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View Poll Results: How did you like the Lunati 60103 cam in your STREET car?
The 60103 cam was GREAT in my street driven car with a 350/355 cid engine & no pinging 13 68.42%
The 60103 was good in my street car with a 383 engine & no pinging 2 10.53%
The 60103 cam was good, but even on 93 octane there was a little pinging 3 15.79%
I didn't like the 60103 cam due to poor driveability characteristics and/or low idel vacuum 1 5.26%
I didn't like the 60103 cam for other resons (please post the reasons in the thread) 0 0%
Voters: 19. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old May 13th, 09, 2:46 PM
BillyGman BillyGman is offline
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Default Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

This poll is for Lunati customers who have purchased and used Lunati Voodoo camshaft #60103...... ESPECIALLY THOSE who have used this cam in 350 or 355 cid engines. This seems to be a popular and often used camshaft in SBC engines. I'm taking this poll and welcoming replies and comments from Lunati customers based on their EXPERIENCE with using this camshaft.

I'm attempting to gather this information for my brother's 355cid powered street driven 67 Chevelle. This car currently has an Edelbrock Performer RPM camshaft, and he utterly hates it. He says that the characteristics of this camshaft are so bad that he cannot even stand driving his car any longer with this cam in it. The car is no fun for him to drive at all with this cam, mostly because of the poor idle characteristics it exhibits. Therefore he wants to do a cam swap right away. But he doesn't want to install a cam that will exhibit the same driveability issues.

The BOTTOM LINE: He wants to know if the Lunati 60103 camshaft will give him more idle vacuum than the 10" that he's getting now with that crummy Edelbrock Performer RPM cam (he's hoping for a good 17 or 18" ) but he also wants to make sure that with his aluminum cylinder heads and 10.0:1 static compression ratio (exactly) the Lunati 60103 cam will also not be getting him into any troubles with detonation on 93 octane pump gas. His engine and vehicle specs are below and thanks in advance for anyone's/everyone's comments and/or participation in the poll:

full weight 67 Chevelle

355 cid engine, iron block
edelbrock Perfromer RPM aluminum heads 64cc chambers 180cc ports

TH350 trans w/stock gear ratios

2,500 RPM stall speed

3.73 rear gear ratio

26" tire height

headers w/1 5/8" primary tubes

2.5" diameter full dual exhaust

Dual plane Performer RPM intake manifold
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  #2  
Old May 14th, 09, 2:08 AM
BillyGman BillyGman is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

Wow, nobody? I guess that this cam isn't as popular as I thought it was. Maybe it's because a lot of us have been shying away from flat tappet cams, and choosing roller cams instead for the better performance as well as being able to avoid wiping out the cam during break-in. Oh well. So much for this poll.
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  #3  
Old May 14th, 09, 9:23 AM
wildman926 wildman926 is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

That 10-1 compression is a bit much for that cam. He would be better off with the 60104, and giving as much initial timing as possible.

Has more initial timing been given to help with idle?
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  #4  
Old May 14th, 09, 9:57 AM
fabio fabio is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

he might have to get something custom with an intake duration around 230 or high 220's @.050 on a wider lsa. But if going custom might as well just save and go hydraulic roller. If the low vacuum is bothering him he could always convert to manual brakes for about 30 bucks. One of the best things I've done is ditching the power brakes.

Last edited by fabio; May 14th, 09 at 10:24 AM.
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  #5  
Old May 14th, 09, 10:58 AM
novadude novadude is online now
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

That cam is too small for 10:1 and aluminum heads??? That kind of surprises me, as it has some fairly healthy duration figures. I wouldn't think it would be an issue at all, as many are running the XE268 cam (and similar cams) in 350s w/ FT pistons and 64cc heads.
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  #6  
Old May 14th, 09, 11:23 AM
BowtieAaron BowtieAaron is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

i think that cam will work great in a 350-355 with 10:1cr and aluminum heads.
i have a 355 with the 60122 roller. my combo is not too well sorted out, and it runs pretty good.i went 13.6 with a 2.25 60' easing it off the line. with more seat time, it will go 12.9's.

the 60103 is a little bigger than the xe268, and i used to run a xe268 cam, and it ran pretty good. i would only imagine that the voodoo would be a better canidate.
all my cars are street cars.

if it says anything, my 60122 (231/239-282/290, 535/550, 110/106) pulls 18" of vacuum at 900rpms.

aaron

edit.. i also run 20* initial timing, anything less than 16* the car runs like crap. i will be pulling down the total timing to around 34-36 to see how it runs. currently i have 38* total in at 3000.
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  #7  
Old May 14th, 09, 12:28 PM
66 Buick Special 66 Buick Special is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

Billy, I've already given you a review in PM.

I was just going to add that I had 14 in. of vacuum at idle with the cam in my 9.5:1, 355 with 1.94/1.50 heads.

With his combo I'd rather have the 60104 for performance, but personally I like to hear a cam lope at idle, and I'm running manual brakes so vacuum isn't an issue.

I wish I could give you an idle vacuum with the 60104 but I lost my vacuum port when I switched carbs and intake.

If you go to my cardomain page I have idle video of the 9.5:1 60103 combo, the 10.76:1 60104 combo, and the current 11:1 comp. w/ a custom ground solid flat tappet thats in it now.
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  #8  
Old May 14th, 09, 3:49 PM
BillyGman BillyGman is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

I believe that the most initial timing that he's tried is 18 degrees. But I've been hearing that thse edelbrock Peformer RPM flat tappet cams are poor performers and poor designs, so would it be safe to say that it's no surprise that his car is running less than ideal? I've heard that these are simply "lazy" cams.
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  #9  
Old May 14th, 09, 4:35 PM
wildman926 wildman926 is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyGman View Post
I believe that the most initial timing that he's tried is 18 degrees. But I've been hearing that thse edelbrock Peformer RPM flat tappet cams are poor performers and poor designs, so would it be safe to say that it's no surprise that his car is running less than ideal? I've heard that these are simply "lazy" cams.
Well, they do have real lazy ramps as compared to today's standards, and your friend may not have enough converter. The specs are -

adv - 308/318
@.050 - 234/244
Lift - 488/512
lsa - 112/107
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Old May 14th, 09, 6:42 PM
BillyGman BillyGman is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

This is my brother's car, and yes, I told him, and the people at edelbrock told him to use a 3,000 RPM stall speed, but he insisted on the 2,500 RPM stall when he ordered the converter, so I don't doubt that it's hurting his combo. There's no way I'm gonna get him to use the 60104, because it looks like I'm gonna have to twist his arm just to go with the 60103, because he thinks it too radical. He's a stock kinda car guy, but deep down inside, he knows that stock sucks when it comes to performance as compared to many aftermarket applications. But he's convinced that the reason why this Edelbrock RPM cam is a poor performer for a street car is simply because it's too radical, and I think that he's all wrong about that. It's just a poor design.

But because he has himself convinced that this Eddy cam is too big, he really dragging his feet about the whole idea of using the 60103 cam, and has been thinking about the 60102 cam instead, and I've been telling him that he has too much static compression for the 60102 cam.
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Old May 14th, 09, 6:48 PM
dreis454 dreis454 is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyGman View Post
This is my brother's car, and yes, I told him, and the people at edelbrock told him to use a 3,000 RPM stall speed, but he insisted on the 2,500 RPM stall when he ordered the converter, so I don't doubt that it's hurting his combo. There's no way I'm gonna get him to use the 60104, because it looks like I'm gonna have to twist his arm just to go with the 60103, because he thinks it too radical. He's a stock kinda car guy, but deep down inside, he knows that stock sucks when it comes to performance as compared to many aftermarket applications. But he's convinced that the reason why this Edelbrock RPM cam is a poor performer for a street car is simply because it's too radical, and I think that he's all wrong about that. It's just a poor design.

But because he has himself convinced that this Eddy cam is too big, he really dragging his feet about the whole idea of using the 60103 cam, and has been thinking about the 60102 cam instead, and I've been telling him that he has too much static compression for the 60102 cam.
Maybe he should hear it ( or read it) from UD Harold..............
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  #12  
Old May 14th, 09, 8:35 PM
SWHEATON SWHEATON is offline
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Smile Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

That eddy cam with 234 deg dur @.05 in a small 350-355ci motor needs at least 18 deg base if not really 20+ deg base timing and a vacuum advance hooked to full intake vacuum being fully activated at idle to obtain a decent idle with that much duration/234 in a 350-355 motor with auto trans.

Ive installed that cam in sbc's/bbc's and yes it may be an old school design that's outpowed by newer designs . But its not that bad as far as driveabilty goe's when the base timing /mech adv/vac adv/are all dialed in properly .

I would not be surprised if you adv the base timing to 20 (set with idle low like 600-650 rpm to keep mech avd from cutting in messing up base timing setting & plugging off vac adv) . Along with a vacuum adv thats fully activated at approx 2" below the motors lowest idle vacuum in gear when to keep idle stable hooked to full intacke vacuum all the time that gives an additional 12-14 deg timing at idle will improve the idle enough so that he may be ok with it.

I think 2500 stall should be close enough that that cam should idle ok in a 350-355 motor if there's enough base timing like 20 deg along with proper vac adv to work with the lower idle vacuum that cam will produce in only 350-355 cubes.

In summary,before changing the cam i would do this.

Have the mech adv recurved for 18 deg mech in by 2,600 rpms since its a fairly small motor running a farly lrg cam duration.

Then also have a vacuum adv instaled thats fully activated at approx 5-6" vacuum max that either gives 12-14 deg when fully activated or install a vac adv limiter plate to limit it to 12-14 deg max.

Then when you have the dist setup like this try 20 deg max base timing(set with idle low & vac avd unhooked & plugged) + 18 deg mech in dist = 38 deg max total by 2,600rpms.

Also hook the vac adv to full intake vacuum all the time too because the motor/cam needs that additinal timing for better idle & beter idle vacuum too.

I would not be surprised at all if this setup improved his idle just enough to be acceptable wihout having to replace a flat vtapept cam thats alreasy broken in and working ok,why temp fate with a cam change if not needed after setting up the ign timing to better match the cam your running.

Its worth trying this out befoe bothering to do a cam change esp if the motor has no leaks and cam/lifters are all doing fine at this time.

i have dealt with tis same exact issue many times over the yrs where someone was unhappywith idle & or low speed engine perf and i wpoiuld find out ever when they thought they had 18 or so deg base timing they didnt and that the vac adv was wrong for the ild vacuum too .

So when i would adv the baswe timing with idle low to get that right and would also get a vac adv thats fully activated at idle for more timing there too all the sudeen the moroe idle consoiderably better puting smiles on the people faces when that would happen.

$10-$12 for a new vac adv and a tweak in base timing ,and installing a mech adv stop busting and proper mech adv weights from a $12 kit and its been all setup and running better for approx $24 & 1 hrs work or the cost of sending the dist out to have it setup propely as stated above.

Larger cams in smaller motors generally like more base & total timing alnog with the total timing commingin a little quicker too which is why i suggest 20 base & 38 total timing . But thats unless your running vortec heads that require & or tollerate less base/total timing which i dont see listed here in this case,also run 93 fuel with this ign curve setup too.

Give this a try and let us know how you make out & if it improves the idle at all or enough to not have to change the cam/lifters or if it doing this doenst improve the idle enough and your going to install a milder cam.

Could also chance installing new Rhodes variable duration lifters (on your used cam going thru another std cam/lifter breakin again) that will bleed down some at idle . They improve the idle & increase idle vacuum some but they are a little noisey/ticky at times esp on a hot day with a lighter /thinner oil.

Scott
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Old May 14th, 09, 8:59 PM
BillyGman BillyGman is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

Thanks for all the replies. Keep in mind that I was just trying to help my bro out cuz he's very disappointed with the results despite sinking a good buck into this resotration of his. Since it's his car, I can only make suggestions. Sometimes he listens to me and sometimes he doesn't. But that's OK cuz it's his car/his $$ and I have my own challenges to deal with on my car.

But I was mainly inquiring about the Lunati Voodoo cam in question, and I'm very surprised that there hasn't been more people here who have actually used that camshaft. BTW, FWIW, my bro has the "E-curve" distributor from MSD (or something like that). I don't belive that it has any vacuum canister but I'm not positive.

But regardless of any ignition timing settings, the fact seems to remain that nobody I've talked to has anything good to say about the edelbrock Performer RPM cam, ad that is what he wants to get rid of, and that is what this thread was about.
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Old May 15th, 09, 12:29 AM
SWHEATON SWHEATON is offline
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HI BILLY,i got your not so suttlle point of dont bother me with the details i just want to know about the possible new cam i am asking about. But not what might really be the problem that could possibly avoid a cam change etc and correct the crappy idle issues that are the only issue you said was the reason for a cam change.

I was just trying to help since "you said he was only having a problem with the idle" and nothing else.

Thats why i tried to find out what timing he was running and made the suggestions i did because i find 5 of 7 times i hear complaints like poor idle with perf cam its the timing not right for the cam being run and also no vac adv or running the worng vac adv for cam being run.

And like you also stated there's no vac adv being run on his street motor with fairly lrg cam in small motor which is the wrong thing to do for a street motor with auto trans.

The vac adv will add plenty of timing at idle which really helps small motors with a farily lrg cam idle much better. Thats not to mention if the base timng is somewhat retartded like in his case likely being less then the 20 deg base timing that cam needs in his small motor just making it worse .

I bet the bank that if sommebody that knows how to propely dial in his setup worked on it it cranking in more base timing & installed a dist with vac adv for his street perf motor it would idle much better . Heck,just cranking in more base timing without the vac adv will still show you if more timing will help out in this situation. And if it does help and he's more happy with the idle you could then try a dist with vaqc adv thats properly setup andhe would be good to go.

That's where i was comming from trying to fix the 1 issue you posted as his problem to try to save your brother the cost and time of a cam change if the idle was the olny issue that he had that could very likely be fixed of at least significantly improved with proper tuning along with a vac adv dist.

Again,no vac adv on street & somewhat retarded base timing along with auto trans and fairly lrg cam in a small street motor always = crappy idle , crappy throttle responce & crappy low engine speed performance below the rpm where the total is fully in . That type poor perf is often blamed on the cam when many times it's simple setup /dial in issues that are the major problem .

Of course installing a much milder cam like your saying he is going to do will bandaid the idle isssues some due to it having less duration so the milder cam is not as sensitive to less base timing and no vac adv at idle.

But even that milder cam in that motor will not run up to its best perf potential without a proper timing curve and esp proper base timing & a vac adv on street for better throttle responce/increase fuel mileage/cooller running motor in traffic @ idle/& better idle in general,etc.

Trust me when i say that because i have been dialing in street perf sbc/bbc motors for 38yrs now and have plenty of exp doing it . Your brothers idle complaints are commom as dirt with the possible somewhat retarded base timing he's running and a dist with no vac adv on his street pref motor with auto trans .

I see Too many people here in tean chevelle that are running race dist's with no vac adv on the street having idle issues when its the wrong thing to do in most cases,not all ,but 8 of 10 it is on the street with perf cam,period. Not running enough base timing along with no vac adv just makes things much worse without the additional timing it provides at idle with a perf cam when it comes to a poor idle esp with auto trans/fairly lrg duration cam in small motor.

You would be surprised at how much better even that out dated design eddy perfromer cam would run with the proper base timing (min of 20 deg in this case/38 total) & a dist with proper vac adv for idle vacuum attached to full intake vacuum all the time to keep it fully activated at all times for stable timing at idle & of course a better more stable idle too.

Good luck with the new cam install .

Scott
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Old May 15th, 09, 12:47 AM
wotr wotr is offline
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Default Re: Reviews on Lunati 60103 cam please

The E-Curve has a place for running vacuum advance. LJ
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