I got some pics for you guys of the "missing main bearing" He said "see, it's not there...." I picked up the crank and said WTF is this thing stuck to the crank? I popped it off with my keys and there it layed... both pieces in my hand. I said Ooooooooh look it's a rear main BEARING you f'n idiot!

I'm working on a photo album for you guys that will be up shorty.


In short, the block is toasted.

http://f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/yenko_chevelle_69/album?.dir=/a373

I have no helpful input. All I have to say is 'wow.'

I hope you picked up your stuff & got the he** out of there :eek:

YC,
Now the next step is to find out why it did it so that you dont ruin the new engine. I cannot tell from the pics, but was the thrust surface on the crank and rear main brg worn out ? If so, you need to look at this link:

http://www.aera.org/Tech/tb1465r.htm

Something caused it to spin the bearing, not a real common problem on Small Block Chevy engines.
By the looks of the pics .. your truck has an oil cooler. The lines and the cooler need to be totally flushed out .. replacemnet would actually be best and is probably required for the warranty on the new engine.

http://www.chevelles.com/showroom/YenkoChevelle69/Hpim0176.jpg
Bill the thrust surface has a groove in it from the bearing, You can tell that the crank moved some. The lip on the bearing is gone, and thats what let it move I assume. You can see that it is from a lack of oil. There was antifreeze on the crank under the bearing, the engine is full of what looks like sand.... from an abrasive disk, looks like they used it on my intake surface when the gasket was replaced. The cam lobes are cloudy with uneven wear from the lifters like sand got under them. My assumptions were wrong however, the crank and rods never seized together. The heads will need to be hot tanked to get the crap out of them. My oil pan had a layer of something on the bottom of it. It looked like liquid lead.... maybe it was the bearing material.... I dunno.


Anyway thank you for looking


Shay

PS the thing the really made me sick is that this engine doesn't even have a HINT of a ridge in the cylinders at 97K miles. Really sad. I'm sure it could be line bored, but the thrust surface would need to be welded and ground down.

Originally posted by YenkoChevelle69:
Bill the thrust surface has a groove in it from the bearing, You can tell that the crank moved some. The lip on the bearing is gone, and thats what let it move I assume. You can see that it is from a lack of oil. There was antifreeze on the crank under the bearing, the engine is full of what looks like sand.... from an abrasive disk, looks like they used it on my intake surface when the gasket was replaced. The cam lobes are cloudy with uneven wear from the lifters like sand got under them. My assumptions were wrong however, the crank and rods never seized together. The heads will need to be hot tanked to get the crap out of them. My oil pan had a layer of something on the bottom of it. It looked like liquid lead.... maybe it was the bearing material.... I dunno.


Anyway thank you for looking


Shay =
Shay,

I know this doesn't help much but here is a little info to file away.

The "lip" on the bearing does nothing but locate the bearing for alignment. It has nothing to do with keeping it from spinning.
The housing bore is slightly smaller than the bearing resulting in crush or interference fit which is what holds the bearing in place.
If anyone get within 10 feet of your engine with those trick little sanding "cleaning" discs,, shoot them :mad:
I have rebuilt at least 3 engines in the past couple of years that I can think of from just this scenario.
There is a general repair shop in this area that seems to think they are the greatest cleaning aid invented & after they replaced an intake gasket on a 4.3 Chevy it made it about 150 miles before losing all the bearings.
GM has issued technical bulletins about NEVER USING THEM for cleaning gasket surfaces.
They also ruin aluminum heads in a heartbeat. They will roll the chamber edges or water passage holes so bad that you cannot surface them without taking off to much material.

I agree completely with Bill about the oil cooler. Replace it do not flush it. It is almost impossible to clean.

the engine is full of what looks like sand.... from an abrasive disk, looks like they used it on my intake surface when the gasket was replaced.I would be ready to inflict serious bodily harm on the dude that changed your gaskets. Sad thing is, almost ALL the garages use these abrasive disks, because they are a real time saver. Besides, it ain't their car... who cares if the engine dies an untimely death. :mad:

Does the intake manifold have a heat shield on it's bottom??

If so, was the manifold sand or glass bead blasted b/c the blasting media will get behind the oil splash heat shield and you will think it is clean AND lo and behold, all the blasting media crap will come out and get in your motor and ruin it!!

Also my new Merlins had casting mould sand in the water passages that I had to get out before I installed them on my motor!!

Some guy's fill all the water passage openings on their heads with shaving cream to keep the crap in the passages until they are bolted on the motor and it can't go anywhere that will allow it to tear up anything..

Just thinking out loud here and hope it helps you.....

pdq67

Originally posted by pdq67:
Does the intake manifold have a heat shield on it's bottom??

If so, was the manifold sand or glass bead blasted b/c the blasting media will get behind the oil splash heat shield and you will think it is clean AND lo and behold, all the blasting media crap will come out and get in your motor and ruin it!!

Also my new Merlins had casting mould sand in the water passages that I had to get out before I installed them on my motor!!

Some guy's fill all the water passage openings on their heads with shaving cream to keep the crap in the passages until they are bolted on the motor and it can't go anywhere that will allow it to tear up anything..

Just thinking out loud here and hope it helps you.....

pdq67 I don't think anything was sand blasted, but rather a da grinder or something with a stripper disk was used on the surfaces of the gasket.

Shay/BillK,
I'm getting ready to change the intake gaskets on my 96 K1500 350 Vortec. 140,000 miles and it's just barely leaking.

This is my first intake gasket job.

What are you guys talking about "da grinders for the intake"?????

What IS the proper method to clean the intake before replacing the seals?

Any tips are greatly appreciated.

Instead of taking a sanding disc, use a window scraper razor blade. It may take you a half hour or so to get it super clean but it's safe and works well.

I found everything from sand, to old intake gasket material inside the crank case.

When I replace an intake gasket I place a towel in the liftr valley to catch any of the gaskets pieces that may fall. I have used the 3M discs for years with no problems. Are the discs you are talking about actual sand paper consistency?

Paint remover of the methylene chloride type works well to soften gaskets and to remove sealer. Just brush it on and wait a few minutes. Loctite actually sells an aerosol can of paint remover for stripping off Loctite.

DG,
I dont think you will have much problem on the Vortec because of the plastic gasket. Like everyone else said, the 3M scotchbrite pads are a no-no. I know guys that use them without any problems by covering everything up and vacuuming afterwards, but why take a chance. By the way, while you have the intake off, replace the quick connect fitting for the heater hose. If it hasn't broken yet, it will soon. I think the new ones are a better material.
Let me know how the job goes, I have to do my 99 in the next month or so. I also noticed a slight drip and it only has 45K on it :(

I generally try to defend the dealer mechanics since I'm one of 'em but in this case I think you already know what happened...In the past I used the scotch brites but I always covered the intake valley,changed the oil and I never had a bearing failure. I've seen guys do them though without and it usually get the bearings within 3-5 hundred miles. I quit using them awhile back and now use the rol-locs with the plastic fingers and I still cover the intake. I kinda doubt you'll find many guys in the business using a scraper. Even though the intake ports are usually pretty clean due to the type gaskets now being used around the coolant ports and the front and back of the intake still need to be shiny clean in my opinion if you expect to come out with no leaks. Sorry that happened to you..Most guys in the dealers know this and it still some of them seem to have learn the hard way. graemlins/sad.gif

Originally posted by 64elcamino:
When I replace an intake gasket I place a towel in the liftr valley to catch any of the gaskets pieces that may fall. I have used the 3M discs for years with no problems. Are the discs you are talking about actual sand paper consistency? =
Phillip,
You may have been using them for years with no problems but trust me,,, it is an accident waiting to happen.
There is just no way you are going to catch all the crap flying around when you use those discs. It is the stuff you can't see that causes the problems.
In my opinion this goes for sanding discs, scotchbrite, & also the "plastic RolLoc ones" which also contain abrasive particles. If they didn't they would not work.
It is more work but if necessary, use a scraper. It leaves big pieces you can see & doesn't add abrasive particles to your engine.
This is a recommendation from what I have seen first hand along with AERA, GM, Ford & almost every machinist I know that sees the damage done by these "time savers".
These "cleaning pads" are great on bare CAST IRON heads & blocks that are going to go through a complete cleaning process afterwards but to use them on an assembled or partially assembled engine is as far as I am concerned, just not acceptable assuming you are concerned with the quality of your work.

Mike(wolfplace),
What about the 3M bristle block roloc discs?They cost about $4.00 but are worth it in my opinion.They last longer and have little or no grit.You still need to cover the valley and stuff the ports with rags though.
LOL this is what happens when you post and watch speedvision at the same time.

Originally posted by 71350ss:
Mike(wolfplace),
What about the 3M bristle block roloc discs?They cost about $4.00 but are worth it in my opinion.They last longer and have little or no grit.You still need to cover the valley and stuff the ports with rags though.
LOL this is what happens when you post and watch speedvision at the same time. =
Those are the "plastic" ones & they do have abrasive in them.
All I can do is reiterate what I have already posted about them. :D

I do not know of any machinist who would recommend using any sort of abrasive to clean gaskets or anything else on a partially assembled engine.
Again this is not new information, it has been around for quite a few years in technical bulletins from the major automakers along with the Automotive Engine Rebuilders Association among others.

Originally posted by 71350ss:
Mike(wolfplace),
What about the 3M bristle block roloc discs?They cost about $4.00 but are worth it in my opinion.They last longer and have little or no grit.You still need to cover the valley and stuff the ports with rags though.
LOL this is what happens when you post and watch speedvision at the same time. That's what I'm referring to in my post..

I always just use a razor scraper, and cover the lifter valley well. It is slow and tedious, but it lets me sleep better at night.