steering column bearing? [Archive] - Chevelle Tech

: steering column bearing?


fusion_ta66
Apr 13th, 05, 7:13 PM
Can anyone identify this bearing, it surrounds the steering shaft right in the center of the turn signal device. The car is a 65 chevelle. I need to get a new one, this one has a ton of play in it. Can anyone tell me where to get one?

http://fuse.bazookaboard.com/steering.jpg

BAD415
Apr 13th, 05, 7:57 PM
Did you remove the screws that hold the bearing in place?
If they are missing that would be the source of alot of slop.
I couldn't tell you where to get a new one.
Your best bet would probably be a junkyard.

hrd
Apr 13th, 05, 8:31 PM
if all the balls are there and round...just grease and tighten like any bearing set, i just went through the same deal

540cutlaSS
Apr 13th, 05, 11:31 PM
You can still get that bearing from the dealer.

fusion_ta66
Apr 13th, 05, 11:31 PM
Yes I do have the screws, I just had taken them out for this pic. When you say 'tighten' the bearing set, do you mean tighten the nut that goes on the end of the steering shaft?

540, do you happen to know the part number? Is it for the bearing or the whole turn signal piece?

Jim Mac
Apr 13th, 05, 11:57 PM
I don't know if the bearings are in a cage but if they are loose yu can buy individual balls at ace hardware,. Jim

shooter
Apr 14th, 05, 12:00 AM
The bearing only, from old post is 5679205. Same as Corvette and Impala.
http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31281&highlight=corvette+bearing

540cutlaSS
Apr 14th, 05, 12:05 AM
I do not have part #, but I think that size bearing is very common on most columns. A dealer would be able to help. I made my own column from stainless steel and all new GM guts. I was supprised what was still available.

Jesse66Original
Apr 14th, 05, 7:44 AM
Do you still need the pn# for this bearing? If so I can send it to you, also the lower bearing was not available from the dealer in 2000 when I did my frame off on my 66, if you need that pn# and where to purchase it let me know also. Hope this helps.

Jesse Robertson

WayneK
Apr 14th, 05, 8:55 AM
I have rebuilt a number of 64.66 columns.. and it's my understanding the bearing your referring to is part of and molded into the turn signal switch have that be a Guide or BPC switch.. you pre load it with the spring and top nut .


If the top is loose/bad how is your bottom bushings condition ?

True Connection in CA has all the stuff you need to rebuild a early column.

fusion_ta66
Apr 14th, 05, 9:11 AM
Wayne,
So the bearing is not available separately? What spring are you referring to?


Jesse,
Yes please post the part number you used.

1966_L78
Apr 14th, 05, 12:20 PM
Very interesting... I just posted (like 4-5 minutes ago) in the "Electrical" forum about this very same thing (but for a 66, inquiring if it was part of the signal switch, etc...)

Jesse, I am going to email or PM you...

Brob
Apr 14th, 05, 7:22 PM
These bearing part numbers are 63-65 Corvet.

Steering Column Bearings for 64 & 65 Chevelle available from your Chevrolet dealer

Upper bearing #5679205 cost $12.61

Lower Bearing #7802845 cost $19.12


Thes cost are a couple years old.

This was for my 64 non-tilt. I replaced my old one just for GP. Nothing was wrong, I also thought there was a lot of play but the new one had slop also. It looks like you should add a couple of bearing but that is the way it is. There are 19 bearings.

During the assembly, I remember something touching the edge of the bearing to hold the bearing in place. I am suffering from KRAFT so it is not clear what I did when I put it together a couple of years ago

If you can't find one let me know. :thumbsup:

Jesse66Original
Apr 15th, 05, 7:29 AM
OK guys, Brob is right on the money with the upper bearing PN# 5679205, cost was $9.58 back in 1999. However at that time I was told the lower bearing was discontinued from GM, if that is still the case here is where I got mine from, there is no PN# on their invoice.

Gary's Classic Chevy Parts
1209 Castle Street
Dallas, Tx.
214-948-1831 or 214-698-8321
Fax 214-948-9408

The bearing was a bit pricy but I could not find one, $21.49 including shipping.


Sorry for not posting sooner but I was busy getting the 66 ready for a Car Show tomorrow and went to a Car Club meeting last night.

Jesse

Street's Classic Chevy Parts

Rich-L79
Apr 15th, 05, 11:47 AM
When you say there is lots of slop in the column are you basing that assessment AFTER you've removed the steering wheel? The canceling cam has a cone shaped nose to it that is pressed into the switch/bearing combo by the spring which is behind the wheel and on top of the cancelling cam. Once the wheel nut is tightened down it's unlikely the bearing will be found to be loose if all the ball bearings are still in the race. Reassemble things once greased before you decide the bearing is loose. Without the cancel cam and spring in place none of it will fit together tightly.

fusion_ta66
Apr 15th, 05, 1:26 PM
Rich,
Thanks for your reply. I had lot of slop in the steering before I took the wheel off. I am still unaware of this 'spring' that has been mentioned. My column had no spring. Does anyone have a picture? Also, what is the 'cancelling cam'? How tight should the wheel nut be?

Rich-L79
Apr 15th, 05, 1:32 PM
There are three major components behind the wheel: the keep-things-tight spring, the cancelling cam and the turnsignal switch. Without the spring and the cam you are in real trouble! I wouldn't drive it without those components in place!

I have some photos of all the parts in and behind the wheel I took for someone else years ago. There are a number of horn mechanism parts in there too but those are all housed in the hub of the steering wheel. I'll post the photos later tonight when I get home.

The steering wheel nut should be tightened down as far as it will go (it will bottom out on the steering shaft). Tighten it to about 35 lb/ft.

fusion_ta66
Apr 15th, 05, 1:34 PM
Rich,
Well I definitely didn't have any spring in there. Sounds like an important piece. Could you please post those pictures if you can? Does anyone have the part number for this spring? Does it slide over the steering shaft in between the bearing and steering wheel?

Rich-L79
Apr 15th, 05, 1:54 PM
Rich,
Does it slide over the steering shaft in between the bearing and steering wheel?

Exactly. It is directly behind the wheel. It fits into a recess in the cancelling cam. The wheel then presses on the spring which presses on the cam which presses it into the bearing cup on the turnsignal switch.

The cancelling cams used to be real hard to find but they are reproduced now.

I'll post pictures later after I get home and place my Competition Products order (BBC parts for the wagon!) before they close for the day! If I can't find the photos I took I'll bust the wheel off my coupe and take new ones. Gotta love digital camera photography.

fusion_ta66
Apr 15th, 05, 1:56 PM
Is the cancelling cam in my picture I posted in the first post?

fusion_ta66
Apr 15th, 05, 2:28 PM
OK, I think I found the cancelling cam. Is this it?

http://fuse.bazookaboard.com/ccam.jpg

Now I just need to get this spring figured out. Does anyone have a part number? If not, can I just pick one up at the hardware store? How stiff is it? What is the length?
PS Rich thanks for all your help.

Rich-L79
Apr 15th, 05, 2:31 PM
Sure looks like it. The finger sticking out with the red retainer is your horn contact if you didn't know. The depth of that contact is important to make your horn button work right.

Anyway, the large shouldered hole right in the middle is where the spring you are missing resides. I might even have a spare spring if you can't find one elsewhere. I'll root around in my junk parts box. It's a large box since I've owned a '65 or two at all times since 1979 and I've had a number of parts cars and I rarely throw anything away!

fusion_ta66
Apr 15th, 05, 2:34 PM
Well, my horn didn't work, so what can I experiment with now that the wheel is all apart?

Rich-L79
Apr 15th, 05, 2:41 PM
I'd venture a guess you are missing more parts. Behind or in the horn ring (or horn button if it's a 300) are three more parts, two are sandwiched between the horn ring and the steering wheel and one is inside the horn ring. The one in the horn ring is a red retainer ring (sometimes it's faded and may be more pink or off white) that holds the three screws that hold the horn ring to the wheel. The other two are a disc of flexible metal and an off-white nylon disc that go between the wheel and the horn ring. The flexible disc is what give the horn ring "spring" and is what contacts the horn contact from the cancelling cam (the finger of the cancel cam sticks through a hole in the wheel) when the horn ring is depressed thus making the electrical connection and honking the horn. I can see from the photo that the cancel cam has the contact and it's little red retainer. You are doing well there since the finger is usually broken off or the retainer and contact and spring which is behind the contact are missing.

The series of photos I have include photos of these horn parts too.

Another reason your horn doesn't work is that the contact built into your turnsignal switch is broken or missing. This contact connects the wiring in the switch to the cancelling cam (see the metal disc on the backside of the cam?).

By reviewing your first picture the turnsignal switch has the cancel cam/horn contact in place so that's good.

ASB
Apr 15th, 05, 2:45 PM
Look above the bearing in the picture. It looks that there is a large opening in the plastic. is the bearing seated all the way in to the plastic housing. Is the sheet metal bushing below the spring below the turnsignal cancelerbushing missing? The more I look at the picture it looks as the plastic is hogged out around the bearing.

Rich-L79
Apr 15th, 05, 3:12 PM
There should be a couple phillips head screws that hold the bearing cup in place in the turnsignal switch. I think he said he had the screws. Those screws hold the bearing cup firmly in the switch. If those screws are missing, it's possible the bearing has been banging around grinding an oversized hole in the switch body.

fusion_ta66
Apr 15th, 05, 3:15 PM
I do have all the screws. I think the main problem was/is that I have no spring in the assembly. I ordered a new upper bearing just to be safe. Hopefully you can post those pics later Rich, as I am looking over all the parts I pulled out I'm not sure I remember exactly how they go back together again!! haha

Rich-L79
Apr 15th, 05, 3:21 PM
I'm not sure I remember exactly how they go back together again!! haha

If I recall correctly, that's exactly why I took the photos for the other guy! :D

Rich-L79
Apr 15th, 05, 9:45 PM
I couldn't find my old photos so here is a whole new set.

Let me know if you need to know anything more.

http://heartland.chevelles.net/RCstorage/horn1.jpg

http://heartland.chevelles.net/RCstorage/horn2.jpg

http://heartland.chevelles.net/RCstorage/horn3.jpg

http://heartland.chevelles.net/RCstorage/horn4.jpg

http://heartland.chevelles.net/RCstorage/horn5.jpg

http://heartland.chevelles.net/RCstorage/horn6.jpg

http://heartland.chevelles.net/RCstorage/horn7.jpg

http://heartland.chevelles.net/RCstorage/horn8.jpg

http://heartland.chevelles.net/RCstorage/horn9.jpg

http://heartland.chevelles.net/RCstorage/horn91.jpg

fusion_ta66
Apr 15th, 05, 10:42 PM
Rich,
I am unbelievably appreciative that you took apart your steering column for these pics. Thank you very much. About how stiff is that spring? Can you compress it all the way down with your index finger and thumb?

WayneK
Apr 16th, 05, 9:02 AM
Rich.. you are the MAN..... :)


not to be a smart A$$ fusion 66. it might be a good idea to get a service manual.. it has GREAT exploding views of columns, the bearings and the total dimension to set the shaft length in the steering column when new bearings are installed,,,

Brob
Apr 16th, 05, 11:35 AM
I went through this spring problem on my 64. I found a spring at the Long Beach SWAP form a guy that restores Mustang steering columbs. I posted his business information last year on this site. He actually had the springs made and gave me one.

Thanks to TC new features I found this information :cool:

I found my spring.

J&I “Detroit Ironn
12718 Longworth Ave.
Norwalk, Ca. 90650

562 863 0556
Cell 562 896 0556

ASB
Apr 16th, 05, 1:57 PM
Rich, Wasent there a sheet metal spacer under the spring and the cancelling cam facing the bearing? it's hollow and the taperd end faces the bearing.

Chris R
Apr 16th, 05, 7:36 PM
Do you need any special tools to rebuild a column? Is there any exploded views available? I dont recall seeing one in the service manual but never really looked.

Rich-L79
Apr 16th, 05, 9:28 PM
Rich,
I am unbelievably appreciative that you took apart your steering column for these pics. Thank you very much. About how stiff is that spring? Can you compress it all the way down with your index finger and thumb?

The spring is pretty stiff. You can compress it a little with your fingers, but not all the way to full coil bind.

I found an extra so PM me and I'll get it off to you. I also have a spare nylon "rocker" if you need one of those. Do you have all the other parts and are just missing the spring?

ASB: No, the spring fits on top of the cancel cam. The back side of the cancel cam has a tapered end that fits into the bearing. The spring pushes the cam nose into the bearing cup and thus holds the steering shaft in place. The cancel cam fits snug on the steering shaft. The bearing actually turns against the nose of the cancel cam.

Rich-L79
Apr 18th, 05, 10:05 AM
The spring is off in the mail today. The only thing you owe me is to post back here with the results of your steering column rebuild.

fusion_ta66
Apr 18th, 05, 11:19 AM
Thanks again Rich. You've truely been an enormous help.

ASB
Apr 18th, 05, 5:14 PM
Looking at the original picture, The hole for the bearing is hogged out in the plastic. that causes the slop. Look below the right arrow. Also note the piece missing at the top of the origional picture, compare with new picture. It holds the turn signal on in the right turn position. You will have to replace the whole switch. Note there was 2 differnt turn signal switches in 65. Early & late yours is the later style. (all Plastic)
They are not interchangable. They use differnt cups. The early model has a pot metal base (the part the bearing sits in ) the early one has the turn signal lever about 1 1/2 in higher then the later one (thats why the cup is differnt)

fusion_ta66
Apr 19th, 05, 8:24 AM
I don't think the plastic is hogged out, the bearing is not seated in the cup in my picture, it's sitting forward a bit. You are right that the piece at the very top that turns off the turn signal is broken off. I've just been living with it. How much is a new turn signal piece?

MedicTed
Apr 19th, 05, 8:44 AM
Ground Up has all of that stuff. The turn signal switches are in the electrical section and the cancelling cams and other column pieces are in the interior section. http://www.ss396.com/catalogue_chevelle.htm

fusion_ta66
Apr 21st, 05, 12:34 AM
Well, hats off to Rich. The spring was the big problem, once I put that in my problems were solved. The new bearing I got was slightly tighter too, but the spring was the huge improvement. Thanks again Rich for all your help, you are truly a good Samaritan!

Rich-L79
Apr 21st, 05, 10:09 AM
Glad to help and it's good to hear the problem is solved.

If you decide to replace the turn signal switch let me know. There is an easy way and a hard way to replace it, the hard way requires disassembling the column and the easy way does not.

fusion_ta66
Apr 21st, 05, 11:10 PM
I sure will Rich. Thanks again.

ASB
Apr 22nd, 05, 1:01 AM
Hi Rich. Mind telling the rest of us the easy way?

Rich-L79
Apr 22nd, 05, 2:04 PM
Hi Rich. Mind telling the rest of us the easy way?

The easy way can only be done if the wiring from the switch to the harness is sound as you will be reusing it and leaving it in place in the column. For clarification, the "hard way" is to replace the switch and switch/coulmn wiring as a complete unit which requires disassembly of the column beyond removing the steering wheel and the horn actuating components.

The "easy way": once the steering wheel and cancel cam have been removed, the turnsignal lever also needs to be removed. It is held on by one screw. Then the screws that attach the switch to the column housing need to be removed. Once the screws are removed the switch can be pulled a short way out of the column. Sometimes the wiring pigtail is too short to allow enough slack to get the switch past the end of the steering shaft. If so, gently pull and push the wiring to allow enough slack to clear the steering shaft.

Once the switch is free from the shaft, look at the back side of the switch and you will see where the wiring clips into the switch. Using a small flat blade screwdriver, pry the clip arms back to release the wiring terminal. One more wire goes to the horn contact. Using a small pick pry the locking tabs on the back of the wire terminal in so the wire can be removed. Once removed, the spring and contact are free so if you need to reuse them or which to save them as spares, make sure to pull them out and put them somewhere safe.

Now you can attach your new new switch to the old wiring harness. You will have to remove the wiring harness from the new switch in the same manner as outlined above. The clips inside the harness terminals can become displaced so make sure they are all snug in their clips before you plug in the terminal. Then push the horn contact wire which will lock in place thus retaining the spring and contact. From this point you can reinstall the switch, horn compnents and steering wheel.

A word of caution. Some switches do not have enough wiring harness slack to clear the steering shaft which may indicate you'll have to replace the switch an harness as a unit. Also, the wiring is sometimes the problem more than the switch, so you may WANT to replace the switch and harness as a unit. Since space to work is limited, be sure you have enough wire slack before attempting the "easy way". It is possible to disconnect the wiring harness without clearing the steering shaft (such as when the wiring is too short to let the switch clear the shaft), but it is real difficult to see and feel what you are doing and you risk breaking something or misconnecting the new switch.

If you need to replace the switch and harness as a unit, sometimes it's just as easy to pull the column as a whole and work with it outside the car and then reinstall the column as a complete repaired unit when the new switch is installed.

1965_Malibu
May 14th, 05, 10:06 PM
Rich, you wouldnt still have those photos, would ya? I assume you have taken them down since they dont show up.