: front sway bar upgrade
bubba68ss Jul 28th, 05, 7:28 AM I currently have what i think is a 7/8" sway bar on my 68 (front, no bar on the rear). I picked up a big beefy looking front sway bar for free. I think it is 1" or bigger. It looks monstrous compared to my current one.
Is it worth changing to the larger one? And will a rear sway bar ad any handling performance?
sinned Jul 28th, 05, 9:15 AM Yes, although using springs and shocks is the correct method of setting the roll stiffness of the chassis. Adding a larger front sta-bar and a rear bar will mask the deficiencies of the current selection.
Clint44 Jul 28th, 05, 1:00 PM What size anti-sway bar are you using on the front of your car,Dennis?
I still have the 7/8" on mine but was thinking of swapping it for a 1" or 1 1/8".
thunderstruck507 Jul 28th, 05, 1:12 PM add both, you won't regret it
Clint44 Jul 28th, 05, 3:27 PM Both? It would be kinda hard to add a rear bar to my car.
sinned Jul 28th, 05, 4:45 PM I'm running a solid mounted 13/16" with really long links which make it act even smaller.
thunderstruck507 Jul 28th, 05, 5:05 PM I meant he should add front and rear bars (if rear lower control arms are boxed)
Helped my car a lot. Why would it be difficult to add a rear bar?
vrooom3440 Jul 28th, 05, 6:35 PM I'm running a solid mounted 13/16" with really long links which make it act even smaller.
Gotta ask: why/how does the length of the links affect the bar stiffness?
gUmBaLL68Malibu Jul 28th, 05, 7:09 PM I swapped from a 7/8" to a 1 1/4" the old one was a bit loose when i changed it, but it made a HUGE difference, just go out and get some new bushings. I prefer poly but get what you want.
Clint44 Jul 28th, 05, 7:45 PM I meant he should add front and rear bars (if rear lower control arms are boxed)
Helped my car a lot. Why would it be difficult to add a rear bar?
My car's four link rear suspension would make adding one very difficult. FWIW,Global West doesn't recommend a rear bar with their front suspension set-up. My Elky works pretty well with the 7/8" bar but I might try a 1" or 1 1/8" just to see what it would do.
sinned Jul 28th, 05, 10:00 PM Clint, a very short and sweet lesson in stabilizer bar fundamentals as they relate to swing arm length and mounting effectiveness. Obviously the stabilizer bar is nothing more than a torsion bar mounted horizontally across the chassis and attached to both wheels in order to limit roll by using the torsional stiffness to resist wheel movement by transmitting said forces to the wheel opposite the compression forces. The effectiveness of the sta-bar is D to the 4th. Stiffness is also determined by the link length, a bar with a 6” link is twice as stiff as a bar with a 12” link. Keep in mind the link is NOT the mounting links but the distance from the longest part of the bar to where the bar attaches to the suspension. The mounting of the bar to the suspension is yet a 3rd determining factor in how effective the sta-bar is. More solid mounts mean a more responsive reaction to twisting forces. Running longer end links means more of a loss through bending forces acting on the links themselves. Solid mounting can help to limit the amount of loss in effect canceling each other out. Ideally the stabilizer bar should be mounted so that the bar and its swing arms are all parallel to the ground.
No “A” body ever needs a rear bar assuming the rest of the suspension has been properly set-up. Rear bars are band aids for improper spring selection. Stick axles are already at a substantial disadvantage, albeit by design. The role of the stabilizer bar is to limit independent wheel movement, hence increase roll stiffness. Limiting independent wheel movement is also contrary to improving suspension handling characteristics. Ideally each wheel should be able to move independently of any other wheel and in affect allow the chassis height to remain virtually unchanged as it moves down the road. Obviously this utopia is not possible as the spring rates would be far too high to be comfortable (ala, F1 car). The stick axle already has both wheels tied together, adding a rear bar simply locks them together, not a good idea. A much better idea would be to select spring that limit roll stiffness enough to accomplish whatever goal you are aiming at and tune the front to counter under/over steer conditions.
Remember that a car that feels tight cornering is not necessarily a car that handles well.
I wish we could get one of the “great handling cars” from the site with all the poly bushings and big stabilizer bars out on the track for a day to see exactly how big of a difference proper part choice and spring/shock selection can make. I would be happy to represent the “other” side of design theory.
edit- I should note that most would prefer to lock the axle and run the rear bar rather than suffer some minor harshness while driving to have the correct spring rate.
thunderstruck507 Jul 29th, 05, 11:41 AM interesting info Dennis
Once I get stiffer front springs and good shocks all around I might play with that a lil.
bubba68ss Jul 30th, 05, 2:20 AM i just tried to install the sway bar i got (1 1/4") and it doesnt FIT! Well, it fits, but it barely rubs on the from on both sides (right where the bar curves up). WTH? Is there any special mods i have to make or something???
bubba68ss Jul 30th, 05, 5:17 AM nevermind. I just moved the mounting brackets foward about 1/2". That solved the problem!
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