can come up with. The plug wires that I'm using are 8MM wires with 7MM insulation to appear stock. I'm wondering if that might be absorbing some heat, and causing issues.

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post #7 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 8:32 PM
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

34-40 may be too much advance. Keep going down 2 degrees at a time until it stops. 32-36 is where I usually end up but it depends on octane and things like sharp edges on pistons and heads that heat up and cause detonation.
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post #8 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 8:46 PM
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

Wonder if his fuel temps underhood and timing combined could be causing this.
If only there was a way to isolate that carb and keep er cool short of butchering a hood-

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post #9 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 8:57 PM
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Why do you need vacuum advance?

Do you have the heat shield under the intake?

How good is your oil control? Catch can between PCV and carb? Valve stem seals? Rings?

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post #10 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 10:12 PM
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

I would try checking timing both cold and after the pinging has begun. Make sure something isn't actually causing temperature-related timing variance. I don't offhand know what that could be, but I'd check anyway.
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post #11 of 36 (permalink) Old Nov 30th, 19, 10:46 PM
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

Once you drive this thing along ways it's getting hot and heat soaking under the hood the fuel is getting hot the air going into the carburetor is hot and this is probably causing the problem. If there's any way you could duct cool air into the air cleaner that would help getting the heat out of the engine compartment would help. I assume it's pinging at part throttle under a slight load if that's the case you need to spend some time tuning the vacuum advance. What kind of hood do you have on this thing
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post #12 of 36 (permalink) Old Dec 1st, 19, 12:25 AM
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

An easy thing to do is when it's dark out open the hood, and see what kind of light show is going on. It may show you something, or not....
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post #13 of 36 (permalink) Old Dec 1st, 19, 9:18 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragginwagon467 View Post
Why do you need vacuum advance?

Do you have the heat shield under the intake?

How good is your oil control? Catch can between PCV and carb? Valve stem seals? Rings?

I never did try it without the vacuum advance hooked up.

It has the factory small square heat shield on the bottom of it. If there is a larger aftermarket option I'd be interested in it.

I don't have a catch can.

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post #14 of 36 (permalink) Old Dec 1st, 19, 9:23 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gnicholson View Post
Once you drive this thing along ways it's getting hot and heat soaking under the hood the fuel is getting hot the air going into the carburetor is hot and this is probably causing the problem. If there's any way you could duct cool air into the air cleaner that would help getting the heat out of the engine compartment would help. I assume it's pinging at part throttle under a slight load if that's the case you need to spend some time tuning the vacuum advance. What kind of hood do you have on this thing

That's exactly when it happens.

I have a stock 70 SS hood, and cowl induction air cleaner that vents from the valve cover to the base pan, Which I'm assuming directs hot air into my intake.

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post #15 of 36 (permalink) Old Dec 1st, 19, 9:38 AM
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Re: Why does my 509 ping after a long ride?

First I would check all the easy stuff and if no good, I would swap that distributor for the stock Delco single points system and run a CD box like the Vertex Z6 or an old MSD6AL Analog box if you can find one.

I read a couple threads were people were having the same issues as you are having and it was the Pertronix ignition..
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