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  #1  
Old Mar 7th, 08, 9:14 AM
James408 James408 is offline
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Default How primer affects paint color

I have a question about primer. My 69 Firebird 400 is in the paint shop right now. Its being repainted yellow. Probably the same Vivid Canary yellow that was on it. Last time the body shop took a white primer and added yellow tint to it. I've heard that some people will use a straight white primer on painting red or yellow and the white makes the paint really bright "pop". My body man said that they add the yellow tint to the white to make the yellow cover better.

Does primer really affect the paint color that much? And if I go with a white primer/sealer will there be a significant amout of extra paint that I will need. by the way, I'm using Dupont Chromabase.
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Old Mar 7th, 08, 10:50 AM
semeehan17 semeehan17 is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

primer has no effect on paint color at all as long as you get proper coverage. all it may effect is the amount of coats it takes to achieve proper coverage. In my experience yellow takes a little more to get full coverage than say, a red, so if your painter wants to use yellow sealer, great. if he wants to use straight white sealer, great. if he wants to use purple sealer, great (just know that it will take more coats to get proper coverage over that purple). as for how much extra paint will be needed on white sealer vs. yellow sealer?? maybe enough for an additional coat? hard to say but if you're ordering a little more paint than you need anyway (which you should be) it won't make a difference. sorry if this was long-winded. hope it helped!!
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Old Mar 7th, 08, 11:02 AM
Jimmy P Jimmy P is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

Good info above.
The yellow tint to the primer is good for chips or scratches down the road. They won't show up as much. Paint shops might do it also for minor incidents when going through the top coat when buffing the paint out. A minor insurance policy.
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Old Mar 7th, 08, 2:24 PM
Jerry Briggs Jerry Briggs is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

Quote:
Originally Posted by semeehan17 View Post
primer has no effect on paint color at all as long as you get proper coverage. all it may effect is the amount of coats it takes to achieve proper coverage. In my experience yellow takes a little more to get full coverage than say, a red, so if your painter wants to use yellow sealer, great. if he wants to use straight white sealer, great. if he wants to use purple sealer, great (just know that it will take more coats to get proper coverage over that purple). as for how much extra paint will be needed on white sealer vs. yellow sealer?? maybe enough for an additional coat? hard to say but if you're ordering a little more paint than you need anyway (which you should be) it won't make a difference. sorry if this was long-winded. hope it helped!!
You would be better off using a tinted primer. But as for using any color, would take quite a few coats of paint to offset the primer. For instance Interstate Batteries Green like on Joe Gibbs #18 race car is created by using a black primer as a base and spraying the green over. makes a much bolder color. You do have to be careful what color primer you use. Jb
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Old Mar 7th, 08, 4:00 PM
James408 James408 is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

Thanks guys for your responses. I emailed Dupont and they said to use value shade 1 primer which is a white primer. They do not recommend tinting it.
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Old Mar 7th, 08, 7:10 PM
sevt_chevelle sevt_chevelle is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

Primer does NOT affect the color of the basecoat if you have enough paint applied. Without enough paint then YES primer color can have affect but once you achieve color hiding it does NOT matter if your primer was black, white or pink...Eric

The reason for Dupont's value shade system is to achieve color hiding in the fewest amount of coats. Their is system is based off one aspect of color, each color has a black/white equal, if you match that color's black/white equal you get faster color hiding. Dupont's system goes from white to black, no blues, greens whatever its all black and white and shades of grey.
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  #7  
Old Mar 7th, 08, 11:42 PM
Brucebodyman Brucebodyman is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

Dupont's value shade sealer system also helps with color match. you would be amazed at the different shades you get by just shooting the same color over the different shades of sealer.
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Old Mar 8th, 08, 3:19 AM
Jebchevelle Jebchevelle is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

Ok Iam gonna chim in here. I know a couple of painters that have been painting since before I was born let alone potty trained lol. So here is what I was told by them about this when I asked. they said primer does affect the hue or shade of the color IE if you spray gray primer and a green top coat on one fender then spray redoxide primer on another and put the same green on it it sill be a different shade and if you use a black primer still another shade. they have been doing this along time since acrilic laquer was popular. So take it for what it is.
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Old Mar 8th, 08, 11:54 AM
70_chevelle 70_chevelle is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

I paint mostly HOK and Spies Hecker and the color of primer DOES effect the outcome period, especially with HOK pearl base coats. I've seen it time and again so maybe it really comes down to if the base is a solid or pearl and since I dont shoot solid colors I dont know.

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  #10  
Old Mar 8th, 08, 1:16 PM
quitedude quitedude is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

Lee, HOK is a totally different spectrum when compared to Dupont or any other companies OEM finishes. You are correct though.

I've been painting for over 25+ years, and once hiding is achieved on a solid color finish, be it 3 coats or 10 coats, the the top coat will look the same no matter what color the primer is.

Many painters that say the base primer does affect color, simply aren't putting enough paint to cover primer. It's like teaching an old dog new tricks, it's hard.

DuPonts valueshade system is designed to achieve hiding the quickest and save you time and money.

Lets go back to the Yellow you speak of:

I personally would use a white primer to achieve hiding quickly, but my buddy down the road would use grey. He would probably coat that vehicle 4 or more times than I would, to get to the same point I did with a white primer. So it cost him more money and time to do it.

Also a lot depends on shop conditions and technique. That's my 25+ year take on it in a nut shell.
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  #11  
Old Mar 8th, 08, 4:29 PM
ED1966SS ED1966SS is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

If you want to know if the color will be affected by the primer use a black/white checkerboard paint card. Most paint stores have these cards available if you ask. Here's an explaination of how to use them.

"This problem has been addressed in the past by the use of paint coverage cards which include a black and white pattern, such as a checkerboard pattern or half black and half white pattern. The paint coverage cards may also include a hole for color checking with a portion of an automobile which is being painted. In use, the painter coats a card to determine how many coats of paint are necessary to completely cover the black and white pattern so that the pattern can not be seen at all. If the card includes a hole, the color then can be checked by holding the painted card up to an existing portion of the automobile and viewing it through the hole."
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  #12  
Old Mar 8th, 08, 8:13 PM
eyewanta65 eyewanta65 is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

When I recently attended a 2 day PPG seminar (got to play with all their new stuff). They went into great detail about using the correct shade under the base. We were able to acheive correct color in 2 coats of base with this system. If you use the wrong shade under the base it would require more coats to acheive your desired color. Why would anybody want to make a number of unneeded trips around the car, and increase their chances of screwing up their paint job. Not to mention the added cost of more paint. Yellow was one of the examples we covered. You could clearly see a major color difference with the various shades under the yellow base. I would use the shade that the manufacturer reccommends to acheive the color you have bought. Most people put a lot of thought in the color they choose. Unless you want to alter the color you have selected, I would use the correct shade under that base.
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  #13  
Old Mar 14th, 08, 10:41 PM
James408 James408 is offline
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Default Re: How primer affects paint color

Thanks guys, I appreciate it. I just bought a half pint of Dupont chromabase zinc yellow and vivid canary yellow. My painter is going to shoot a couple of test strips for me to compare the two. I advised him to use the recommended value shade 1 and to not add any tint to the paint. I talked to a PPG dealer because I was looking at Lemon Ice and she said to be sure to use a white sealer with that paint. she said that if you use anything else with that color the yellow will have a dirty look to it.
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