It's been 2 weeks since my '66 was stolen, I'm losing my freakin' mind, don't know what to do with myself. I have been thoroughly researching post's (old and new), article's, website's, etc...However, most result in more questions than answers. Basically, I'm soliciting the knowledge, experience, and opinion's of TC members to nail down a 540cid build plan.

IMO, the best approach is to post as much relevant information as possible.
I have 23 years of intimate Big Block experience, all personal and revolving predominantly around one engine. Although I am a trained (U.T.I.'83) and certified mechanic, I no longer do it as a profession.

Like I stated in the title, I'm 99% decided on 540cid, 9.8 deck, 4.500 bore, 4.250 stroke, 6.385 rods, 10:1 compression.
Considering: 305-315/110-119cc Aluminum heads, 2.25 I/ 1.88 E
Remotely Considering: Aluminum Block
I'm a Lunati Guy,100%-tentative choice, VooDoo S/R 255/263 ?
Debating: 950hp; 4500/1050 Dom.
Questions: Air Gap- up to the task; Single Plane- only way to go
Concerns: Las Vegas Summer Heat- 70's & 80's Alum Heads were considered problematic, 2005-modern versions affected less? Would Alum head and/or Alum block be acceptable even with occasional 230*? Will the valve lash have to be excessive (noisy, problematic) to compensate for Alum pieces?

I was very happy with the performance and general characteristic of my now missing 439, this will kind of be an enlarged version (all natura'l, roid free).
old engine; 427+.060; 11:1; iron oval ports (orig.2.06 int) Manley 2.19 I, 1.88 E,ported/mild polished; Lunati 50299(.595I .612E/244I 252E@.050 110 LSA)special grind solid roller cam, lifters, springs, retainers, locks(ordered directly from Memphis); Air Gap; Mighty Demon 850 DP, annular; Pete Jackson gear drive; Mallory Comp 9000, MSD 6a.

Vehicle info: '66 Chevelle, full body, full interior, 3500+lbs; Th400/10", 3.55 12 bolt posi.(lift bars, adj. uppers)

I'll try to add a link to the Dart/Eagle unassembled short block that I am considering

All opinions are appreciated, even the retarded one's. Nothin' wrong with having a little fun.
ATTN: POLITCALLY INCORRECT STATEMENT TO FOLLOW (humor)
I always say,"Hire the handicapped....They're fun to watch"

Here`s a proven build up for you.
In our 534" motor (stock bore) Gen VI block w/4.25" stroke we have starting from the top:
1050 Dom Pro-Systems built that flowed a touch over 1100 cfm
A Dart oval - rec port conversion single plane manifold.
Dart 325 Pro 1 heads home ported.
UD hyd roller 255@.050 .650 lift 110 sep single pattern.
SRP pistons small dome. comp around 9.5:1

JW built TH400 w/ 8" ATI converter and 3.73 gears.
This setup ran 10.19 @ 131 MPH on 93 octane in a 3500+ lb Camaro.

You didn`t say what your performance goals are but this deal just might be what you`re looking for.

I run AFR Aluminum heads and haven't had any trouble in the heat here..... In fact I ran one day at the track when track temp was 140 degrees F... air temp was 104. motor got to 210 by the end of the run and I parked it till it cooled off (electric fan and ice). I also drive it alot around town in 95 plus weather. That's my 2C

Steve

My performance goal in a word, "EXCESSIVE".

Some would call this a travesty, but my Chevelle was, and will be 90% street. Driven more than it should, meticulously maintained mechanically, ready for maximum output at any time, and capable of performing repeatedly.
In days gone by I was a notorious "Stoplight Dragracer", but not in a long time, now I must be content with the run of the mill exibition of power, I can't remember the last time a capable competitor pulled alongside me at an intersection. I want BIG POWER, mostly because I like it, but I share, I jump at the opportunity to put a smile on the faces of friends and family, "sphincter pilates" for everyone. Occasionally I even act my age and do the responsible thing, but I don't always see eye to eye with track officials. One run only, two out of the last three trips to the track, yanked for "exceeding tech".
For the better part of the last 23 years, I could drive a carload of friends to the track, deflate the Mickey Thompson's a couple pounds and collect 12 second timeslips all day long. My absolute best E.T. 11.55 @ 119 was done in just this manner (thorough home prep), a challenge (grudge) match. Promptly booted shortly there after.
I'm looking for similar performance (more), exchanging compression for displacement. Though manageable before, I'd like to run cooler temps and a little friendlier with pump gas, I had been operating precariously on the edge

Why don't you do something different and make a 10 to 1 CR., 571??

4.56" b x 4.375" s = 571.6" motor using a standard deck cast-iron block and 6.45" long custom rods and needed pistons.

Heck, at this size, even a mild motor will put out probably all the power you will want.

S-O-M makes kits that aren't that high-priced to me at all... AND I figure they will furnish anything you want too, your way IF you tell them..

Probably would make at least 700hp easy with no more than a 290 solid cam and a Holley Strip Dom. single plane and a 1000 cfm carb.!! Harold would know more about the power!!

Use a set of 345 to 360 cc port rect. cast-iron heads to hold the cost down....

pdq67

Rowdy,
Your plan sounds just like mine did. I also wanted 90% street and big power yet streetable. Well, It dynoed over 830 hp/700 ft. Lbs torque and I run it right now all on the street. Mainly car shows and cruising. No rush hour stuff. It does get to about 215 degrees in traffic on a hot day. Its in a 70 SS Chevelle. Full body and interior. 4 inch cowl fiberglass hood.
basic specs:
540 CI
AFR 335 CNC heads
Edelbrock Super Victor CNC intake
1050 Quickfuel Carb
.715/.714 270/275 @.050 112 ls solid roller
Isky Red Zone Roller lifters
12.5 to 1 compression (yes I run 110 octane)
Eagle rotating assembly
Dart block
10 inch Coan convertor (tight)
2 1/8 stepped to 2 1/4 to 4 inch collector Lemmons headers. 3 1/2 inch exst.
I configured the motor pretty much with the help of this website! Very happy with the way it turned out. My Engine builder with 30 years experience is very impressed with it too. So much, he is building a copy for his own street/ strip car which already has a 540 in it.
Hope this helps!

Some more "food for thought"....
For 540 you certainly don't need a dual plane intake, you will have plenty of torque from idle on,, ;)
For heads I would want 325-345 for street use & 6500-7000 RPM, a 305 is too small.
The aluminum block & or heads is not an issue with regards to valve lash.
You just need to adjust them about .005"-.006" tighter for the heads & about .010-.012" tighter with heads & block when cold.

9.5-10.5 max is all you need for well in access of 700HP with a good set of heads & cam. Kind of depends on who's dyno you want to believe but 750+ with a solid roller should not be a problem on an honest dyno,,, quite a bit more on some :D

My first choice in out of the box heads is the AFR & for your goals I would use the full CNC 335 or the 325 with the CNC chamber option.
Harold has some excellent cams & I would enlist his advice here but I would like something in the mid 260's intake, no more than 4-6 degrees more on the exhaust with the AFR's, 112 separation & as much lift as you are comfortable with.
.700+ would be nice. Lots of .420 lobes that will make real good power.
For lifters I would prefer Isky Red Zones, only one I will use for a street deal.

A Victor, Dart or Super Vic with a minimum of an HP1000 preferably from Pro Systems specked for your combo. Patrick is very good at this.
Nothing trick here, just solid parts & I think you will be happy with the outcome :thumbsup:

As far as Speed-O-Motive,,, I have no comment,,,
But,, in my opinion,, when building something like this, excellent pricing should probably not be at the top of your list,,,

If I can help with any or all of your parts just hollar,,
I have pretty fair pricing on AFR, Brodix & Isky among other stuff including Pro Systems Carbs

Mike,

I am talking about just an average great big street motor, not a "balls-out" race motor b/c I figure a 571"er, at 5,700 to maybe 6,000 rpm tops will produce more than enough power and it won't need the GOOD high rpm parts is all.

BUT you are right, if BIG power is wanted, then rpm the big motor too!! AND buy the best of parts!!!!!!!

And I have to concur to Gary, Harold AND you on the power that such a 571'er should produce!!

Dam-it, buy the S-O-M stuff, check it over and then use it is ALL!

Like R. Lee Emory, "Gunny", says on "Mail Call", "IF it passes muster".. Price is right to me..

pdq67

TIME OUT: I need a technical time out here. How in thee hades do you post pictures and links. I assumed through the attachment box below, but my efforts have failed miserably. Click "MANAGE ATTACHMENTS", Click "BROWSE", Choose File...... It comes up "ERROR".
Wrong file type apparently, a page that I saved from eBay is "html" but needs to be "jpeg" I guess. And I can't convert it.
How are "links" posted (blue underlined). In particular links to eBay item's, do you have to type the entire address, I can't seem to cut and paste?
Guess we found the retard, huh!
Thanks again, Rowdy

pdq67, I had checked out SOM's website sometime back, I can't remember what it was, but something turned me off, vague listings or something. I'll take a look again, I've seen lots of great companies that have had crappy wedsites, so I really shouldn't use that as my guage.
As far as 571cid, well I've dealt with hot engines so long that I feel like I'm getting Turret's syndrome from tilting my head to look the temp guage straight on, I chose 540 because it's basically a std bore block, plenty of metal to absorb and dissipate heat, as well as, accommodate future builds that I may need or want to bore. I prefer the bore over stroke ratio (even though it's a throwback to days that commonly saw 8500rpm and intake valvestems with two 45* bends in them).

I'd like to see what Mike Lewis might be able to do, and I have a few questions for UDHarold, if your reading, I have ordered direct from Lunati several times, a problem when Holley tookover, eventually worked out I guess because I have done so since, but atleast five years ago. Whats the policy these days. I never had a problem with their SR stuff, they are completely different from the redzone's , how do you compare them?

Just some food for thought...this combo works well for me.
Devastating on the street. ;)

Merlin III block, 4.500" bore, 9.800" deck
Callies Dragonslayer 4.25" 4340 forged crank
Manley 6.385" Sportsmaster rods w/ 7/16" ARP cap screws
SRP #142998 pistons, 10cc dome
Internal balanced assembly
Deck height is .007, with Felpro 1017-1 head gaskets (.041)
CR is 11.09, DCR is 8.2
JE plasma moly rings
Clevite 77 "H" series rod and main bearings
Milodon #30950 7 qt.pan with Milodon pump, pickup, pan baffle and diamond stripper windage tray
AFR 335cc CNC fully ported heads
2.300"/1.880" valves w/1.640 Manley Nextek springs and titanium retainer option
angle milled to 107cc chambers
Comp Cam custom grind solid roller, courtesy of Chris Padgett
295/304, 266/271 @ .050, .763/.742 gross lift
112 LSA, installed at 107
Isky Red Zone solid roller lifters
Comp Cam Hi-Tech custom length pushrods
Comp Cam Pro Magnum 1.7 rockers
Jomar stud girdle
Edelbrock Super Victor # 2927 intake, gasket matched
King Demon RS 995cfm 85 square jets, no PV

Rowdy, Stay away from the 4.5 stroke in the short deck. My son has a 540 in the short deck with 6.535 rod and it moves the pin up into the oil ring land, big time. This is O.K. in a drag race only engine but isn't a good idea for a driver as it requires a support for the oil ring. I'd really suggest a 4.56" or 4.6" x 4" as the best overall best of both worlds with plenty of power and not too high a pin placement, or go to a tall deck. The tall deck doesn't weigh much more and gives you a lot more room for a big rotating assembly.

TIME OUT: I need a technical time out here. How in thee hades do you post pictures and links. I assumed through the attachment box below, but my efforts have failed miserably. Click "MANAGE ATTACHMENTS", Click "BROWSE", Choose File...... It comes up "ERROR".
Wrong file type apparently, a page that I saved from eBay is "html" but needs to be "jpeg" I guess. And I can't convert it. If you want to post a pic from a page that you have saved on your drive you should have a folder that also has the same name as the page that you saved. In that folder, it has all the "pics" of the page ( gif's, jpeg's ect...) Then you can upload the pic you want under manage attachments. To post pics that are somewhere on the web and not on your hard drive go to that pic, right click to bring up the properties box, copy and paste the url which should have a valid file extension for a pic. Heres the url for the TC pic http://www.chevelles.com/navbar/title.gif
If you want the pic to automatically show up, the url has to be wrapped in the .
http://www.chevelles.com/navbar/title.gif
Practice in the test forum till you get the hang of it.
How are "links" posted (blue underlined). In particular links to eBay item's, do you have to type the entire address, I can't seem to cut and paste?
Guess we found the retard, huh!
Thanks again, Rowdy Yes, you must copy and paste the entire address. Cutting is like deleting.

Heres mine

70 Chevelle SS 540cid
About 3600lbs
Merlin II 9.8 short deck, 4.5 bore
Callies 4340, 4.25 crank
Oliver billet rods 6.385
JE pistons 10cc domes
Speed pro rings
Final CR 10.5
Dart race ported oval port heads 302cc runners
2.30 intake 1.88 exh
Brodix HVM 4500 port matched (oval port intake)
BG 1090 King Demon GC
Jetting/ 88 pri 89 sec 5.5 power valves
Air Bleeds/ .078 idle .052 intermediate .028 high speed
Crane cust solid roller .695 lift 272@.050 112LSA installed at 104.25 ICL
Crower solid roller lifters
Isky springs
Crane Gold rocker arms 1.7
Msd ign 16 initial 38 total in by 2700
Plugs Autolite 3934 AR gapped .040
Hooker Super Comps 2 x 3.5
Flowmaster 3.5 mufflers 3.5 dumps
719HP@6000 671TQ@5200
Coan 10in converter 4000 stall
Coan TH400
Dennys Nitrous Ready Driveshaft
Strange Pro 9in center section, 4.11 gear Detroit Locker
Strange 35 spline axles
MT ET Streets 32x17.5x15

Harold,

That's why I brought up the 4.375" stroked crank and 6.450" long custom rod b/c it fits into a standard deck height block.

AND I think JE said no problem with the tight ring stack but I would have to get the letter I sent them out that they returned to me with a note on it to be doubly sure on this point.

As always, just my 2 cents.

pdq67

Looks like we're all doing the same type stuff.

My 540 basics are:

Merlin block- decked to create .009 piston OUT of the hole
Eagle 4.250 crank
SCAT 6.385 H-beams
SRP small dome pistons
Brodix 2Xtra's (365 cc ports)


First version used unported as cast heads with 10.6 compression an old short style Team G with 1050 annular Dominator, an Engle 262/273 on a 112 LSA .672/.675 solid roller. It made 732 HP@6200 rpm. That was with 2" headers and belt driven water pump, no spacers etc. Unreal mid range TQ, but seemed to "fall off" quickly above peak HP.

Second version had heads professionally ported and milled to get compression to 11.06, a lightly cleaned up Super Victor intake with same carb, a 1" spacer and a new Engle 272/278 on a 110 LSA with .731/.731 lift. Much broader rpm range..made 825.1 HP, but at 7400 rpm. Actually it was still climbing....only dropping 3-5 ft lbs per 100 rpm, but after beating on it all day long, I decided rpm range was getting a little high.

Tested 2", 2-1/8" and 2-1/4" headers. Up to 6200 or so the 2" did much better, but above that they were down almost 50 HP at 7000 rpm. 2-1/8" have worked the best overall by far.

I'm now using another Engle cam with 266/272 on a 112 LSA with .731/.731. Everything else the same. Haven't done any dyno testing since cam change, but is definitely likes this one better for my gearing etc.

Best has been a 10.04 and 141 mph at 3600+lbs. Just installed new 'soft lok" clutch to hopefully get it out of the hole better. Using a G-Force 5 speed and 3.07 rear gears.


JIM

Rowdy, Stay away from the 4.5 stroke in the short deck. My son has a 540 in the short deck with 6.535 rod and it moves the pin up into the oil ring land, big time. This is O.K. in a drag race only engine but isn't a good idea for a driver as it requires a support for the oil ring. I'd really suggest a 4.56" or 4.6" x 4" as the best overall best of both worlds with plenty of power and not too high a pin placement, or go to a tall deck. The tall deck doesn't weigh much more and gives you a lot more room for a big rotating assembly.
=
Hi Harold,,
I don't have a problem with the spacer what-so-ever. I have a number of 6.385" rod/4.250" Rats & 6"/3.75" small blocks running around with a ton of miles on them with no issues.
I have a 489" motorhome engine on propane with 80,000+ miles that is still going strong with these parts.
If you think about it, the spacer is actually stronger or "tougher" than the piston & the only place you don't have full piston support is about a half inch at the pin.
Just not a problem in my opinion.

Now,, a 4.250/6.535,,, that I don't think I would like too well for a street
deal :D
Think it might put the rings a little high for reliability,,,

Although I do have a 427 SB or two with a 1" c/h that seems to be hangin in there,,, so far,,,
Also a couple of 347 ford deals with a "pretty short" c/h's too,,,

Mike,

I am talking about just an average great big street motor, not a "balls-out" race motor b/c I figure a 571"er, at 5,700 to maybe 6,000 rpm tops will produce more than enough power and it won't need the GOOD high rpm parts is all.

BUT you are right, if BIG power is wanted, then rpm the big motor too!! AND buy the best of parts!!!!!!!

And I have to concur to Gary, Harold AND you on the power that such a 571'er should produce!!

Dam-it, buy the S-O-M stuff, check it over and then use it is ALL!

Like R. Lee Emory, "Gunny", says on "Mail Call", "IF it passes muster".. Price is right to me..

pdq67 .

Paul,
I am not pickin on your "tow truck engine" :p
I just have certain ways I will build an engine that is capable of 800HP & certain people I deal with when it comes to parts.
SOM just does not happen to be one of them & I will leave it at that :)
I am sure they can supply good quality parts as well as some that I have "reservations" about but I do not buy complete "balanced" rotating assemblies from anyone as what I have seen more often than not from the some of the mail order places "differed slightly" from what I consider balanced & I do not assume because something is new, it is "right"

And as for complete "mail order" short blocks,, I just finished fixing an aluminum 427 small block with about 250 miles on it from one of the bigger well known outfits & the machine work & assembly was,,, well,,, interesting
And there ain't enough space here to go into all the details but suffice it to say the owner was not real pleased & the so called "warrantee" should have come with a used car,,, :sad:

Call me anal but I kinda have one speed when it comes to machine work & I do not claim to be the cheapest shop in the universe when it comes to my time.
If this irks people,,, well,, the door swings both ways :D

Thanks to all for your input:
Harold Sutton; My intentions are to use a 4.250 stroke, thanks for the wristpin/oil ring heads up though

Bill; Pretty close, I think yours will have to remain a little more devastating. I doubt that you have to contend with the summer heat extremes that I have in Las Vegas, at least not on a regular basis. My compression and cam figures are likely to be ; 10-10.5 comp; 260-270's & low .7??'s.

Greg; It looks as though I was on the right track for posting pic's, just about 5 minutes shy of the necessary patience. I have an excellent example for test try...Your build is, so far the most similar, I do believe that most of what I've ingested, suggests a larger head, 345cc. I have one conflict, I already have pretty trick 3" exhaust all the way to the bumper. Using your set up for comparison, I'd be putting more in and sending less out, theoretically counter productive, in reality probably more than enough exhaust, my headers will likely be 2" primaries.

Jim;5 speed with 3.07, That female dog must fly on the freeway

It's pretty consistant that cam 112 LSA's are preferred once the durations surpass the 260 @.050 neighborhood, thus controlling the overlap as the lobes are broadened, are the rest of your cams advanced over 7* like Greg's,
just curious.

Check this out, I've always dug this set up, what do you know, it's available cheap and I have butterflies. $360.00 If I remember correctly 75 lb injector[/url]
posting images....taking baby steps to enlightenment

If you're looking for a cam that should run 24 hours without stopping, I have some.
a Lunati 50299--BBC custom grind---, grind number 02-UR16-UR18-12, is 294/304 at .020, 262/270 at .050, .710"/.710" gross lift, 112 LSA.
The 304 won the 24-Hours of Daytona in a 8500-RPM Pontiac Fiero engine, no valve train problems.
I have more aggressive cams with .723" and .731" gross valve lift. The .731" family I have every 2° from 253° at .050 to over 275°. I have no street longevity numbers on them, but roundy-round racers turn them 8200 for all season on one set of valve springs. In the last few years at UD, they were our best sellers, and often copied by our competition. Another cam grinder paid us the compliment of saying the 261/271 was the Ultimate Sprint Car cam...... The .731" family of course.
We also have a 300/310, 266/276 at .050, .710"/.710" valve lift, and 112 LSA, if you're interested.

UDHarold

Yes, I've had plenty of "life in the slow lane" cars...got tired of it! In fact I just made a 250 mile roundtrip drive yesterday to Beaumont TX from where I live north of Houston. No issues and having freeway friendly gears is a big help keeping temps down. It gets a little warm here too!

Plus you're always ready for those pesky Vipers who think no one is ready to "throw down" from a 70 mph roll! He he he......

I have a 3.25 first gear and I cross the line in 4th with a 1.33 gear...works great.


JIM

UDHAROLD, if you happen back through this thread, what is your opinion of rolling Red Zone's on a Lunati bumpstick. Has Lunati's solid roller's undergone any improvements, not that I had a problem before, just curious.

Jim, it took a minute, your tranny isn't 1:1 in 4th ? Is that stock on that trans, an option, or some, special, gourmet poop? What's your O.D. ratio?

It's a G-Force 5 speed..definitely hardcore stuff, but still works great on street. It's rated for the 1300 hp range,,,straight cut gears, no synchros etc. No O/D....it's 1 to 1 in 5th. I use 1st-4th gears for racing and 5th for cruising. That's why the high rear gears. I make it all up in trans. O/D's aren't fond of major HP hits in the O/D gears. I prefer to use a lower numerically gear set and gain a larger pinion with more teeth for strength. Plus "my" kind of motors aren't happy at 1400 rpm tooling down the road. Gotta get at least 2000-2200 before they calm down...that can be cruising at 80-90 mph pretty easily with O/D.

Ratios are 3.25/2.22/1.65/1.33/1.00.

REAL cars have 3 pedals in them! Nothing more fun than banging gears!


JIM

Those Texas troopers like to see you around the speed limit also don't they Jim?

In my last big block I was using a Pete Jackson quiet gear drive, no problems in five years. Prior builds used Cloyes True double roller. Gear drives seem to go in and out of fashion, or have die hard advocates and desenters, I am leaning towards gears again. Belts are becoming more common, prices are still a little insane and frankly I have a hard time accepting rubber turning my cam precisely. I know better, had similar skepticism when Harley's started using them 20 yrs ago.