That inner head stud with the aluminum block...where did you get it? Part number?
I think the N20 part will change cam choice since you have some serious stuff there it looks like. Normally I would just say cam for N/A...but you appear to be getting pretty serious with the juice.
For N/A with 10.6 compression, the last two cams look pretty big. For example I used an Engle 272/278 on a 110 with .731/.731 in my 540 and it wasn't peaking until 7400 rpm. I ran it that way for a couple of years, but the current 266/272 on a 112 is MUCH faster and gets power in the RPM range I run in. I'm using a 1.8/1.7 rocker setup for adv .774/.731 lift. I still cross the traps at just under 7500 rpm...but power hangs on fine.
Also have to decide what kind of maintenance you like to do. My springs are 5+ years old with lots of street and race miles. On paper the Engles don't look as wild..but I can't complain with how they run.
JIM
Dart sells them, back when I got mine they wern't that bad 50.00 or so, I guess that is kind of pricey for 4 studs, nuts and washers. The shoes are steel, not aluminum and the holes you drill in the heads go straight into the intake runners. I believe they were on an 11* angle. torque is 50 ft. lbs.
This has been my dilmema I will admit. Cam decisions... I really like the shorter 265 intake duration on the Jay Allen grind for the 'street' part of the package. Although the reality is at 3300lbs and with a 4500 conv. plus maybe a 3-spd, my gut tells there will be nothing lazy about the other two at 4000 RPM or even lower. This goes by in a blink once you mash the gas.
I am a high maintenance individual, keeping up on springs is O.K. with me. Changed many in the engine bay before. As at .800 net lift I know they will wear down. If I need to rev to 7800 I want to be able to. I have an 11/32" 2.300 stainless intake valve that has been necked down in the center, but it is still heavy. Regular RPM much over 7500 RPM would not be wise.
I am not going to spray much over 400HP on this set-up. Don't let the intake lead you to think otherwise. There are good reasons I have gone this way.... - two foggers. I don't like controllers for one. With two systems I can avoid having to get greedy on the line. Plus the foggers will be much more tuneable and provide much better distribution.
Thanks for the input, your car runs good, watched the vids!
You probably have too much gear in it, 4.11's with that small tire is going to see some serious rpms at the strip, not too mention all the tq the nitrous is going to make. That turbo 400 on a small tire with a 555 on squeeze might be a challenge to get the first 60'.
No reason to run a nitrous cam with a 300 hit, that is a sneeze for a 555. I do not think 15 * more on the exhaust is neccasary either. I would shoot for something like Jim (540 Hotrod) said 266/272-maybe 275 with as much lift as you are comfortable with. Put it on a 114 (112 ICL) it will drive better on the street and the nitrous will appreciate it.
Have you run nitrous before ? Know how to read nitrous plugs ? You have one of the three best guys in the business (Steve Johnson / Induction Solutions) helping you on the Foggers. Do you have tunes for the Foggers, two stages ?
What is the compression hieght on the pistons ? Did I miss what kind of rings you are using ?
If the car hooks and goes straight 8.50's will be doable.
What fuel are you going to run on nitrous?
Yes, I did think about the 4.11 and 1/4 mile racing, probably not a good idea. Presently it is what the car has in it, is all.
Thanks for your suggestions, but one of the three have to go in. Not buying another.
Just curious if you have ran something like you have mentioned. I don't think it would clean out the cylinder on a 555" on 300+HP. With a 4" collector, street exhaust (4") and the smaller header at 1200HP flywheel the 15* split was decided amongst all guys to be necessary. My heads flow about 70-73% I/E on average, something to think about.
Yes, I have starting tune-ups. I have also been looking at plugs a long time. I did run a NOS cross-bar plate on my 400" SBC in this same car a few years back set-up on two stages 125HP (thru low gear) and 225HP (on top of the 125HP in High gear). Went from 11.30's to 9.60's spinning all over the track on little 26 X 8.5" slicks with a 108 lsa camshaft to boot. 20 years ago I was the first in my high school to buy a NOS powershot 125HP kit and put on my buddy's BBC 70 Camaro..... we sniped alot of guys back in the day being kids..... and the car only ran 12.20's on N50's. lol
JE custom piston, .300" top land, .170" 2nd. 1.270" CD with a tool steel pin. I should be plenty safe at 400HP and the 10.6:1 with good fuel and a good tune up. I am not expecting to have to lean on it hard.
Hellfire Rings 1/16", 1/16", 3/16" standard oil tension
Wondering if C-16 will be adequate.....
Thoughts and comments welcomed and appreciated. I know the camshaft topic is a 'highly' opinionated one.
Here we go....300HP is only a *sneeze*! Man......glad I'm not addicted to that stuff....I'd be like a crack head and looking for the 600HP shot!!
It appears that we can go WAY up on the N20 hit if needed right?
Are the pistons designed for N20 with regards to deck and ring placement?
JIM
Yes they are, only looking to go 400HP though, not wanting to beat the snot of it. I have a couple of tune-ups. Both are small on stage 1 (150HP to 175HP).
helicoil, is that car weight with you or without you in the drivers seat? The T-400 is o.k. if you reduce the rear end gear (try 3.50s) and go with Rossler's TH-400XHD transmission. We have broken the regular turbos and beefed up T-400's too; usually the sprag. You have a lot of nitrous for only wanting to spray 300-400 h.p. shots. You may need extra electrical generating capacity if you use two foggers. One fogger can easily supply 600 h.p. levels of nitrous, going to two puts a lot of extra strain on the alternator and charging system. Be sure to get enough generating capacity to supply the voltage and current at low to moderate engine speeds. Most engines burn up because the solenoids drop out and the engine's tune go way rich (lifts the ring lands) or way lean (burns a hole in the middle of the piston). The way lean condition usually burns the tips of the spark plugs off first, but the way rich condition only creates some black exhaust smoke and is much harder to detect, until engine damage occurs. I agree with John that a 300 shot is real easy on everything. I disagree with John on the best cam. The extra duration on the exhaust lobe keeps the combustion chamber "cooler" in the event that the mixture gets off a little. I like the second cam the best. A rich mixture burns slower and longer and may even still be burning when it exits the combustion chamber which is what lifts the ring lands if it gets too rich. It's only external sign is the headers will overheat too and discolor if they are ceramic coated (they get kind off a frosty color). I'd plug one of the foggers, if it were mine, and run more juice in the other one. Small nitrous tunes in a fogger are kind of dangerous because the jets are so small that they sometimes get clogged with small particles of dirt or debris and then you hurt something. Steve Johnson will know about any of this information and may correct me if i've steered you in the wrong direction. My son runs a much simpler setup but is on the edge with it. Most organization have started running eighth mile vinues because it is much easier to get a nitrous engine to live on the eighth mile.
Yes, 3300lbs, maybe 3350 with me in it. Guesstimating..... It is a 66 Deuce. I don't know the exact weight as I haven't assembled it yet, I do know that Dart Big M is a tank at 265lbs dry. I am basing stuff off of my Outlaw 10.5 Nova, it was all steel minus a glass hood and front bumper.
I was looking at the Rossler TH-400XHD, do you run it? I have seen you post on other threads as well as this one about your son's car. Good first hand experience. I feel the two foggers will provide with excellent tune-ability and be safer than any plate set-up. As mentioned, I am not fond of the controllers, and without a doubt 8noids will draw more current than 4, along with electric fans, a digital 7530 box, HVC coil, at least 2 electric pumps, etc. etc. A 100A alternator goes quick.....As with all of this, maintenance and cleanliness are a critcial part of the game.
Good point about smaller jets and restrictions. I remember on my first 6-71 blown 350 with an Enderle bug when I switched from top only nozzles to ports they were only in the .022" thru .028" range from front to back. I was only making 15lbs of boost in those days. My point being those were tiny holes.
Isn't that the truth:yes:....the back 1/8th is hard on parts. It is alot easier to get something tuned for first 1/8th. The same buddy I put the N20 on back in high school ran an Outlaw 10.5 car up until 2004. He was blown/alky injected 477" making 40-44lbs on good runs in the high 4's. We lit it up more than once at 500'!
Learning of course!
BTW, there is good reason I worked with Steve Johnson on the N20:thumbsup: