ok guy's, the bottlerat is up at the body shop.and it is a former vinyl top car.it has the typical rust pitting on the roof.my question is.what is the best way to get all of the rust out of those pits? could I use muriatic acid? or is there some other product out therethat will make sure that I get all of that nasty stuff out of there. to prevent problem's down the road after the car is painted.thanks ahead of time.

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Don Edmonds
T.C.Member 1033
1969 Chevelle
2000 Harley softail deuce
www.bottlerats69.homestead.com

I've seen a product called extend in a spray bomb thats suppose to ''kill'' the rust and stop further rusting and make a paintable surface.A couple buddies of mine used it on their daily drivers seemed to work.I think eastwood carries similer stuff,what about por 15 or something along that line.
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Brett
'67
SS396
clone

that's what I'm trying to figure out.i want to make sure that I get all of the rust out or neutralized.so it doesn't come back to haunt me later on down the road.i mean I've got the car down this far and i want to use something that someone has used so i know that this is a done deal.

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Don Edmonds
T.C.Member 1033
1969 Chevelle
2000 Harley softail deuce
www.bottlerats69.homestead.com

I think the best way to make sure the rust is gone and stays gone, would be to bead or sand blast all the rusted spots,till you can no longer see any rust, Then use a chemical rust converter, then use a primer sealer. That I think is the best way! Worked for me.

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SS 327 65 malibu
SF CA
1965 SS
There is Nothing like An SS Made your way
65 SS Chevelle (http://members.nbci.com/ss454maliy/)

yea I sand blasted the frame and firewall. but it is such a p.i.t.a.,and not to mention the sand is a real joy to clean up.i'd like to find a chemical that would take care of it.i mean it's at the bodyshop waiting for body work and paint.if I have to sand blast I will but I hope there is a easier way.

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Don Edmonds
T.C.Member 1033
1969 Chevelle
2000 Harley softail deuce
www.bottlerats69.homestead.com

DON'T I repeat, DON'T sand blast the top!!!! You will warp the sheetmetal. Instead, use a soft media like plastic, which you can order from Eastwood. Or use walnut shells. Either will work. Soft media like walnut shells or plastic beads will remove the paint without heating up the sheetmetal and causing warpage. If the plastic media is too soft to cut the rust, and it could be depending on how much rust there is, then you may have to use a stainless steel wire brush and go at it by hand. I'm not sure about using chemical neutralizers. That's something that I'll have to look into a little further. I know they dip whole car bodies and sheetmetal parts in stripper solution, but I don't know of a product you can use as a spot treatment like you need. A lot of the chemical products will cause problems down the road.
After the rust is removed, then spray it with an etching primer, followed by sanding primer which you'll sand and reapply as needed to get a smooth finish.

[This message has been edited by Randy Mosier (edited 01-23-2001).]

guys take a look at my web page.and you will see that I have the car striped down to bare metal.the top has a few little rust pits.that I won't feel comfortable with. until I make sure that I've got all of the rust neutralized.i've used muratic acid on motorcycle tanks and it cleans them very nice.would it hurt to try some of this on the pits on the roof.

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Don Edmonds
T.C.Member 1033
1969 Chevelle
2000 Harley softail deuce
www.bottlerats69.homestead.com

Bottlerat, do not use chemical rust converters! Primer and paint will not stick. Load up your sandblaster with a fine grade of glass beads and just blast the pits until they are clean. Then use PPG DP primer (epoxy), let cure 24 hrs. and apply filler on top if needed. After curing and working filler, follow with PPG K36 sandable primer. I also use the DP primer as a "wet on wet" sealer before spraying the base coat so these type spots will not show up later.

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Chevelles forever....Member #401
67SS w/dual-quad 509
71SS454 LS5 (http://chevelles.com/showroom/71SS454-1.jpg)
97 C5

thanks 509,where is the best place to get some of this fine glass beading? and your saying that there is no chemical rust converter or neutralizer that I can use and sleep easy.

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Don Edmonds
T.C.Member 1033
1969 Chevelle
2000 Harley softail deuce
www.bottlerats69.homestead.com

I used a product called Zinc Oxide chemical conversion coating on my lower quarter panels where I had to weld in some used patch panels. The paint has been on for about 6 years or so and have no lifting problems. This chemical converts rust into zinc and the metal turns a gray color. You may want to aska few bosy shops, but I have had no bad experiences with paint lifting. Also, you have to use rubber gloves and scrub witha scotch brite pad. then rinse with clean water.

I also did my mini-tuns and trunk floor inside and out.

BTW, we roughed up the area with a 36 grit disc to give the filler and primer a "tooth" to bite into (patch panels)(after the chemical process).

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Todd Geisler
79 Malibu
11.16@125.8mph
Malibu Muscle
http://www.MalibuMuscle.cjb.net

[This message has been edited by Todd Geisler (edited 01-23-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Todd Geisler (edited 01-23-2001).]

Todd where did you find this stuff.how was it to sand. and how long does it need to set up before you can work with it.i've seen your car and it looks like a first rate job so.if it has worked for you. I guess it will work for me.Thanks, Don

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Don Edmonds
T.C.Member 1033
1969 Chevelle
2000 Harley softail deuce
www.bottlerats69.homestead.com

Chemical conditioning is OK for treating metal IF used correctly. But, if an acid -based solution is not completely removed before priming, IT CAN and WILL come back to haunt you. Temperature changes can induce a 'leaching out' effect also. Acids react with the primer's bond with the metal. Rust converters- NO WAY! On a panel as large and as prominant as your roof, I wouldn't take any chances. I would DA the rust areas with 40 grit, and then bead blast the rest of the pits. Finish off with 80 grit, then use a self etching primer. Top that with a quality urethane primer. As far as warping the metal goes, you can warp it and distort using any abraisive methods. Grinding, sanding, wire-wheeling, bead/sand blasting. Anything that heats the metal. You just have to be careful! Don't heat the metal while you are doing whatever you are doing. I wouldn't use SAND anyway. It has the greatest potential for disaster. Do want you want, but I don't know of any professionals that would trust any acids, converters or chemicals of any kind to prevent rust from coming back through the paint. All paints 'breathe'. That means that oxygen/air still can 'feed' rust that's not removed completely. Rust is carbon steel that is oxidized AND oxidizing. POR 15 is supposed to totally seal the metal from the air and converts rust at the same time. That's why it works. However I wouldn't use it on a finish or outer panel. It dosen't stick well to a smoothly sanded surface. I've seen it peel off before.

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Triple Black 69 SS 396

jimmy what do you recommend as far as the type of beads I should use?I have a little hand held blaster.that would be perfect for this but I'm not sure what beads to use and where to get these matrieals.any help you could give me on this would be greatly appreciated.

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Don Edmonds
T.C.Member 1033
1969 Chevelle
2000 Harley softail deuce
www.bottlerats69.homestead.com

If you don't have an auto body supply store close by, go to Eastwood. They have the medias you want. That little blaster you have sounds perfect for the job!

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Triple Black 69 SS 396

Len over at http://www.autobodystore.com sells a product called rass-o-nil and swears by it. It's a rsut convertor and is approved for use under epoxy primers. Go check out the discussion group there and do a search.

Cam

cam, I just spoke with Len at the auto body store.and he was very helpful.thanks a million for your post.it was just what I was looking for.Don

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Don Edmonds
T.C.Member 1033
1969 Chevelle
2000 Harley softail deuce
www.bottlerats69.homestead.com