396 2bbl, 12.29@112.64 MPH - Page 2 - Chevelle Tech
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post #16 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 24th, 18, 2:31 PM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

Does anyone know what class that car ran in ? It would be interesting to see what the class record is now Vs. back then.

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post #17 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 24th, 18, 3:25 PM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

According to the article, the car ran AHRA in "Formula Stock". Sounds like the class was pretty liberal in terms of mods as compared to NHRA "stock" classes, so not sure how to compare records.
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post #18 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 24th, 18, 3:28 PM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

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Originally Posted by mr 4 speed View Post
Duke,found one for $5.49 shipped on ebay Thanks again!!
Lots of interesting reading, besides the article on the car. Gotta love the ads, too....lots of cigarette stuff. A different time, for sure.
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post #19 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 24th, 18, 5:00 PM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

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Originally Posted by 71350SS View Post
Does anyone know what class that car ran in ? It would be interesting to see what the class record is now Vs. back then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DUKE 69 View Post
According to the article, the car ran AHRA in "Formula Stock". Sounds like the class was pretty liberal in terms of mods as compared to NHRA "stock" classes, so not sure how to compare records.
There are no comparable classes to these being run anywhere that I know of, so there is no way to compare records.

The cars started out as stockers (stock cubic inches, with blueprinting and modifying allowed) and were based on factory weight divided by factory cubic inches, and then further by carburetion type and also by transmission, as I recall. There was a two barrel division, a four barrel division, and finally a multiple carb / factory fuel injection / factory supercharged ~all lumped together~ division. Internal mods were pretty much unlimited.

I used to race a 67 Bel Air station wagon, 283+060, Forged Trues, Crane solid roller, Edelbrock STR-10 cross ram with two 650 cfm Holley two barrels, with an A1 powerglide, 5500 rpm converter, 5.57 gears and 9 inch slicks. All that and all it ran was was low 12's. Really just a bunch of bracket racers, but it kept us off the streets and busy on Sundays.
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post #20 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 24th, 18, 10:10 PM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

I believe CJ Baker owns the car also.

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post #21 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 24th, 18, 10:37 PM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

A friend of mine races a 2 barrel 350 78 malibu in nhra ss. Its ran 10.50s @123
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post #22 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 25th, 18, 1:05 AM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

I remember that one. Seems like CJ got it as part of a train derailment or something like that where it had been damaged and sold cheap to make it a race car?

CJ was a "thinker" and used a lot of tricks to make stuff run strong. Always liked his articles

Years ago in my street racing days....I'd sometimes remove the linkage from the secondaries on my vacuum carb and show the guy I was putting it in my pocket. Of course the secondaries actually opened anyway...but they all thought I was running on a 2 BBL!! Amazing how many people didn't catch on to that one.

But I also tried it on mechanical secondary ones and as mentioned...you can still run pretty darn fast on 2 BBL's!

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post #23 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 25th, 18, 2:30 AM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

so any specs on that combo in the mag.

I ran 113-114 mph with a 414ci 396 with 3.70 gears, stock closed chambered heads that I ported with 11.8 to 1 compression using the factory replacement trw 11 to 1 375hp pistons with steel shim gaskets,stock bottom end 2 bolt main block, the old 1969 zl-1 solid cam (262/273 @ .050"), victor jr intake, 850 holley double pumper, tci 10" converter 3500 stall in a th350, 3600 lbs car and driver on 91 octane pump gas with timing locked out at 36 degrees,cheap small tube headers open headers, the car on slicks was turning 11.80 range, shifting was at 7k.

nothing fancy did well for a budget combo, just interested in what that car had in the magazine for it's combo to run similar numbers, my car had homemade traction bars with slicks and 90/10 shocks up front and everything was old stock suspension.


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post #24 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 25th, 18, 8:53 AM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

Back in the 70's I ran a Braswell reworked 500 cfm Holley 2 bbl on a stock L78, M22 with 4.10 rear gear in a 68 Chevelle SS. Not sure what the cfm was after they did their magic, it ran as fast as the factory 4bbl but dropped me into a class that I could dominate. Best time was a 12.99 but it did low 13's consistently. It was my daily driver, drove it to the track, changed the rear tires, opened the headers and raced. Then put the street tires back on, attached the exhaust and drove home. The good ol days, gas was cheap and I burned a lot of it
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post #25 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 25th, 18, 10:59 AM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

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Originally Posted by dyno jonn View Post
There are no comparable classes to these being run anywhere that I know of, so there is no way to compare records.

The cars started out as stockers (stock cubic inches, with blueprinting and modifying allowed) and were based on factory weight divided by factory cubic inches, and then further by carburetion type and also by transmission, as I recall. There was a two barrel division, a four barrel division, and finally a multiple carb / factory fuel injection / factory supercharged ~all lumped together~ division. Internal mods were pretty much unlimited.

I used to race a 67 Bel Air station wagon, 283+060, Forged Trues, Crane solid roller, Edelbrock STR-10 cross ram with two 650 cfm Holley two barrels, with an A1 powerglide, 5500 rpm converter, 5.57 gears and 9 inch slicks. All that and all it ran was was low 12's. Really just a bunch of bracket racers, but it kept us off the streets and busy on Sundays.
This is exactly what the IHRA formula class was. Cars were classed on weight per cubic inch and induction system. I think the heads could be worked maybe an inch into the intake ports and below the valve job into the bowls. Unlimited head work if you wanted to move to a different class. The heads had to be factory available, the 292 turbo head being the best choice for a sbc at that time.

I cannot see enough to read the article but the 2 barrel on the Chevelle was most likely the 6425. It was rated 650 cfm. Bear in mind that a 2 barrel cfm rating and a 4 barrel rating is at different rating of Hg. Four barrel carbs are rated at 1.5 inches of Hg while 2 barrels are rated at 3 inches Hg.
The 6425 was quite unique. I had a 50 cc pump, no boosters in the venturi. Fuel was metered by small holes in the smallest part of the venture which would also be the point of lowest pressure. Jetting was usually best at 82-85 range depending on efficiency of the header system, baro pressure, and camshaft.
The 6425 was about .12-.15 slower in the quarter on a 10.50 car than a pretty good 4779 double pumper. Holley did not recommend their use under 4000 rpm due to the lower air speeds and resulting poorer fuel metering signals.

This brings back a lot of things I didn't realize I still remembered from racing in the 70's and 80's. It sure would be nice to be able to go back.
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post #26 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 25th, 18, 12:49 PM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

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I cannot see enough to read the article but the 2 barrel on the Chevelle was most likely the 6425. It was rated 650 cfm.

This brings back a lot of things I didn't realize I still remembered from racing in the 70's and 80's. It sure would be nice to be able to go back.
True, Braswell two barrels started out as 6425 Holleys, but then they modified the venturi area and added the humongous base plate flaps. People just shook their heads when they saw a two barrel carb where they expected a bigger four barrel to be, especially when they saw the e.t.'s that were produced.

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post #27 of 36 (permalink) Old Feb 25th, 18, 2:42 PM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

It is amazing what a good carb guy can do.
I witnessed this 1st hand at Dean Nickerson performance carbs.
We were at his shop dyno'ing my sons engine and he showed us mods he was doing to a dominator on a flow bench.
He also showed me my Q-850 was in fact NOT and 850 with calipers and a micrometer!
He massaged the venturi's to my 850 and re calibrated it and now a actual 950.
Between the custom Pro Motion/comp cam and his 950 it's razor sharp!

I wasn't a custom carb guy any more as I had one done by a pretty popular builder for my 355 and netted me nothing at the track vs the Proform main body 750 I tuned.

Dean has since changed my mind on this.

73 nova,3515#(all steel)Pump gas!(91octane)406ci N/A, best 1/4,1.45 '60,[email protected],10.6 @ 122.38, short shifting,NO tuning!


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post #28 of 36 (permalink) Old Mar 1st, 18, 8:53 AM Thread Starter
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

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CJ also talks about sharing more on his engine in next month's mag. Hope you can score it!
The July issue arrived yesterday, very good read and as you mentioned the details of the motor are in the next month's issue..currently shopping that one to get it cheap


So, not much about the engine detail in the July article but CJ does mention his 69 SS has a 5.38 gear and a 9" Vitar 4000 stall which only has 3% slippage.


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post #29 of 36 (permalink) Old Mar 1st, 18, 9:01 AM
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

5.38's and good converter help!
It still has to be able to rev tho!

73 nova,3515#(all steel)Pump gas!(91octane)406ci N/A, best 1/4,1.45 '60,[email protected],10.6 @ 122.38, short shifting,NO tuning!


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post #30 of 36 (permalink) Old Mar 1st, 18, 9:46 AM Thread Starter
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Re: 396 2bbl, [email protected] MPH

Another note from the article states the car has run a half second quicker than his class, so this 2 bbl big block has run some 11.8 timeslips.


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