Body Work, Paint/Filler questions - Chevelle Tech
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post #1 of 7 (permalink) Old Jul 28th, 18, 7:32 PM Thread Starter
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Steve
 
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Body Work, Paint/Filler questions

I'm venturing into an area that I know little about, and am going to need some guidance/advise. As a little background, my dad owned a body shop back in the 70's and has shown me a lot, but I know things have changed quite a bit since and want to make sure I'm doing this right (once hopefully...)...

The body of my car has lots of little dents and ripples in it, Both quarters and doors have their fair share of waves, the passenger side door being the worst of it. I have the sheetmetal in a place where the deepest filler should be about 1/8" or so, but my worry is how to make sure I apply it correctly so that my repairs survive without having to redo anything a few years from now. I have been using SPI Epoxy Primer on most of the car, and have the understanding that I should be doing body filler over Epoxy Primer... Right? (Back in the old days my dad said that the best way was to use the filler Direct to clean metal, but they didn't have Epoxy primer then...) If the correct method is to Epoxy Prime, Then filler, When I sand/level the filler, I will undoubtedly sand through the epoxy in some places... Do I need to re-prime before/after each coat of filler?

Then after I get the body smoothed out, what kind of primer should I be using 2K? does color of primer matter? Thickness? I've also heard that some of the primers out there are basically sprayable body filler? I'm not entirely sure what I'm doing and don't want to screw this up if I can avoid it...

Thanks,

Steve


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post #2 of 7 (permalink) Old Jul 29th, 18, 3:00 PM
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Eric
 
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Re: Body Work, Paint/Filler questions

Well, the reason your dad did filler over bare metal and the vast majority of collision shops today do it is because of time constraints, insurance companies only care about THEIR bottom line and not the repair and simply because the metal is not sitting around exposed for several days or weeks like a restoration is.



Just because a collision shop uses one product or process DOES NOT mean its the best process or product for a restoration.


Am a firm believer in getting the metal as straight and back to proper contour as you possibly can. With practice and basic tools, straightening the metal is faster and easier then spreading and sanding filler plus its a higher quality job in the end.


What I would do, take your part strip it clean of any old paint and filler and then sand it with 80 grit. Apply 2 good coats of epoxy primer. Now you can come back and apply any filler over the top of that epoxy, just give it a light scuff with 80 or 180.

Once you are done with the filler work, scuff the entire panel again and apply 1 more coat of epoxy. You can now apply a poly primer "sprayable filler"or 2K urethane high build primer.


If the color of your primer affects the color of the color coat you simply don't have enough coats applied for proper coverage.

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post #3 of 7 (permalink) Old Jul 29th, 18, 8:28 PM
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Re: Body Work, Paint/Filler questions

i have to agree.the better you can get it before any filler or primer the better.i'm into my 66 right now had 2 deep scratches on each 1/4 in front of tires,and had to replace both rear lower 1/4's with patch panels and i am pretty much done with my major filler work and i have less then one small can in the whole car.and probably half of that is on the floor after sanding.
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post #4 of 7 (permalink) Old Jul 29th, 18, 9:16 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Body Work, Paint/Filler questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by sevt_chevelle View Post
Well, the reason your dad did filler over bare metal and the vast majority of collision shops today do it is because of time constraints, insurance companies only care about THEIR bottom line and not the repair and simply because the metal is not sitting around exposed for several days or weeks like a restoration is.



Just because a collision shop uses one product or process DOES NOT mean its the best process or product for a restoration.


Am a firm believer in getting the metal as straight and back to proper contour as you possibly can. With practice and basic tools, straightening the metal is faster and easier then spreading and sanding filler plus its a higher quality job in the end.


What I would do, take your part strip it clean of any old paint and filler and then sand it with 80 grit. Apply 2 good coats of epoxy primer. Now you can come back and apply any filler over the top of that epoxy, just give it a light scuff with 80 or 180.

Once you are done with the filler work, scuff the entire panel again and apply 1 more coat of epoxy. You can now apply a poly primer "sprayable filler"or 2K urethane high build primer.


If the color of your primer affects the color of the color coat you simply don't have enough coats applied for proper coverage.
Yesterday I applied two coats of epoxy primer, and started with the filler this morning. Overall it went pretty good, I sanded through the Epoxy in a few places, so I'll have to touch those up, and I'll likely just put two more coats of epoxy over the filler. We got the dents and damage as close as we could prior do the epoxy primer. The worst area is the passenger side door. It was badly repaired sometime before I bought the car, and there was almost 3/8" of filler in places, and the dent was pulled with screws and a slide hammer. Most of that was fixed with a lot of hammer and dolly work, with some welding in there too... Although it's not perfect, it's WAY better than it was, and the thickest filler (the worst damage on the door) is about 1/8"

The quarters on both sides had more waves than the ocean... We spent a lot of time pulling and pushing. and got everything Very close... But not perfect. I would love to be able to do a better job with metal finishing, but at the moment, I simply do have the skill, knowledge, or experience yet... I'm capable of getting it pretty close, and good about not making stuff worse.

Thanks for the advise, I made sure that I have epoxy below every repair, and am almost to the point of being able to use a 2K primer to block this thing smooth as glass...


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post #5 of 7 (permalink) Old Jul 29th, 18, 10:00 PM
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Re: Body Work, Paint/Filler questions

Just make sure you scuff the epoxy before applying filler to it. And id double check the tech sheet to make sure it is okay to put filler over top of it. Some of the brands and certain kinds of mixes (undercoat or sealer) will tell you not to put filler over top.
And no they didn't use epoxy back then ,but they did have etch primer which is still used. The reason you want to use etch or epoxy on bare metal is because when you grind the metal down you essentially take off the galvanizing or zinc or whatever acid coat it had protecting it. Etch primer obviously etches a barrier back into the metal with acid and thus has a chemical and mechanical bond to the metal. Epoxy is somewhat similar, but has most of the protection strength in the paint. As is it mostly a mechanical adhesion. The only reason you can use it under filler is because it is a thermos set product and will not reactivate with solvents and cause bleed through or filler ghosting on your top coat.
A good polyester primer to use on top of your final epoxy coat in my opinion is Feather fill g2. Basically spray on filler. It will need a final coat of sealer or something on it once sanded, but has a very high build and is easy to sand.

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post #6 of 7 (permalink) Old Sep 9th, 18, 6:54 PM
Mark
 
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Re: Body Work, Paint/Filler questions

SPI says you can topcoat fresh epoxy with anything for up to 7 days after it's sprayed. After that I would recoat after a good scuffing. I use a lot of SPI stuff and love it. Here's a good read on SPI website:

https://www.southernpolyurethanes.com/perfect-paint-job

My shop beater getting coated a little at a time with SPI black epoxy as time permits.

A friends Camaro shot with SPI Universal clear over NASONBASE color.
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post #7 of 7 (permalink) Old Sep 9th, 18, 10:23 PM
Mark
 
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Re: Body Work, Paint/Filler questions

Just read your build thread and noticed you are way into body work at this point. My post here is a couple months late. Sorry. This board moves a little slower than I skim through postings lol!
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