How can I tell if my 65 has "frame sag"? The car is a two owner that's had a 6 in it it's whole life. The frame has plenty of surface rust but seems solid to me. I'm planning to "box" the frame similar to the convertibles and elkys to prepare for a 454. Any thoughts? PS: I think this is the best site I've ever seen. No BS just car talk!

love the name bondo bob!
this is the best site.
one way to tell right away without taing any measurements is to see how many shimms re under yo front upper control arm shafts. if it has no shims in either of the 4 shim points then it is very likely you have frame sag. if there ae shimms and it had a proper alignment you are ok. i dont know wat you frame should be since it might be different from 68-72. ifthey are the same, the distance between the frame where the upper arm shafts mountshold be real close to 32". if i am remembeig right. if you d a search there should be a lot on it in the sspension forum.

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Between my brother and I we have had 12 1965 Skylarks and Gran Sports, I have never seen a "sagged" frame. Is this something that happens in the "rust belt"?

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1965 Buick Gran Sport Convertible
1965 Buick Skylark H/T
"Fan of most anything that moves human beings"

Ive only seen one frame that has sagged, on a 71 chevelle with 454. The car was driven daily in northern iowa, some frame rot behind the A-arms developed. because of the weight of the 454 and rust weakened frame, it bowed. The point is its very unlikly.

What you need to do is take it a body shop that has a frame rack, were they can correct any frame damage like diamond, sway or sag. If you plan on boxing the frame its important that the frame is square and true before you weld on it...Eric

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1970 chevelle
1970 chevelle SS455 not a typo its a BUICK BABY
1949 and 1972 chevy trucks
http://briefcase.yahoo.com/bc/sevt_chevelles

The front crossmember on the velles can sag, causing negative camber. As stated by others, start by having the alignment checked.
As FO_FDYFO said, ask alignment technician how many shims are left at upper control arms. If they all already all pulled out and camber is still negative then the crossmember could be sagged. This would be unlikely with a six popper, unless the car had very hard use (running through ditches, and trying to make car fly)
Heed sevt_chevelle's advice, regarding making sure frame is square, and level (check datum) before starting any other work.
Good Luck Karl
P.S. Remember- All good Frame specialists can align a car AND measure frame to verify it is correct.
Many "alignment technicians" can only make adjustments, and replace suspension components.
Shop carefully, as there are few people working at Franchise type operations that can do much more than sell and install parts.
Karl

I have had to spread many frame cross-members in the last 35 years and never have I done one because of a "sag". It's always because these cars have taken some kind of hit in the front end. Back in the '60's and '70's, on a front end hit,we would automatically measure the shim contact area between the rails to make sure the cross-member wasn't collapsed.
Gordon VM

sevt
Frame damage: what is diamond & sway? Dave

A diamond is when the a frame rail is either pushed forward or rearward of the opposite rail, making the frame appear like a diamond. A sway is also known as side away damage. When the front, center or rear portions of the frame are pushed sideways out of alignment due to a sideways impact.

Its so important to have a qualified tech check your frame first. There are many problems that cant be found with just a simple tape measure and X the frame to check

Thanks you learn some thing new every day. Dave