Does the crank keyway point in line with the timing mark on the balancer? We were checking ours tonight and I noticed that when the motor is at TDC the marker points straight up! My brother is absolutely positive he put the crank gear on using the proper keyway (straight up).

Please help! We need to get this motor together! Do we need to buy a new balancer?

Hey TH,
Don't get pxxxxd at your brother. GM made balancers with two different keyway orientations, and they both fit any smallblock. One has the keyway in line with TDC, the other has the keyway about 9 degrees in front or before TDC. The main thing is to be sure you have the correct pointer for the balancer. The engine doesn't really care which one you use. Find #1 TDC and check to see that your pointer is calibrated correctly. Also remember that if you have a used balancer, the outer ring may have slipped. If you have any doubt about the condition (a new engine deserves a new balancer in my opinion) of the balancer replace it; if they come apart while the engine is running it's not pretty. mgg (Gold # 209)

The 68-earlier balancers (for SB, I don't know about BB because my BB experience is 70-later) had the keyway/timing mark in line with each other.The 69-later were offset a few degrees, approx 10 degrees. Like Manny said, make sure your pointer (timing chain cover) and balancer match.

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You both say to make sure we have the correct timing cover with the correct balancer. That is part of the problem. We do have the correct cover, but the pointer is missing. It was that way when we got it. We have the 8" balancer and I bought the only pointer I have ever seen for the 8" balancer. The timing mark is nowhere near the pointer. The balancer timing mark points to 12 o'clock when it is at TDC. This seems wrong even if the mark was changed. Does anyone know what the hell is going on here?

I did another check on the balancer. When the motor is at TDC with the pointer bolted on the timing mark on the balancer is about an inch before the 16 degree BTDC mark on the balancer--making the timing mark point almost to 12 o'clock. The keway for the crank points pretty much where it should, about 2 o'clock. What this says to me is that the outer ring has slipped. I would think that even if we had the wrong timing cover pointer the balancer mark would still be withing a few degrees of the pointer and not an inch away from it. Does anyone know if the 8" balancer was used with the two different timing pointers or just the one I have seen readily available?

Help!!!!!!!!!!

I don't care if the balancer is bad. I just want to know if it really is or what else might be the problem.

Again--Help!!!!!

Th,
You probably have a real late model balancer. They are designed for the timing cover with the mark straight up at 12 oclock. This is how my 85 Blazer was, you actually had to look down behind the water pump to see the timing mark. Your balancer is probably ok, just the wrong cover, as everyone else is saying.


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Bill Koustenis
Advanced Automotive Machine
Waldorf Md

1971 Heavy Chevy - original owner
Team Chevelle #100

My thinking is the same as Billk. You probably have the real late balancer and you need a real late timing cover. But with this setup you can only use a long water pump because you have to be able to see between the back side of the pump and the timing cover. A short pump will block the view.
Again, let me say, 68-earlier balancers have the keyway/timing mark in line with each other. The 69-later balancers have about a 10degree difference between the keyway and timing mark. And the real late balancers, like what you seem to have, the timing mark is about straight up.

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This is really getting interesting! It seems we do have the really late balancer (wish I knew what this motor was out of). Fortunately we also are using a long water pump, so that won't be a problem. We either need to get a new timing cover or scribe a new mark on the balancer to match the older style timing tab. Sound okay?

Yes, I suppose that you could do that. BE ABSOLUTELY sure that you line up the keyways of both balancers before you scribe a new mark. Do you have a die grinder and a very thin cutoff wheel you could use for this? I have never done this, but what the heck, it ain't my motor. Seriously, be as precise as you can.

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I hear ya, DZAUTO. Point well taken. BillK has generously offered to get a balancer of each type and measure the difference between the two marks and report the difference to me. I will make absolutely sure we are at the proper location before making any marks. As to the method of marking I was thinking of using a scribe tool. Don't have a thin cutoff wheel. I realize this is rather "shadetree", but the motor is pretty much together at this point (hooray for us!). I'd hate to pull it apart just to add the other cover and we can't change balancers without throwing off the balance job already done to the motor. I think if we exercise extreme care we should be okay.

What size engine? I think only the 400 is externally balanced. If you have a 350 it is internally balanced. You should be able to change balancers without problems.

A scribe mark probably won't last very long. Perhaps a hacksaw blade would work.

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Pat Kelley
66 & 67 El Caminos

[This message has been edited by Pat Kelley (edited 07-02-99).]

It is a 350. I thought about that too, but then wondered why it wouldn't matter if they ask for the balancer when they balance the assembly.

Yeah, I thought about the hacksaw thing too. Hmmm...can we just get another balancer without throwing off the balance job we've already paid for? I'd go for that as a simple and definite way of fixing things.

You might check your balance sheet and see if they did anything with it. Or maybe you could ask the guy who balanced it. Possably, if they did balance the balancer, they could rebalance just the balancer using the info on your balance sheet. A lot of balance in that sentence http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif

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Pat Kelley
66 & 67 El Caminos

I'd have to double-check, but I'm pretty sure I wasn't given a balance sheet.

TH,
New balancer should not affect balance on a 350. They are internally balanced. I cant speak for your balance shop but I do the 350's with no balancer or flywheel and just spin the balancer and flywheel seperately on the balancer to make sure they are perfectly balanced. This way you can change flywheels or balancers without causing any problems.
Pat hit it on the nose about the hacksaw, we have marked many a balancer that way. We make a 34 degree mark on the stock balancers so it is easy to se and the hack saw cut looks factory.
We were "hammered" this week with everyone wanting boats and cars ready for the 4th so I did not have a chance to measure balancers. Will definitely do it Tuesday !

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Bill Koustenis
Advanced Automotive Machine
Waldorf Md

1971 Heavy Chevy - original owner
Team Chevelle #100

Hi all,
I just bought a new 350-300 Gm crate motor and the dealer sold me a 8" balancer that fits a 85-89 350 truck. Will this balancer work with the aftermarket GM 8" timming pointer or do I have the wrong balancer? Why do I have that sinking feeling? TIA.

Hard to say. You might but it depends on which timing pointer you have. All the timing pointers I have seen, and that's not many, are for the early balancer. Try this, get #1 piston to TDC, mount the pointer and slide the balancer on the crank just till it locates on the key. If the timing mark lines up with zero on the pointer your all set. If not, you need to change one or the other.

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Pat Kelley
66 & 67 El Caminos

[This message has been edited by Pat Kelley (edited 07-02-99).]

Tino,
From what BillK tells me you have the "straight up" balancer (see Bill's first response to me). It will not line up with the aftermarket pointer that bolts to the timing cover. Just get the later model cover. No big deal if the motor isn't together yet. ....or return the balancer and get an earlier style one. Pat's method of checking will tell you for sure.

[This message has been edited by TH (edited 07-04-99).]

Well TH,
It's funny that you ask this question. My son was just given a 78 350 that quit after loosing oil pressure. Befor we removed the balancer (which is straight up) we turned the engine over until the timing mark was on 0 of the original timing tab. Then we bolted on a 69-later bolt-on timing tab that we had lying around, marked the balancer at the new 0 mark, then removed the balancer and cut a new groove. When we rebuild this engine we will use and older timing cover with this newly marked balancer. (or we could use the 78 timing cover with a bolt on tab and have 2 different timing locations)

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DZ, That's what we plan to do (make a new mark). Just waiting for Bill to get back to us with the measurement for it. We don't have a reference point for the original TDC (not the correct timing cover) so we need someone to tell us how far apart the two marks are. I'm sure it will work out fine. Obviously others have done this with success.

Now we just have to take care of the other 50 things that have cropped up...

I finally got out to the garage and did what Pat said. I hooked a TDC "whistle" tool to #1 and turned the balancer. When the tool stoped whistling, the pointer was at zero. Looks like I got a brake for once! Thanks again all for the help!

Tino,
What is a whisle tool.I have never seen one of these.If it is what I am thinking.It is something that goes into the spark plug and when the piston comes up it starts to whilse.Is this correct and where can I get one of those?

George

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