Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris - Chevelle Tech
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  #1  
Old Jan 7th, 12, 9:05 PM
Aceshigh Aceshigh is offline
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Default Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

Is there anyone who has done a side by side comparison of the two manufacturers to determine what the differences are ??

So far I'm seeing
1. Both meet the U.S. Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards.
2. Both have ardent supporters and happy customers in various classics
3. Both have over 20 OEM colors to choose from.


With the 3 point retractable sets
> Andover has sets for $180
> Morris Concepts have 2 options $299 , or GM mark of excellence $350

What am I missing here that makes one worth nearly 2x more then the other ??
Morris rep told me they include all hardware. I'm thinking the few GR8 bolts are a few bucks.
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  #2  
Old Jan 7th, 12, 9:20 PM
don lemek don lemek is offline
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Default Re: Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

I bought a set of andover belts for a hot rod vette. I had to send back the retractors 4 times till I got a set that would lock when under stress and then unlock when the stress was removed. (like factory belts do)
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  #3  
Old Jan 7th, 12, 10:09 PM
novadude novadude is offline
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Default Re: Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

I have a set of non-retractable andover aircraft-lift-latch style in my Chevy II. Very happy with them.
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  #4  
Old Jan 7th, 12, 11:56 PM
Aceshigh Aceshigh is offline
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Default Re: Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

Quote:
Originally Posted by don lemek View Post
I bought a set of andover belts for a hot rod vette. I had to send back the retractors 4 times till I got a set that would lock when under stress and then unlock when the stress was removed. (like factory belts do)
Were each set installed in the car and on a driven test with hard braking ??

Or was this testing manually done by hand yanking on them outside of the car ??

Just curious so I know what to look for with both options.
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  #5  
Old Jan 9th, 12, 10:16 AM
morrisclassic morrisclassic is offline
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Default Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

The ease of installation, assembled, car specific,factory look and our seat belts are tested and assembled in the USA.Our seat belts are tested weekly. All the parts are test individually and if a lot number changes then another test is conducted.The complte seat belt assembly is tested also.

The picture you posted here is a few years old.We have changed vendors and added the soft sash top mounting bracket and top cover. We didn't change vendors because of a Profit margin, we are getting a better product that is tested and assembled in the USA.
Look at our web page www.morrisclassicconcepts for the new style of seat belts. Also look at www.protouring .com in the Safety and Tech Section for a real Life Saving test of our seat belts. Billy
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  #6  
Old Jan 9th, 12, 11:54 AM
sglide sglide is offline
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Default Re: Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

Billy, your links came out incomplete and took me elsewhere. Here is the complete link for Morris - www.morrisclassicconcepts.com.
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  #7  
Old Jan 9th, 12, 12:14 PM
morrisclassic morrisclassic is offline
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Default Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

Thank You, I forgot to put .com

Billy
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  #8  
Old Jan 9th, 12, 1:54 PM
1966_L78 1966_L78 is offline
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Default Re: Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

Quote:
Originally Posted by morrisclassic View Post
The ease of installation, assembled, car specific,factory look and our seat belts are tested and assembled in the USA.Our seat belts are tested weekly. All the parts are test individually and if a lot number changes then another test is conducted.The complte seat belt assembly is tested also.

The picture you posted here is a few years old.We have changed vendors and added the soft sash top mounting bracket and top cover...
Billy,
I realize you are probably busy, but why aren't all these attributes listed on your website? I didn't see anything there about your testing, stainless brackets, Grade 8 hardware, "Assembled in the USA", pictures of the newer design installed (for Chevelles, you only have a picture of the older, outdated design) or maybe a brief explaination on why the design changed. Personally, I also think you should have a blurb about products you are working on (such as the REAR Chevelle belts, especially since you seem to be primarily a Camaro supplier).

Seems like you have alot more to offer, but your website makes it appear like you just offer a "similar" product for a higher price...

You keep mentioning "vehicle specific", with Grade 8 hardware, but based on their website description, Andover offers the same: A "Chevelle-specific" set, with hardware (it is all Grade 8), that easily installs using only the stock mounting points (for front sets). IMO, it doesn't help that your base kit appears to have the same buckles as the competition offers (makes it appear they are similar products)...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andover
All of the seat belts and related hardware are new and manufactured to meet or exceed FMVSS (U.S. Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards) 209,302 and SAE 386 with most manufactured or assembled in the USA..

The 1968-72 Chevelle and 1968-72 El Camino front seat retractable kits include the seat belts and mounting hardware for the driver and passenger. The 1968-72 Chevelle coupe rear seat retrofit kits include the seat belts,mounting hardware and installation instructions for two persons.
You also mention testing weekly, testing to 5000 lbs, but isn't that what the FMVSS requirements are ( the same requirements as the others)? If you are going above the minimum FMVSS requirements, then why not mention it on your website?


I like the new design (soft sash), and I like the "GM" buckles. For my future '66 Chevelle project, I'll be considering the Morris' belts for those reasons (debating between "stock" lap belts or 3-pts all-around).
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  #9  
Old Jan 9th, 12, 4:43 PM
Big White Big White is offline
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Default Re: Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

Ace,

When I decided to replace my stock belts for the convenience of a three point retractable, I looked at everything out there including the Andover belts. My Elky is a completely stock numbers matching car so it was important to me to find a belt system that looked as close to the original GM set-up as I could find while providing the convenience along with the safety and the Morris belts fit the bill.

I was turned off by the appearance of the extra brackets at floor on the Andover product along with that plastic extension piece that attaches to the roof. Everything bolts up like the originals with the Morris set-up and looks near identical to the originals.

I certainly agonized over the pricing difference between the Andovers and the Morris belts but I didn't want to compromise on appearance. I purchased the Morris belts and never looked back. Yes, I had to pay more but I got what I wanted. Perhaps you aren't as picky as me and the Andover belts would be just as safe and you'd save some money in the process. I think it just boils down to what's gonna make you happy.

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  #10  
Old Jan 9th, 12, 5:46 PM
davewho1 davewho1 is offline
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Wink Re: Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1966_L78 View Post
Billy,
I realize you are probably busy, but why aren't all these attributes listed on your website? I didn't see anything there about your testing, stainless brackets, Grade 8 hardware, "Assembled in the USA", pictures of the newer design installed (for Chevelles, you only have a picture of the older, outdated design) or maybe a brief explaination on why the design changed. Personally, I also think you should have a blurb about products you are working on (such as the REAR Chevelle belts, especially since you seem to be primarily a Camaro supplier).

Seems like you have alot more to offer, but your website makes it appear like you just offer a "similar" product for a higher price...

You keep mentioning "vehicle specific", with Grade 8 hardware, but based on their website description, Andover offers the same: A "Chevelle-specific" set, with hardware (it is all Grade 8), that easily installs using only the stock mounting points (for front sets). IMO, it doesn't help that your base kit appears to have the same buckles as the competition offers (makes it appear they are similar products)...

You also mention testing weekly, testing to 5000 lbs, but isn't that what the FMVSS requirements are ( the same requirements as the others)? If you are going above the minimum FMVSS requirements, then why not mention it on your website?

I like the new design (soft sash), and I like the "GM" buckles. For my future '66 Chevelle project, I'll be considering the Morris' belts for those reasons (debating between "stock" lap belts or 3-pts all-around).
^This. I checked out their site the other day, and there's just not enough info, pics, etc. I need more details before I pull the trigger on something like this.
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  #11  
Old Jan 10th, 12, 5:31 PM
morrisclassic morrisclassic is offline
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Default Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

Testing is the responsibility of the manufacture. Simply call them and ask for their latest test data. You will be suprised at some of their answers.
I called one supplier and I asked about year and car specific seat belts they said we have them .I said I am looking on your web page and asked if the picture I was viewing was the exact set. Their reply Yes. I said if I mount it with that bracket the seat belt will be pointing to the driveshaft. Their reply Get Creative and Make another Bracket because there isn't anyone that makes a year & car specific set ,WRONG , We do!

The other companies bracket is a plate with a stud in the middle which isn't anything like our top bracket.
Billy
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  #12  
Old Jan 10th, 12, 6:10 PM
heimjoint heimjoint is offline
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Default Re: Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

I would like to think that "MADE IN THE USA." still means something, instead of "mostly made or assembled in the USA." and I am willing to pay extra for what I feel confident is a quality product, I still vote for Morris......
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  #13  
Old Jan 11th, 12, 7:58 PM
1966_L78 1966_L78 is offline
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Default Re: Seatbelts: Andover VS Morris

Quote:
Originally Posted by heimjoint View Post
I would like to think that "MADE IN THE USA." still means something, instead of "mostly made or assembled in the USA." and I am willing to pay extra for what I feel confident is a quality product, I still vote for Morris......
Understandable, paying extra for perceived quality, as well as paying extra for "Made in the USA". But, Morris doesn't say they were completely Made in the USA, just assembled and tested in the USA... Assembled with imported components?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morris classics
our seat belts are tested and assembled in the USA
Andover states that most belts are assembled in the USA ( not that they are "mostly" assembled in the USA, which can lead people to believe they may have been partially assembled elsewhere)... On mine, I was told they were assembled here, in the USA... The retractors and buckles may have been imported, but is there a US supplier for all those components?

Of course, there are many different retailers of belts... From these threads, we are only told that "some" companies may import assembled belts, and some may assemble belts here using components of unknown origin.

Kind of ironic that while Morris notes that "some" suppliers blah, blah, blah... Yet he makes little to no claims against Andover's products, just general claims against "some companies"...

Supposedly, Andover supplys components and assemblies wholesale... Ironic that some of Morris buckles (brushed body with "chrome" button) look nearly identical to Andover's, yet they aren't copies of actual GM buckles... Could they be made by the same manufacturer? Could Andover supply Morris with components? Or could they be using the same supplier?

Sure, assembled in the USA with proprietory components (the various brackets, etc)...

We'll probably never know...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Morris Classic
The other companies bracket is a plate with a stud in the middle which isn't anything like our top bracket.
And nothing like your previously designed top bracket? Plate and stud, does not make it defficient, just not as "original" as your new style. Is there a functional defficiency using the plate/stud?

Was your previous design (small triangular plate, two holes for the factory roof attachment) sufficiently safe? In the installed orientation, was there a functional difference between your old-style bracket, and the "plate and stud" from Andover?

I agree that the "new" Morris top bracket is nice ( I like it without the rigid extension), Billy mentioned more "correct" and easier rear seat access, but is there a structural benefit compared to previous Morris versions?
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  #14  
Old Jan 11th, 12, 9:49 PM
morrisclassic morrisclassic is offline
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Default Seatbelts

Okay guys this is getting out of hand. We can make our seat belts cheaper but I as owner of Morris Classic Concepts I will not let a few dollars more profit change my views on safety.A testing facility calls our brackets Gorillas.
Questions answered, Our seatbelts are assembled completely and sewn and tested in the USA.

I won't name other vendors and get into a bashing game. Use your common sense when looking and comparing our seat belts Quality.Just simply ask them for their safety dates and data!

Our previous design was strong enough to hold the guy in the 68 Camaro that he was cut out of. Look at www.pro-touring.com in the Safety and Tech Equipment section.We changed design because it is closer to the GM design and as safe or safer. Again this is just our opinion, and a guy that worked in Volvos safety testing.

I would not want to rely on the strap with a stud to keep me Safe.
Bottom line How much is Your and Your Loved ones Safety worth. Spend Appropiately and Compare.


I want to Thank Everyone for Purchasing and Supporting our Products.

Billy
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  #15  
Old Jan 12th, 12, 1:55 AM
Aceshigh Aceshigh is offline
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Default Re: Seatbelts

Morris, few fair questions for you.
I don't see anything listed on your website claiming meeting the 3 FVMSS Standards. (Andovers and SeatBeltsPlus do)
Is there anything that can confirm you're passing these tests for customers to see ??
Is there an agency that certifies the claims or is this just done by yourself ??

I am going to take Morris suggestion and call Andover to find out how their products are certified to meet the Federal Guidelines also.
I think it's important that this is verified somehow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by heimjoint View Post
I would like to think that "MADE IN THE USA." still means something, instead of "mostly made or assembled in the USA."
and I am willing to pay extra for what I feel confident is a quality product, I still vote for Morris......
You're one of many who is under this impression......because it would explain the $$ difference.
Unfortunately there's some confusion about this......read below.

I'm only posting it for clarification. I don't have any benefit to this except
understanding what the differences are. This is not one of the differences.
Quote:
Originally Posted by morrisclassic View Post
Questions answered,
Our seatbelts are assembled completely and sewn and tested in the USA.
The retractors (or "some parts") I was told are Made in Taiwan (or China), but assembled here with the belt setups.
This is with BOTH Andover AND Morris.

"Assembled in the USA" isn't the same as "Made in the USA".
I think both companies make a great product, but this is seemingly an obvious error in perception.

I hope this helps future buyers to not be confused.
I'm still considering ordering a set from both companies to do a side by side comparison for my own 2 eyes.

BTW I really appreciate all of the OBJECTIVE input and shared input from both sides.

Last edited by Aceshigh; Jan 12th, 12 at 3:52 AM.
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