i need an overdrive for my tired 307 daily driver and thought of a 700r4 but have heard that a 2004r will bolt in place of my th350??? true?? and what is a good cost for one since i can have a 700 done for 475 plus 200 for the swap so 675 total. i would prefer to do it myself, and not cut the driveshaft etc.(never done it but i like to learn this stuff) and would like an ez conversion.

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members.aol.com/jnkb2cool/chevelle.jpg (http://members.aol.com/jnkb2cool/chevelle.jpg) John Krenn
Ft.Worth, Tx

I considered this for my car too. It is an excellent tranny, I prefer it over the 700. Better ratios

According to this months Chevy High Performance, the 200-4r and the TH350 are nearly identical in length. 27.75" TH350 to 27.875" 200-4r

I found a good 200-4r for $150 last fall. Thats really good I think. But they are not worth anymore than a 700r4. CHP says they are less popular so they can be found cheaper than the 700r4.

Don't forget to get the converter with the tranny. It has a lockup style converter. Those can be expensive.

I got a lot of good info here when I was considering this swap. I know more people have some knowledge on this topic.

is that legnth compared to a short or long tail Th350

The 200R4 will swap directly with a Powerglide or TH350. I believe that would be the short driveshaft version. The only modifications involve moving the tranny crossmember back 6 inches because of the different mounting point, and wiring the kickdown linkage to your carb. Check out www.shiftworks.com for the shift kit. I just picked up a 200R4 for my '66. I'll be putting it behind a mild 327, and I'm going to love the overdrive http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif 1st Gear is 2.74, I think, and the overdrive is 0.67!

What year(s) was this tranny made (200-4r) and in what cars did it come???/

I think the 200R4's are found in early 80's Chevy Impala's and Caprice's, Olds Delta 88's. There are other cars that have the 200R4. I just can't remember what they are right now. Lemme go check...

all rear wheel drive with a V-6 and some V-8 small blocks after 81 or 82 should have them IE: S-10 2wd, Camaro, A & G bodies. 86 to 88 are the best years as they need less modifications. I think the Grand National Buicks had the toughest ones followed by some of the Monte Carlo SS's. This site has a lot of good info on both overdrive transmissions. http://www.ntcnet.com/~dragon64/Monte_SS.html

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Philip Valentine
Team Chevelle Member #42 GOLD
philip@chevelles.com

I have an article from CHP that deals with a TH350/PG to 200R4 swap in pretty good detail. If you want, email me and I can scan the article for you...

ok im being told by multiple tranny shops that i will have to cut my driveshaft if i use the 200 or 700 tranny??? HAS ANYONE ACTUALY DONES THE SWAP THEMSELFES???? and any detail would be appreciated

Every situation is just slightly different but you should not have to shorten the driveshaft to install a 2004r in place of a turbo 350. You don't even have to move the crossmember, just use a mount that has the bolt in the right place. As for the 700, yes you do have to cut the driveshaft and move the crossmember back.

check out this spreadsheet where you can enter rear-end ratio, tire diameter, etc to find out how much benefit the 200r4 will give versus other transmissions:

http://radon.mit.edu/~mike/2004r.xls

you will need microsoft's program to use it..

Mike

I'd like to do this swap as well. Does any one know if you can get a 10 or 11 inch non-lockup converter to work on this tranny? I think I would have to go to the aftermarket for the transmission (B&M, TCI) because I need one that can stand at least 450 ft.lb. of torque. I have one in my 85 Monte Carlo daily driver with over 215,000 miles on it and it is still in great shape.

OK now im ready (never done tranny stuff before) but i have the ability just no experience. got a 2004r for 175$ and it just happened to be down the street guaranteed for 90 days from an 86 monte-carlo anyone done this and is there a specific article or how-to place i can look one up. im cheap yes but gotta have one and i'd like to do the work myself (i like that stuff) or just let me know how to. cable,converter,lockout mech(electric has 3 prongs), crossmember movement and anything else you can think of would be greatly appreciated. jk

I am also considering the 2004r swap in my 70 chevelle. The question I have is in regards to the column shifter. I would like to keep the column shifter. I currently have a TH350 and bench seat. Will I have to get a auto 4spd shifter w/cable mounted on the floor? Can it be done with keeping the column shifter? Has anyone done this?

ok i did this a few mo's ago and we had to jimmy the linkage to work on the 200 but i could only go PRND3 it would bind after that so downshifting to 2 or 1st gear wasn't possible. i dealt with it up intil a few weeks ago (found a megashifter cheap and it was in a 70 nova w/a 2004r already,coinsidence??) anyway i installed it and like it much better then column anyway. you may be able to jimmy it to work w/ your column but the lock points etc. are a little off. like i said though i used mine for months no problem except reverse is hard to find.

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John Krenn
1970 malibu SS look-a-like well kinda
307/200-4r (soon to be 355)

Ft.Worth, Tx

I just replaced the 283/Powerglide in my 67 Malibu with a 327/200-4R. The swap was pretty easy. The origional flexplate and driveshaft were used as was the stock column shifter and speedo cable. I bought a high performance 200-4R from TPI Performance at a Super Chevy Show. It was a Street Rod Kit that included everything from the lock-up converter, lock-up switch, and harness for it to the transmission mount and fluid cooler. They also offer several different transmissions from almost stock to race ready. They carry several different converters form stock to high-stall units. The price was pretty steep but I figured the money saved in gas would be worth it. (Not to mention the added fun of road trips and a 2.74 first gear)
The only modifications I had to do was move the crossmember back a few inches (it still uses the factory holes) and modify the exhaust. I have single exhaust for now and where the passenger side crosses under the transmission it was hitting the transmission crossmember. I strongly suggest converting to dual exhaust either before or during the swap.
You will need a TH350 transmission linkage if you want to use the factory column shifter.
As chev-hell mentioned, you can't downshift into first but with some grinding on the rod from the column to the shift linkage I can shift into second.

PS TPI claims their transmissions can stand the abuse of big block cars and at the Super Chevy Show in Comerce, GA I met several owners of big block cars with the 200-4R. One had driven from Louisiana with his 454 Monte Carlo and had averaged nearly 22 mpg. I don't know what kind of gears he had.

Hope this helps

I'm glad to see the 200-R4 getting a little respect on this board. On another BB I suggested to the owner of a 67 Camaro that it would be a simpler swap than a R700 and went down in flame big time.

I've got one behind my 64 Riv with a dual quad 425, and it works great. The 425 was rated at 465 torque, and with porting and my cam, might actually have that much.

For those who are still debating between the 200-R4 and 700-R4....
there is an article in the March 1995 Hot Rod issue where they do a
trans comparo between the two. They basically asked the "experts" at Art
Carr and TCI about the two trannys. Some of the highlights were:
- 200-4R comes with a universal bolt pattern bellhousing (fits Chev Buick
Olds Pontiac engines)
- 700-R4 is a Chev only pattern.
- 200-4R offers full-throttle upshift into overdrive, while only the 91
and later Corvette 700-R4s offer this feature.
- a few years ago GM ghanged the 700-R4 designation to 4L60 same trans
except 4L60-E is computer controlled.
- Most trans companies agree that the early 700-R4s had some durability
problems and must be highly modified to make good performance
engines.(didn't say what the mods are)
- the early 82-84 700-R4 units had a smaller 27-slpine input shaft and
should be avoided.
- the 85-87 700-R4s can be upgraded but both companies recommended
starting with an 88-93 700-R4
- as for the 200-4R, the best are the ones used in the turbo Buick
T-Types and Grand Nationals, but any of the 86-88 gearboxes are good cores.
- Art Carr claims both are equally durable and both can handle up to 600
lbs-ft of torque and around 700hp (not stock I'm sure!!)
- Art Carr has been adapting the 200-4R for use in automatic equipped
Mustangs. (sounds like putting chevy engines into a Ford again http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif )

Bottom Line:
- both TCI and Art Carr also agree that HOW you use the trans is a big
factor in selecting the correct performance automatic. If blasting 9's
on the dragsrip is your plan of attack a performance built Turbo 400 or
powerglide is the best choice. Both the 200-4R and the 700-R4 will live
on the dragstrip behind some pretty powerful engines. However keep in
mind the quicker the car runs the more abuse the trans has to endure,
which in turn will reduce its life expectancy.

From: J Gray (jgray01@mail.state.mo.us)

1st 2nd 3rd 4th

200-R4 2.74 1.57 1.00 .67

700-R4 3.06 1.62 1.00 .70

"The key is that the 200-R4 is as durable as the 700-R4"


*

Just wanted to give my .02 worth. My father has a 200-4R installed in his 64 El Camino, and it was pretty simple and straightforward. All that was needed was a shifting of the trans mount backwards and a couple of new holes. Even the kickdown cable is not hard to install or adjust. And the reduction in RPM's and rise in fuel mileage is well worth the effort. Even with is high mileage 350, he still pulls between 18 and 20 MPG on the highway at 70MPH.

How much $ was the TPI 200r4?

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A B&M megashifter would work just fine. I know because I had one in my 71 before it was wrecked. I would like to keep the originality of my 70 chevelle. What about changing the coulmn for one out of a original 2004r car? I don't know. Theres got to be a solution. Is the problem that the coulmn does not go that far to reach 2nd and 1st? What about rigging up a shifter cable somehow to the column linkage instead of the rods? I need more feed back. Thank you..

The TPI Performance 200-4R ran about 1200 dollars with ALL the modifications. Like I said ... not that cheap. But it did come with EVERYTHING. you could always find a junkyard find and have a good shop to rebuild it but I got everything at once and did the engine/trans. swap in about a day. Hope everything works out.

all the art carr upgrades (that they reccamend) were around $500 w/a master rebuild kit so for $300 in labor (or a 39.95 video) you have a rock solid,not bullet proof but a solid upgraded 200 not too shabby but get jealous guys a local fella here will sell his (racing) for $350w/2500 lock up tci stall with it what a deal because mine is a wrecking yard special but good for the last 6 mos. so far and it's been unlocked the whole time, (people say it will burn up, has'nt yet) jk

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John Krenn
1970 malibu SS look-a-like well kinda
307/200-4r (soon to be 355)

Ft.Worth, Tx