Well, after George harping on me today at lunch I decided to start my own thread for my Chevelle and the upcoming big block build. I still have a ton of parts to buy, so this build is definitely in it's infancy. Between TC and the couple of books that I have also picked up I have been trying to absorb as much knowledge as possible. Thankfully George and cobalt Mike and a few others have offered to lend a hand, and keep from doing/buying something stupid.

Here is a list so far of what I have compiled.

454 block (probably going .060 over)
Thumb Rods prepped by Doc
Cast Nodular Crank
Cam - not sure between: 60203 or Isky 280 Mega
781 heads
Edelbrock RPM Air Gap Intake - (Probable)

Maintaining streetability will be biggest objective for this engine as that is where it will be driven most of the time. However it would be nice to head to the track with you guys once or twice a year and make a few passes. I've taken a few rides (as recent as today) in the Elky Valdez and have been impressed with what the car can do while still be able to putt around town. I told George to send the city of Steilacoom a bill for the 30' of pavement sealing we did this afternoon.:D

Another side project to the BBC build will be to update the rear-end with something sturdier (stock 10 bolt now), posi, and ballpark 3.55 G.R. as well as a eventual transmission upgrade but that will be brought up later.

I'm definetely a noob when it comes to engine building,so any thoughts, combo suggestions, recommendations etc. for this project are more than welcome:yes:


Here are some pics of the car as it is now:

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c139/Masonrm/Chevelle_1.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c139/Masonrm/DSCN0395.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c139/Masonrm/DSCN0396.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c139/Masonrm/DSCN0513.jpg

Tired old 350
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c139/Masonrm/DSCN0516.jpg

Firstly, that's a REALLY LOW collector plate # you got there:bow::thumbsup:

Secondly, due to the increased overall height of a BBC and the Air Gap manifold, I'm pretty sure you'll need to get a shorter air filter. Standard or drop base bottom on that air cleaner? There's 2 or 3 in the garage I can probably talk Tracy out of if you need one.

A note about the Air Gap in the colder weather/at night, it may take a few more minutes for the car to get warm but it's great in the summer....I have experienced this but it's not too bad. If you drive it a lot in the spring/fall, you may want a non-Air Gap manifold....just a std. Performer RPM manifold to keep normal warm up times, etc.

You may want to ask about booster size vs. valve cover clearance. Not sure what you have there or what will fit.

New engine mounts?

All he needs to do the swap are:
drop base air cleaner
BBC frt coils
same engine stands and motor mounts off his 350
BBC hoses and accessories (long style) waterpump
will likely need a BBC throttle cable from Biscays
Possibly need a th350 kickdown cable if his current cable has ever been cut.

I forgot to check the car's fuel lines. Gott have 3/8" minimum lines.

Already has Pwr Frt DBs (regular VCs no problem with that booster), a big Aluminum radiator with dual elec fans.

same engine stands and motor mounts off his 350.

I know they will fit, but I'm asking if the mounts are old/worn out...replacing those would definitely be easier now since he says the 350 is tired and I'm guessing they are indeed aged rubber ones.

The 3/8" fuel line will be a bit more difficult if he's planning on direct replacement routing(all that body mount loosening, etc.)

The car looks very nice. If your gonna run it on the street you want pump gas. Are you willing to run premium or want regular like George? What pistons are you looking at? I would shoot for 9.8-10.2 : 1 comp ratio with a bigger cam.

The 60203 is tooo small in my opinion. I had the 60204 and it was VERY mild, had to go bigger the second time around. The cam I have now is mild. I just drove it to work yesterday. You need to come for a ride and forget the elky valsleez. :rolleyes:

I know Darryl's father in law runs the 60204 with enough vacuum for brakes. Not sure how my solid cam would do. I have manual disk brakes, do you need power?

I know they will fit, but I'm asking if the mounts are old/worn out...replacing those would definitely be easier now since he says the 350 is tired and I'm guessing they are indeed aged rubber ones.

The 3/8" fuel line will be a bit more difficult if he's planning on direct replacement routing(all that body mount loosening, etc.)


I'd like to replace the mounts just for peace of mind. I have already replaced a lot of the rubber bushings so far due to age and cracking (trans mount, sway bar end links etc.). Fuel line appears to be 3/8" line feeding into the fuel pump. I'll take it off and make sure this evening when I get home. I think I remember reading somewhere that 1/2" was optimal for a BBC is that true?

The car looks very nice. If your gonna run it on the street you want pump gas. Are you willing to run premium or want regular like George? What pistons are you looking at? I would shoot for 9.8-10.2 : 1 comp ratio with a bigger cam.

The 60203 is tooo small in my opinion. I had the 60204 and it was VERY mild, had to go bigger the second time around. The cam I have now is mild. I just drove it to work yesterday. You need to come for a ride and forget the elky valsleez. :rolleyes:

I know Darryl's father in law runs the 60204 with enough vacuum for brakes. Not sure how my solid cam would do. I have manual disk brakes, do you need power?



I'm fine with having to use 92 Oct. I have to use it in my subaru and I always put it in the Chevelle mostly out of habit.

As for the cam I honestly don't have anything to compare with so yeah a ride in your elky would be a help. :D

I have Power disc brakes only because the kit included the booster, and I figured if they include it why not use it. After having it in for over a year now I'm not too happy with the braking..... so I'm not sure when this is going to happen but I would like to install a hydroboost brake system, and eliminate the big booster, and not have to worry about if my engine is creating enough vacuum.

This difference between the two cams you picked are pretty big.

The 60203 is cut on a 110 LSA and will make power in your 454 to maybe 5500 RPM. The 60204 will be just a bit higher.

The 270 and 280 Mega cams are cut on a 108LSA. They will produce more HP and it will be higher in the 6000+ range. Also the HP at 5500 will be more than the 204 and 203.

Now get the 60204 cut on a 108 and your in business:thumbsup:

It will raise the HP level through out the RPM range and will also make power past 6000+ rpm

JMO

I would clone Bretts engine(if you can actually find any pertinant details in his black hole of a build thread :p ), and use the Cam that Kevin Suggests, Ditch the Power brake booster and go with manual disks.

Take brett up on a ride in his elcamino- it is a perfect mix of power & streetability.
Maybe if you promise to stay nice on the throttle, he'd let you drive it so you can feel what manual disks feel like on the road.

Brett, did you go with an aftermarket manual disc brake set-up? I've got manual drums and would like to go with manual discs and looking for an opinion and how to go about it. I don't plan on doing any road racing or auto-crossing, just wanting to shorten my stopping distance at the far end of the strip when the time comes. I could clearly feel the drums fade and didn't like it.
I don't mean to be a thread stealer here.;)

Brett, did you go with an aftermarket manual disc brake set-up? I've got manual drums and would like to go with manual discs and looking for an opinion and how to go about it. I don't plan on doing any road racing or auto-crossing, just wanting to shorten my stopping distance at the far end of the strip when the time comes. I could clearly feel the drums fade and didn't like it.
I don't mean to be a thread stealer here.;)


Save your money and buy a good set of brake pads. I noticed only a little better stopping power with the manual disc. Also the disc brakes weigh more than drum.

I would clone Bretts engine(if you can actually find any pertinant details in his black hole of a build thread :p ), and use the Cam that Kevin Suggests, Ditch the Power brake booster and go with manual disks. Take brett up on a ride in his elcamino- it is a perfect mix of power & streetability.
Maybe if you promise to stay nice on the throttle, he'd let you drive it so you can feel what manual disks feel like on the road.

Brett's engine build thread has more twists and turns than the back rooms of the National Archives! :D Elky Valsleez indeed!:confused: Looked at the roof and vinyl top of YOUR ELKY lately Brett? :sad: All in good sport here.:beers:

Tough crowd here....I was catching hell for my antenna at the track from Rambo and Mike the 66SSFan the other day....If I remove the antenna, they'll start bitching about the paint or something else:cool: REmember, the engine in Brett's Elky is backed by a TKO...manual trans is a different deal than auto trans

OK, 92 Octane build...the 60203 is out... Still a lotta cam choices out there.
Too bad Doc's Chevelle is down and out.....the 280Mega in there rocked. 60204 is certainly viable, as is the 'Kevin version' on 108 LSA. You could also have Delta or Lunati grind it on a wider LSA for more average power and better manners, or leave it at 110 and straddle the fence. Post #1 you said a few track outings but you wanted 'driver' appeal. Rule of thumb, bigger cams like more CR (up to a point for street engines...now I would never, ever, build a street engine above 10:1 unless I had Aluminum heads).

But before we get crazy on cams...are ya still talking 3.55 gearing?
What converter/stall are ya looking at?
Then you wanted cruise appeal.....
These three factors will play heavy in your cam choice.

You guys all crack me up!

Yes my thread is a huge black hole. :D

Yes my camino has rust under the top, I'm afraid to peel the vinyl off until I get tetnis shots.

For brakes I'm running a disk brake conversion, stock setup but with a manual brake MC.

Again, the 60204 was super mild. However, I was running 3.73's and a manual trans. It was with this cam that I put down 411 rwhp & 475 ft-lbs with a manual trans. Power died off about 5600. Again x2, you need a ride and you will be forever sold. :yes:

After having it in for over a year now I'm not too happy with the braking..... so I'm not sure when this is going to happen but I would like to install a hydroboost brake system, and eliminate the big booster, and not have to worry about if my engine is creating enough vacuum.

Eric wants to do this too I think. As I told him, I pieced mine together and saved a few hundred $$$. You'd need the booster, probably swap out to straight brackets so the master cylinder doesn't hit the hood with the added length, a new line-set for the system(bought mine from CPP, but it was missing a few fittings:mad:), a tee fitting for the return line if not using a dual return port reservoir(or want to modify yours), and need to modify the pushrod length to fit(cut and weld back together).

I would shoot for 9.8-10.2 : 1 comp ratio with a bigger cam.

I agree.

This difference between the two cams you picked are pretty big.

The 60203 is cut on a 110 LSA and will make power in your 454 to maybe 5500 RPM. The 60204 will be just a bit higher.

The 270 and 280 Mega cams are cut on a 108LSA. They will produce more HP and it will be higher in the 6000+ range. Also the HP at 5500 will be more than the 204 and 203.

Now get the 60204 cut on a 108 and your in business:thumbsup:

It will raise the HP level through out the RPM range and will also make power past 6000+ rpm

JMO

Sorry Kevin, that was a typo, the two I was looking at / recommended was the 60204 and the Isky.

I would clone Bretts engine(if you can actually find any pertinant details in his black hole of a build thread :p ), and use the Cam that Kevin Suggests, Ditch the Power brake booster and go with manual disks.

Take brett up on a ride in his elcamino- it is a perfect mix of power & streetability.
Maybe if you promise to stay nice on the throttle, he'd let you drive it so you can feel what manual disks feel like on the road.

The original plan was to copy Brett's build for the most part, I've already hit him up with a couple of questions, which is also where I heard about the 60204. I would like to compare the brakes in his vs mine. If going to a manual setup will give me a better pedal feel than I am all for it. Do I need to change MC's to go to a manual setup or do I need to just get rid of the booster?

The original plan was to copy Brett's build for the most part, I've already hit him up with a couple of questions, which is also where I heard about the 60204. I would like to compare the brakes in his vs mine. If going to a manual setup will give me a better pedal feel than I am all for it. Do I need to change MC's to go to a manual setup or do I need to just get rid of the booster?

new MC, & new pushrod, rebend the lines in the engine bay to the new position of the MC.

Any certain reason on why a hydro? IMHO i think you'd be better off with a solid ft. I have power discs on my elky and with the 427 and the xr286 on a 107lsa the brakes were tough but they were still fine.

Continuing along with the hijack of this thread, this might be something worth considering. I have heard various bits of positive results with the "Praise" brand of brake shoes, for us 4 wheel drum guys. If I don't make it to front discs this winter, I'm going to install these praise shoes for next year. Lot's of good feedback on them.

http://www.praisedynobrake.com/

http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30394

new MC, & new pushrod, rebend the lines in the engine bay to the new position of the MC.

Don't forget to move the push rod to the upper hole on the pedal as well! :)

Don't forget to move the push rod to the upper hole on the pedal as well! :)


Do I still need to keep the Combo valve?

Any certain reason on why a hydro? IMHO i think you'd be better off with a solid ft. I have power discs on my elky and with the 427 and the xr286 on a 107lsa the brakes were tough but they were still fine.


Initially it was because I was trying to replicate Brett's build, I also like maintenance aspect of them as well, and not having to do the lash. I know it's a pretty simple thing to do, but it's one less thing to worry about.

Yup, same prop valve unless you want to go to an adjustable or something. I have been running my 468 with a solid cam for a year now without relashing the valves. Nice and quite still. I'll probably get around to it this winter. I agree though, nice to have a hydraulic for maintenance.

I have been running my 468 with a solid cam for a year now without relashing the valves. Nice and quite still.

One trip to Bremerton and hanging out at Mike Parker's, two trips to work, and three trips to the dump with house remodel refuse does not mean you drove it for a year!:thumbsup:

One trip to Bremerton and hanging out at Mike Parker's, two trips to work, and three trips to the dump with house remodel refuse does not mean you drove it for a year!:thumbsup:


he drove it from kirkland to Olympia with no heater in February

he drove it from kirkland to Olympia with no heater in February

OK, that doubles the miles driven he appears to be claiming. :yes:
Feb trip? Brrrrrrrrr

Ok, you dont have to believe I drive it. Also drove it in the snow to Daves and back in Alger to rebuild the 10 bolt for the velle.

Drove it to Pullman with the old cam. :thumbsup: Hit a huge dust storm (could hardly see 20 ft infront of you), had to go south. Power was out in the small town I went through, had to park and take a nap because the pumps were not working and I was out of gas. Called AAA, they brought me 5 gallons. I made it to the next city, and onto Pullman by about 3am. Friends were still up and drinking. :beers:

Lets talk about the vette george.... :D

I also went to manual disc brakes, I think that it has pretty good stopping power, comparable to my 99 yukon. Have fun with the big block swap Ray, all I gotta say build it as big and bad as you can. I wish I had built mine up more :(

I also went to manual disc brakes, I think that it has pretty good stopping power, comparable to my 99 yukon. Have fun with the big block swap Ray, all I gotta say build it as big and bad as you can. I wish I had built mine up more :(

Displacement envy?

I also went to manual disc brakes, I think that it has pretty good stopping power, comparable to my 99 yukon. Have fun with the big block swap Ray, all I gotta say build it as big and bad as you can. I wish I had built mine up more :(

Mine are just plain un-predictable....around town it seems I get a nice even pedal unless I do tons of braking in traffic. On the freeway however it's hit or miss....sometimes it's nice and firm or sometimes (like yesterday) I go to hit the brakes on the freeway and it goes down further than normal and catches me by surprise. Would like it to be equally firm (insert Dave Joke Here) in both situations. It would be nice if going to manual does it, seems like a easy enough change.

Speaking of the BBC what tranny and stall do you run? Just curious because we both have 70's weight, etc would be the same.

If I had to chose between the 60204 on 110LSA and the 280 Mega cam I would choose the Mega as its already cut on 108 LSA.

The 280 mega in my chevelle was brutal.

But before we get crazy on cams...are ya still talking 3.55 gearing?
What converter/stall are ya looking at?
Then you wanted cruise appeal.....
These three factors will play heavy in your cam choice.


Don't really know where to start here, I chose 3.55 as a middle of the road guess-timate. I went to Richmond Gears and ran a the RPM calc. and 3.55 would put me over 3k @ 70mph while 3.31 would put me just under 3k. Car doesn't see a lot of freeway time but it does do the occaisonal drive to work and possibly farther, so maybe the lower GR is the way to go. I will find out ballpark what is in there now tonight. What do you guys think?

Currently the car has th350 trans, not sure on GR, and 275/60/r15 rears and 245/60/r15's in the front (need to change too big and rub)

As for the stall, after riding in Georges Elky yesterday I wasn't really cool with how much he had to rev it to get it up hills from a dead stop. it sounds like it would be a pain in the a$$ to get that up my steep little driveway. I'm sure the 3000 TC helps with his launch but it was too much for my goals. I am completely guessing but somewhere in the 1800-2200?

With the smaller stall and smaller rear gears, I think it may be best you dont overdo the cam. Perhaps the 60203 would be good for you. Still plenty of oomph I'm sure. :yes:

2k-2400 in a big block is ideal for a mostly street car.

2k-2400 in a big block is ideal for a mostly street car.


I think on the Lunati page for the 60204 they recommend a 2800 stall with 3.73 gears.

If it helps any, I ran the 60203 in my fairly mild 454 last year with Performer intake and 2800 stall with 4.10 gears to 12.29 on engine, and an 11.61 on 150 shot. Would've likely been quicker if I had made the 1/2" fuel line/ fuel log upgrade then.

I gotta say, my 3000 stall is over the top for hills, steep driveways, and the like. Once above 35 mph and going...difficult to tell.

Though about any sane rpm is safe for what you have planned there Bad.Samaritan, where do plan on shifting? The stock stuff is good for 6500 rpm (crank, rods, rockers etc). Above that, it costs the amount you originally calculated squared!

Often said in Chevy circles.... 3.31 is the ideal ratio. I'd say to find a stock set or catch the Summit House Brand 3.42 gears on sale (they are made by Motive Gear).
I found a new Posi on C-L for $300 a few years back. Might just end up being cheaper to do a Currie

So Doc, the 280Mega/108 brutal with a 427 4-spd..... what are your thoughts about in an Auto/454/3.31? I don't suppose you'd vote for the 'boat cam' version 280Mega/ 112.

Another oldie but goodie cam is the ol LS-6 solid lifter cam....and the L-88 cam....I hear that cam at night in my sleep.

Ray, I am running a th350, and stock converter, 2.56 10 bolt, its a dog off the line, but cruising down the road is very nice, once i get some money together, a 12 bolt with decent gears and a 2500 stall will go in

I had a 280 magnum comp cam in my 9:1 461, ran awesome.:thumbsup:

With the smaller stall and smaller rear gears, I think it may be best you dont overdo the cam. Perhaps the 60203 would be good for you. Still plenty of oomph I'm sure. :yes:


I'm ok with going smaller to start and get the car back on the road, and then upgrading once I get the rear-end and trans changed. I'm starting to see what Cobalt Mike meant when he told me a lot of people build their cars from the rear forward.

I don't really expect to nail this combo on the first try because too many other things will be changing as well. Unfortunately this motor has to initially live with a tired leaking th350, and a stock open diff 10 bolt. Once I get the tranny and rear-end sorted out I can re-cam, bigger carb, etc. etc. I may get lucky and be able to change the rear-end out while I am building this engine and speed the process up a little. I'll let ya take it out for a spin at the BBQ so you can see what I'm working with.:thumbsup:

Sorry Ray, bringing my slow chevelle to the BBQ. :(

If it's alright with Nova Ben, I still have his 2k B & M converter that he gave me a while back and would gladly pass it on if you wanted to try it out :thumbsup: Would probably stall a bit more behind a BB so would probably be right around what you're looking for :yes:

A note about the gears George mentioned....some manufacturer's gears are better than others(manufacturing processes, etc. for that gear ratio), as has been said by big gear head over in the Transmission/Driveline forum. I'd check over there with either him or tlowe to ask about a certain gear ratio and which brand to get in that ratio you're looking at. I know he said a Richmond 3.08 was almost always noisy but most of their other stuff is quiet. Sometimes a "cheap gear set" is exactly what it is.

Nailing your combo on the first try should be your goal. There are enough people in this group who have tried many different combinations that you should be able to get it how you want it. So, what we know so far is that you want around 3K RPM or less at 70MPH while keeping performance. When going to the track, what is a realistic goal you'd like to reach(without nitrous)... 12.5? 12.0? Idle/drivability quality and hill climbing are also factors here.

What I'm seeing so far from the consensus:

3.42 gears
60203 cam
2400-2500 stall
upgraded fuel line

Am I on the right track?

FYI for everybody out there wondering about a hydroboost option vs. manual brakes...it provides around 1300 PSI brake line pressure, about double that of a vacuum assisted booster. This is the reason they are used on 1 ton trucks, other heavy vehicles and performance cars from the factory. With the added 'around' 150lbs BBC weight, it would be a good option, especially for a car that sees some commute time with crazy drivers out there.

If it's alright with Nova Ben, I still have his 2k B & M converter that he gave me a while back and would gladly pass it on if you wanted to try it out :thumbsup: Would probably stall a bit more behind a BB so would probably be right around what you're looking for :yes:


Sounds good, I'll let you know when I get to that bridge if it will work out. I think it's too early to tell for now if it will work.

A note about the gears George mentioned....some manufacturer's gears are better than others(manufacturing processes, etc. for that gear ratio), as has been said by big gear head over in the Transmission/Driveline forum. I'd check over there with either him or tlowe to ask about a certain gear ratio and which brand to get in that ratio you're looking at. I know he said a Richmond 3.08 was almost always noisy but most of their other stuff is quiet. Sometimes a "cheap gear set" is exactly what it is.

Nailing your combo on the first try should be your goal. There are enough people in this group who have tried many different combinations that you should be able to get it how you want it. So, what we know so far is that you want around 3K RPM or less at 70MPH while keeping performance. When going to the track, what is a realistic goal you'd like to reach(without nitrous)... 12.5? 12.0? Idle/drivability quality and hill climbing are also factors here.

What I'm seeing so far from the consensus:

3.42 gears
60203 cam
2400-2500 stall
upgraded fuel line

Am I on the right track?

FYI for everybody out there wondering about a hydroboost option vs. manual brakes...it provides around 1300 PSI brake line pressure, about double that of a vacuum assisted booster. This is the reason they are used on 1 ton trucks, other heavy vehicles and performance cars from the factory. With the added 'around' 150lbs BBC weight, it would be a good option, especially for a car that sees some commute time with crazy drivers out there.

I'll check out the trans/driveline forum and see what I can find in there about the different vendors. I have heard the noisy complaint about the Richmond noise level in some other posts I have read in the past. I have no experience with them (yet).

Honestly going to the track is a after thought for me right now. I have no specific E.T. goal that I would like to reach...I figure once the build is done and I feel comfortable with flogging it then I'll roll it down there and see what it lays down.

Idle, and Driveability, hill climbing etc, and overall street manners are very important. I just dont want it so tame it's boring. I guess ultimately what I need to do is ride in some of the higher geared cars, or cars with bigger cams and see if that is something I am ok with for my chevelle. Right now the only thing I have to compare to that is fresh in my mind is George's Elky. Other than the start on the hill I like how it rode, seemed to cruise around town fine. Never did get it on the freeway though and I'm curious about what RPM he runs at since we both have th350's....Any input on that one George?

Other than all that the combo you listed so far sounds like the concensus. Is it possible to upgrade the hardline to 1/2" with the body on the frame? I've read that was a major PITA.

Right now the only thing I have to compare to that is fresh in my mind is George's Elky. Other than the start on the hill I like how it rode, seemed to cruise around town fine. Never did get it on the freeway though and I'm curious about what RPM he runs at since we both have th350's....Any input on that one George?

Other than all that the combo you listed so far sounds like the concensus. Is it possible to upgrade the hardline to 1/2" with the body on the frame? I've read that was a major PITA.

It is possible to upgrade to 1/2" hard line. It is a PITA to go OEM replacement configuration....not worth the hassle, bad things can happen on a 40 year old car with old body mount bolts/nuts when you're not planning on doing a frame-off(caged nuts spinning, snapping bolts off, etc....both of which I've had happen to me).

I'd recommend capping off the line that's there now, and routing your own that's easily accessible and out of the way of suspension travel, heat, and abrasion with other parts. You will also need the Robb MC 1/2" pickup in your sending unit, or have someone braze on a 1/2" tube in the other tube's place locally for you. Someone will know about an appropriate fuel pump for this application...I'm not up to speed on the mechanical units.

As for how different cars ride, you're totally correct that one car can be night and day from another. My car is/was totally different from George's Elky due to the manual trans, gear ratios, rubber vs. poly body mounts, etc. etc., as I'm sure Kevin's car is probably quite a bit different as well even though it's also an automatic.

Ray,

IMHO, you dont need to upgrade the fuel line. You are still at the point where the stock stuff will work fine. 450-475HP is what I'm guessing you will be at. I'm still running the stock stuff and have not seen any lack of fuel issues all the way to 6k. I even ran just a stock replacement fuel pump when I had the 60204.

Funny thing is my chevelle with a small block has 8AN all the way up from the sump. :confused: Stock fuel line was long gone and since this was already there, I adapted it to work for me.

The "Goon" has just a 2200 B&M and works fine with the 60204. Although the 60 ft would improve with a 3500 stall, it does have more than enough grunt to power off with the lower converter.

The street feel with the 2200 is better and does stupid burnouts.

Ray,

IMHO, you dont need to upgrade the fuel line. You are still at the point where the stock stuff will work fine. 450-475HP is what I'm guessing you will be at. I'm still running the stock stuff and have not seen any lack of fuel issues all the way to 6k. I even ran just a stock replacement fuel pump when I had the 60204.

Funny thing is my chevelle with a small block has 8AN all the way up from the sump. :confused: Stock fuel line was long gone and since this was already there, I adapted it to work for me.

Thanks Brett, I was just going to ask if the 1/2" was still a necessity for mostly street use. I don't mind changing it later if I get into flogging it at the track. I'm pretty sure it's 3/8ths line right now.

The "Goon" has just a 2200 B&M and works fine with the 60204. Although the 60 ft would improve with a 3500 stall, it does have more than enough grunt to power off with the lower converter.

The street feel with the 2200 is better and does stupid burnouts.

that is good to know....I would really like to run the 60204 to start. I didn't get around to checking the gear ratio last night as I was wiring in a override switch for my electric fans....hopefully tonight I can. I'm going to guess that it's the same as MattieP's 2.56. One of these days I'll get this car to lay some fat skid marks:D

I've got 3.73's and around a 3k stall behind my small block. Would be happy to give you a ride tomorrow if you want to see how it rides. Very streetable :thumbsup: And just a touch above 3k @ 60 mph. Actually get the best mileage on the freeway. Only use a little above a quarter tank from Seattle to Bremerton on race days :D

I've got 3.73's and around a 3k stall behind my small block. Would be happy to give you a ride tomorrow if you want to see how it rides. Very streetable :thumbsup: And just a touch above 3k @ 60 mph. Actually get the best mileage on the freeway. Only use a little above a quarter tank from Seattle to Bremerton on race days :D


You have a 70 right? Yeah sounds good I'm curious.

You have a 70 right? Yeah sounds good I'm curious.

Yeah, TW's a 70' :yes: Not a very pretty 70', but she gets the job done :thumbsup:

Sorry Ray, bringing my slow chevelle to the BBQ. :(


No problem, I have been curious to see it as well. We don't live too far apart, maybe when I get back from India we can meet up sometime. I'd love to get a look at your elky

The Goon has 3.73's too but is heavy. The other thing is, to go along with the 60204, it does have higher compression and the heads have some additional work so the power is better than just dropping it in a 9-1, stock headed 454.

Ray, you DO NOT want to go for a ride in Chad's car. :noway: I dont even think he has a passenger or back seat... Plus what if someone you know saw you!?! :eek: :o:o:o

;) :D

The Goon has 3.73's too but is heavy. The other thing is, to go along with the 60204, it does have higher compression and the heads have some additional work so the power is better than just dropping it in a 9-1, stock headed 454.


I have a set of 781 heads that I got from George that are completely bare with the exception of guide plates. I was going to talk to you at the BBQ about what options I have for those heads, and how much work would be required to get them to compliment that cam.

Ray, you DO NOT want to go for a ride in Chad's car. :noway: I dont even think he has a passenger or back seat... Plus what if someone you know saw you!?! :eek: :o:o:o

;) :D

It does have a passenger seat now, just no back seat any more :p

It does have a passenger seat now, just no back seat any more :p

I'd inspect how its held in really close, Ray... :yes: ;)

I'd inspect how its held in really close, Ray... :yes: ;)

4 5/16" bolts :p It's not going anywhere :noway:

I might know a guy with a Jegs 10" 2700-3000 stall coming on the market for cheap. It's been down the track in 11.72@115...

http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/60401/10002/-1#

It'll be coming out from under a certain Buick soon.

I'd take you for a demo ride but I'm missing a key component or two.:D

Ray, you DO NOT want to go for a ride in Chad's car. :noway: I dont even think he has a passenger or back seat... Plus what if someone you know saw you!?! :eek: :o:o:o

;) :D


Maybe Darryl has a brown paper bag I can wear, or maybe a beer box:D Yeah Chad my days of riding on milk crates are over. And I'm not about to get in the trunk...I'll just have to take your word for it:thumbsup:

4 5/16" bolts :p It's not going anywhere :noway:


Well I guess as long as the floor pan underneath those bolts isn't rusted out we'll be in business:D

I might know a guy with a Jegs 10" 2700-3000 stall coming on the market for cheap. It's been down the track in 11.72@115...

http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/60401/10002/-1#

It'll be coming out from under a certain Buick soon.

I'd take you for a demo ride but I'm missing a key component or two.:D


Thanks Greg....that converter might be a little too high for what I am after but I will def. keep it in mind. It sounds like I should be looking for one in the 2000-2400 range.

There is also rumor of a Hughes "2500" stall unit available from someone near Fort Lewis I was hearing about.....

There is also rumor of a Hughes "2500" stall unit available from someone near Fort Lewis I was hearing about.....


I will def keep that in mind

Ride in as many cars as you can at the BBQ.

I pull 2600 rpm at 60,,,,

yeah I definitely will, and will be taking combo notes as well. Really looking forward to tomorrow. Hope the 'velle doesn't give me any more problems

Thanks Greg....that converter might be a little too high for what I am after but I will def. keep it in mind. It sounds like I should be looking for one in the 2000-2400 range.

That's the same exact converter I have, so you'll still get a chance to see how it handles :yes: It's really not bad at all, even in the city. Going up hills isn't a problem at all :noway:

Came across this on Ebay and was curious as to wether or not that's a good deal. It says the lifters are lunati as well. I wasn't sure if I would want to run a lunati timing gear/chain...I thought Cloyes was the preferred brand. What do you guys think?



http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/LUNATI-BBC-276-284-VOODOO-HYDRAULIC-CAMSHAFT-KIT-60204_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2em20Q2el111 6QQhashZitem20ad564f6fQQitemZ140347068271QQptZMoto rsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

I bet that timing chain is made by cloyes, I ordered a crane timing chain, it showed up in a crane box, but the cam gear said cloyes on it.

I've had parts repackaged to suit the name brand that's being sold....so Matt could very well be right. Either way, Lunati or Cloyes are both good brands.

I was very happy with the Lunati 60203 cam in my 454 last year. It was a pretty mild cam, but it did get my car an 11.61 on a 150 shot, and a 12.29 on motor.

I'm going to do the buy it now and get it sent to the house.

I just noticed that this whole thread is titled "Big BOCK for Bad.Samaritan" I don't know how I missed that one.:clonk:

i noticed that a couple weeks ago ray, lol, i misspell stuf alot aslo

WHo cares about good spelling when you're sporting big block power. :D

Well I guess next on the list is pistons.....Brett I dug the part number to your original hypers out of your thread but I dont think you posted the part number off of second set you bought...do you remember what it is?

Well I guess next on the list is pistons.....Brett I dug the part number to your original hypers out of your thread but I dont think you posted the part number off of second set you bought...do you remember what it is?


probe p2465's

Yup, that right I think. Its within the last few dozen pages. :D

WHo cares about good spelling when you're sporting WOOD. :D

TMI.:yes:

Just a question, but why not go with forged pistons? I know they're lighter and cheaper....

Just a question, but why not go with forged pistons? I know they're lighter and cheaper....


That was the plan...just trying to figure out what Dome size is the best for use with my cam/head combo. Been checking out some CR calculators and there are some parameters that it's asking for that I either don't understand or don't know the info. These are some pistons that I am looking at. Just want to make sure that a 25cc dome doesn't put me too far up there in CR.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRW-L2465F60/

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SRP-212136/

Those SRP's are sure nice looking slugs.

yeah they are just lots of $$$$$

If I hadn't been asked to work early tomorrow just this evening.......I was gonna go score something for the Bad.Samaritan. Had to cxl, try later in the week.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/WIS-PT010H6/

-21cc dome with a 116 chamber and .041 quench puts you at 10.13:1 comp. The wiseco's come with rings.
The problem with these pistons is that they are always on back order, I waited for 3 months before doc offered me a 427 assembly.

If I hadn't been asked to work early tomorrow just this evening.......I was gonna go score something for the Bad.Samaritan. Had to cxl, try later in the week.


Awesome...thanks George I appreciate it. :thumbsup:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/WIS-PT010H6/

-21cc dome with a 116 chamber and .041 quench puts you at 10.13:1 comp. The wiseco's come with rings.
The problem with these pistons is that they are always on back order, I waited for 3 months before doc offered me a 427 assembly.


Those look nice....question though...single or dual valve relief? what is the deciding factor in going with dual?

Those look nice....question though...single or dual valve relief? what is the deciding factor in going with dual?

i'm really not sure, i'm sure doc will chime in and say, but i fit my mild solid roller in on a set of these pistons. (248/254 .653/.660) No gasket and zero lash I had .075" on both the intake and exhaust.

The bb heads are called canted valve heads and only truley need a valve relief on the intake side. The dome has an area cut down for exhaust clearance but does not go into the flat of the piston so tecnically it's still a relief.

The flat top's with duel valve reliefs are normally rebuilder type pistons that can be put on either direction because the relief is for the intake no matter which way it goes on. Basically idiot proof.

did ya see that 396 rod and piston set I had at Doc's BBQ? That is what he is talking about.

The bb heads are called canted valve heads and only truley need a valve relief on the intake side. The dome has an area cut down for exhaust clearance but does not go into the flat of the piston so tecnically it's still a relief.

The flat top's with duel valve reliefs are normally rebuilder type pistons that can be put on either direction because the relief is for the intake no matter which way it goes on. Basically idiot proof.

OK Makes sense....thanks for explaining that Doc. I just wasn't sure that I didn't have to take that into consideration when choosing pistons.

did ya see that 396 rod and piston set I had at Doc's BBQ? That is what he is talking about.


I vaguely remember....but I get what he's explaining

Ah the good ol days. Duno if this helps or not since doc pretty much nailed it.

http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa50/468Brian/old/DSCF0096.jpg

minor update on this project....finally got down to Georges and picked up the block, crank, and some bearings. Got everything in the garage so it stares at me every time I am in there. Hopefully that will keep me motivated to get it finished. Also Picked up a 12 bolt from George and got it home. Looks like the BBC build is going to take a back seat until the 12 bolt is done.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c139/Masonrm/DSCN0684.jpg

You can always start cleaning stuff on the engine:yes:.....paint the block if you need no machine work done and it won't be going in a hot tank.

that engine and stand....they look familiar

You can always start cleaning stuff on the engine:yes:.....paint the block if you need no machine work done and it won't be going in a hot tank.

yeah I would but it still has to go the machinist and get work done. I will worry about that when the 12 bolt is done and I have some extra money again. Sooner or later this car is going to end up with a completely new drivetrain

Ray,

Yes, concentrate on the diff for now. Get one project done at a time.
IRRC that engine was .010 over. Will be nice if it is usable at .030" over.
I am wondering when Berg's Custom Cylinder Heads is gonna tool-up for a run of BBC heads.

Working a run of blocks right now. Jason, Dan, Jeremy, and Kevin's.

Working a run of blocks right now. Jason, Dan, Jeremy, and Kevin's.

Great! No racin means shop time at the Berg BBC Museum:thumbsup:

Once you get the 12 bolt off to Dave's, if you have a die grinder and an air compressor you could start cleaning out the oil drain back hole(s) in the lifter valley and the oil holes going towards the timing set. It would be a good time to do it before the machine work, and less to pay for if you want it done anyway. I agree, one project at a time but sometimes one project gets boring or you get tired of doing it....happened to me many times especially when it's something I don't really like doing.

If you get reeaaalllly bored, you could smooth the outside of the block with the die grinder....but that's a big project and more for a show vehicle(or Mark I think).

George had pointed that out to me as well the other day about grinding out that little area. Grinding smooth the block would look cool IMO, but I don't have the tools/time to sit there and do that.

The flat top's with duel valve reliefs are normally rebuilder type pistons that can be put on either direction because the relief is for the intake no matter which way it goes on. Basically idiot proof.

:D they sound like my kind of piston :D

while we are talking about things to do to the block, what's your guys' take on having a block powdercoated? I was thinking about that burgundy/red block at Darryl's that he told me was powder coated. Been thinking that I would like to have mine a silver color similar to the color of the car. Thought about black as well but that might be difficult to see leaks etc.

while we are talking about things to do to the block, what's your guys' take on having a block powdercoated? I was thinking about that burgundy/red block at Darryl's that he told me was powder coated. Been thinking that I would like to have mine a silver color similar to the color of the car. Thought about black as well but that might be difficult to see leaks etc.

If your going to powder coat it then I would smooth out the block so it looks real good.

If you ever want to change the color of your block how hard is it to remove the powder coating?

IMO silver will be hard to keep clean. For ease and money saving I would probably just spray it. If you clean the block well and paint it, it seems to be pretty durable. Not sure if its hard to get powdercoat off afterwards, thats a good question.

I would think you'd have to re-heat the block to get powder coating off and blast it as it sort of seeps into the metal.

Permatex gasket remover is what I was told to use on the stuff I had powder coated on my bike. spray it on and 10-15 miutes later the powder coat will bubble.

Well update on this project..still rounding up parts as usual. I took Doc my block just before the holidays so it would be in line at the emporium for bore/hone/deck etc. Also bought those new forged SRP pistons from him as well. I have to head back to Alaska on the third, so another round of OT, but this time it will all go towards BBC parts.

Update:

Ordered a couple of small things tonight....got a Harmonic Balancer off of Summit, also got my eye on a milodon pan (should be same one Dave and Brett have) as well as HV oil pump. Had a question on the fuel pump, what the optimal gph flow rate ? I saw everything in there from 110, 130, 170 etc. I was thinking either 110 or 130 but not sure, also would I need a fuel regulator for either of those. Just working on the wishlist so I can drop a decent sized order with the coupon and save a couple of bucks.

Always good to make the order all conclusive, while I dont have an answer for the pump flow question, maybe I could think of some things I need and come by to drop off some cash?

I'm in Alaska at the moment but shoot me a PM with your number and we can setup a time for you to head over and grab some stuff. As for cash don't sweat it you can buy me a beer sometime, your saving me the headache of dealing with wierdos from Craigslist.

Well what I Immediately was refering to was adding to your summit order to save money. What comes to mind right now is a few -4 AN braided hoses for my dad's alcohol injection kit and a wide band O2 sensor kit :) :) :)

Yeah I'm retarded....gotchya.....yeah that would be cool, we can set something up. PM your number and I'll try to give you a call. all that was going to go in this order was oilpump and fuel pump

I thought you were referring to the 10 bolt stuff we were talking about earlier.

Yea I figured thats why I clarified my message, sorry. K Ill send you my personal number but let me tell you I'm the worst with the cell phone so if I dont answer dont think nothin of it haha!

no problem

is your buddies Nova Green by any chance? There is a badass green one that rolls around MV a lot in the summer

Rofl yea it is. it has had a primered black front end on it for about 1.5 years. This car will have no hood and a cigarette will likely don my friend's mouth!!

heres a link to my friend's nova, I took this video about 5 days ago. A comment would make him happy! hah

YouTube- Broadcast Yourself.

Yup I'm pretty sure that's the one. there is also a highschool kid with a blue one w/white stripes who works at Kragen on 516 at the bottom of the hill.

HAH you mean Schuck's right? Yep Ive talked to him!

Hey post me a pic of your car man, dont think I've seen one!

click on my name in one of my posts, there's a big one in there

some more on the first page of this thread I believe

Sweet. Tomorrow I should get the alcohol jet in the mail, and will order the disk brake set.. This things turning into a real G machine hah!

The Kit is nice, I was pretty happy with it. Eventually I would like to go to 4wheel disc and Hydroboost so I can get rid of the vac booster run a more open wheel. You need to get it to the track and give some of these guys some motorvation to mess with turbo's.

This question I had got buried under some general BSing

Update:

Ordered a couple of small things tonight....got a Harmonic Balancer off of Summit, also got my eye on a milodon pan (should be same one Dave and Brett have) as well as HV oil pump. Had a question on the fuel pump, what the optimal gph flow rate ? I saw everything in there from 110, 130, 170 etc. I was thinking either 110 or 130 but not sure, also would I need a fuel regulator for either of those. Just working on the wishlist so I can drop a decent sized order with the coupon and save a couple of bucks.

This is the fuel pump that several TCNW guys are running.
It'll fuel whatever you want to run and doesn't need a regulator.

http://www.competitionproducts.com/Carter-Race-Series-Fuel-Pump-Chev-SB-172-gph-70-85-psi/productinfo/M60969/

Do you already have 3/8" fuel line?
If not, depending on your power level you may want to upgrade your pickup and fuel line as well.

Pretty sure the fuel line is 3/8ths but not positive I meant to measure a while ago and just never got around to it. I just wasn't sure if the flow rate depended on what specific model carb I chose to run or not.

I had 5/16" factory fuel line and upgraded to a 1/2" pickup and 8AN steel braided hose from the tank to the fuel pump.

I'm running a 750 double pumper with the small block version of that pump.

All the pump will do is ensure that the gas gets to the carb, the carb will dictate how much fuel gets into the engine.

I have contemplated picking up a RobMC 1/2"in pickup and installing it anda new line. When I get back home I will measure it and see what size the stock one it now. Thanks Greg

So ray, lets bring me back up to date... what are the engine build choices you've made?
I started reviewing the thread but never saw what the final choices were...

781s... Domed pistons... Zero Deck block?... Intake?... Cam...?

FYI I'm running stock 3/8" line and a carter 172. As far as I can tell, no fuel starvation with as much power as I'm running.

So ray, lets bring me back up to date... what are the engine build choices you've made?
I started reviewing the thread but never saw what the final choices were...

781s... Domed pistons... Zero Deck block?... Intake?... Cam...?

Yeah I haven't been good at updating and the 12 bolt project got in the way. Here's everything so far:

Block is at Doc's tanked, bored, etc. (not sure about deck will have to ask)
Stock Cast Crank
Thumb rods with ARP bolts from Doc
Forged SRP domed pistons 24.xx CC dome-also got from Doc
Lunati 60204 Cam (Although still open to options nothing purchased yet)
Performer RPM Intake or comparable Weiand Intake
Carb will be a Holley 700-770CFM not sure on Street Avenger or DP

Yeah I haven't been good at updating and the 12 bolt project got in the way. Here's everything so far:

Lunati 60204 Cam - nice street/strip cam:thumbsup:, although you could run one of the solid Harold grinds that several of the BBC here are running. Either way, you'll be doing plenty of this :D when it fires off!:yes:

Carb will be a Holley 700-770CFM not sure on Street Avenger or DP

There has been some very convincing TCNW dyno numbers on BBC'c that point to 800-850 double pumpers, over 750 vac sec carbs.... maybe those guys will jump in here.

In response to Gregs post, I liked the 60204 but do think I like the solid version 402a3 a bit more. I wish I could do a side by side comparison because I did take a few months off while I rebuilt the engine(may have forgotten). I am running an 850DP and driveability is great. Easy startup, idles on its own, drives smooth, and still pulls off 15mpg. :thumbsup:

Still waiting on you to come take that ride Ray. :cool:

- nice street/strip cam:thumbsup:, although you could run one of the solid Harold grinds that several of the BBC here are running. Either way, you'll be doing plenty of this :D when it fires off!:yes:



There has been some very convincing TCNW dyno numbers on BBC'c that point to 800-850 double pumpers, over 750 vac sec carbs.... maybe those guys will jump in here.

Yeah that was going to be my next question...What carbs are you guys running?

In response to Gregs post, I liked the 60204 but do think I like the solid version 402a3 a bit more. I wish I could do a side by side comparison because I did take a few months off while I rebuilt the engine(may have forgotten). I am running an 850DP and driveability is great. Easy startup, idles on its own, drives smooth, and still pulls off 15mpg. :thumbsup:

Still waiting on you to come take that ride Ray. :cool:

Thanks for the offer Brett, I will take you up on it once I get back to the world. I'm hoping to be there in time for the BBQ but it looks like I might be able to get back on the 2nd or the 3rd.

- nice street/strip cam:thumbsup:, although you could run one of the solid Harold grinds that several of the BBC here are running. Either way, you'll be doing plenty of this :D when it fires off!:yes:

I ran the 60203 and it was fine, I just really like the solid 402A7 a whole bunch more.

There has been some very convincing TCNW dyno numbers on BBC'c that point to 800-850 double pumpers, over 750 vac sec carbs.... maybe those guys will jump in here.

An honest 50 rwhp on the dyno, in back to back tests between my holley 3310 750 vac sec, and bolting on Darryl's 800 DP. No other changes. An 800 DP off ebay was my very next purchase. Fuel economy :confused: What's that ? :D

An honest 50 rwhp on the dyno, in back to back tests between my holley 3310 750 vac sec, and bolting on Darryl's 800 DP. No other changes. An 800 DP off ebay was my very next purchase. Fuel economy :confused: What's that ? :D

Darryls 800DP is magic- I'm sure of it. Maybe its the NO2 residue caked inside it or something.

Took my elky (pre gears & stall) from 13.3 to 13.01 back to back runs.

The next spring, after gears & converter change I ran 12.95 with my old carb- I'm still convinced it would have been in the 12.6 range running his carb :eek:

If i had just borrowed that carb one more time, my elk would STILL be haunting george :D

Looks like I need to watch Ebay for a 800 DP then, I had based the first guesstimate on Holley's diagram the have on their site its just a basic diagram that that recommends a certain CFM carb based on the cubic inches of your motor. Should have guessed it was conservative

Even the 454v1, humble as it is, has an 800DP.
I got mine of C-L for $100. I guess I called 30 seconds after the ad popped-up.
Near new.

Most of the guys get the factory refurb jobs from Holley

Hey, my membership upgrade status mailed-in 31 DEC just happened!

So put in a small order in at summit, nothing too crazy just some of the misc stuff needed. I got a Moroso HV oil pump, oil pump shaft, and a oil pump stud. Next order will probably be oil pan and intake. St

Looks like I need to watch Ebay for a 800 DP then, I had based the first guesstimate on Holley's diagram the have on their site its just a basic diagram that that recommends a certain CFM carb based on the cubic inches of your motor. Should have guessed it was conservative

Buy one off Holley's ebay store. That's what I did, 800DP Holley. Their ebay store sells carbs that people bought new and returned. Holley goes through them and referbishes and re-calibrates them. The one I got looked brand new, bolted it on and all I did so far was set the idle and float levels. I haven't even adjusted the mixture screws yet and it starts everytime. $357.00 to my door with a 90 day warrenty. Can't beat that! Better than knobdicking around with a used carb that you'll probably spend over $100.00 just for the complete rebuild kit and there's no warrenty.

Here's the link: http://stores.ebay.com/Holley-Performance?_rdc=1

Thanks for the link Mark, I'll go and check it out. Darryl, had mentioned it to me also when I took my block up there for him to work on. This will probably be the last thing I buy so as to make sure my 90 day warranty is still there when the motor is actually fired and broke in.

Tthe 3310 is not a bad street carb. They just come to you set up for a warmed-up 350. After $100 in changes, you can have a pretty snappy 3310.

I liked my 950 HP 830 cfm

Been looking at the holley store, there are 800, 830, and 850's all on there for around 369.00. That's a lot less than I expected to pay

Do you guys run Vacuum Secondaries or Mechanical? Just noticed at least 2 of them were VS carbs

Do you guys run Vacuum Secondaries or Mechanical? Just noticed at least 2 of them were VS carbs

Mechanical! :thumbsup:

Most guys around here run the mechanical(that's what Holley calls a Double Pumper, BG calls it mechanical or progressive linkage), especially the manual transmission guys. Last year at the swap meet I had a conversation with Roger about vaccuum secondary carbs, he said they can perform well if tuned right, down into the 11s....he definitely had a lot more insight on all of that than I had heard of. I don't know which way you want to go, but I think the vaccuum carbs get better mileage on an automatic car with better street manners...opinions may vary on experience though.

Ray, the vac sec carb is a great choice for many applications. However, from my limited experience, the double pumper is the way to go for wide open throttle shi7 eating grin fun.

get one of each

get one of each


How bout you buy me one and I'll buy one and you can keep whichever doesn't pan out?:D

once I get my 850 dp I got from chad figured out I could let you try my 3310

once I get my 850 dp I got from chad figured out I could let you try my 3310


Thanks Mattie, I think I'm just going to tow the line and run what everyone else is running. It would make it a lot easier if I came into tuning problems

If you are spending money on a carb, Ray, just buy the double pumper. I can bring my old 3310 vac sec to the track with me in the spring. You can bolt it on after a couple passes with the dp, and see how little fun it is to go slower.

If you are spending money on a carb, Ray, just buy the double pumper. I can bring my old 3310 vac sec to the track with me in the spring. You can bolt it on after a couple passes with the dp, and see how little fun it is to go slower.


Yeah I think that is the best way to go. Thanks for all the input guys

If you are spending money on a carb, Ray, just buy the double pumper. I can bring my old 3310 vac sec to the track with me in the spring. You can bolt it on after a couple passes with the dp, and see how little fun it is to go slower.

And you can try my 800DP'r.

Been looking at the holley store, there are 800, 830, and 850's all on there for around 369.00. That's a lot less than I expected to pay

If you're not worried about needing a choke, I'd look at the HP one's. The 830 HP's refurbs in the Holley store are about $475. That's what we got for James for Christmas and runs great out of the box and says feels better than my 800 DP'r. Jame's present engine is a very warm 355 but we wanted to get him a carb that would work very great on that and also a 454 that is in his future.

Here's the one we got, they usually have a price or offer so started out at 450 and went up untill it accepted the offer. We got the annular boosters because they have a little better off idle throttle and power with a large cam but not required.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280415858300&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT

Also don't down play thinking about a 950 HP, I ran a 950 on my 355 in the WN and still have one on it in Roger's 68 chevelle.

Here's one each of the 830's and we already know they will take $460

Annular Booster 830

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Holley-0-80511-1-830hp-Nascar-Factory-Refurbished_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem414bf8403bQ QitemZ280447434811QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPart sQ5fAccessories

Down-leg boosters:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Holley-0-80509-1-830hp-Nascar-Factory-Refurbished_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem518f99570fQ QitemZ350301542159QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPart sQ5fAccessories

Agree with Darryl there, I ran a 950hp on my 461 and it worked extremely well.:beers:

Agree with Darryl there, I ran a 950hp on my 461 and it worked extremely well.:beers:

I was running one on my 427 and it will go back on when I get the car back on the road.:thumbsup:

Thanks for the offers guys on letting me try out different carbs, I'll be keeping my eye out for a deal but unless I come across something great, I won't be buying till the end of the build. There's too many other parts and machine work that need to be paid for that has to come first. This will also give me some more time to read and pick your brains about all of this. So it sounds at a minimum a 800 DP with other possibilities from there?

I'd take up a few of the offers Ray. Get the beast done and in the car. Borrow a few carbs...see what YOUR combo likes. Mostly street driving, I'd be thinking moderation.
If your intent is to set the world on fire...whole different game (and budget).
Once you have sorted things out, then buy a carb.

I had this ol 3310 in RatVette for years. Total POS. Needed a rebuild a few times. Needed float bowls a few times, old the needle and seat popped up/threads worn. Fast forward a bit, with a few mods, a pretty decent street carb. With rear metering block conversion, a very viable street carb. I would tell you out of the box, a 3310 is pretty lame.

I would tell you out of the box, a 3310 is pretty lame.

As John (OUTCAST) can attest to.

As John (OUTCAST) can attest to.


Exactly my point! Put the rear metering block on there, fatten it to pri 72/ sec 84 or there about, larger front squirter...then play with the secondary springs. I'm not gonna say even then it is a match for a 750 or 800DP but it will not be a slouch like a stocker.

soooo I went ahead and ordered a oil pump with a pickup included. On summit it says oil pan depth 8.00. I've found some pans that list depths of 8.250 and 8.500 (which are more expensive) does anyone have any suggestions as to what minimum clearance I should have. I'm just hoping I didn't make a mistake in buying this pump.

Oil pump I bought:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MOR-22185/

8.500" Pan
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MIL-30950/

8.250" Pan
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-G3604/

If I was you, I'd use a stock depth pan. That way it ain't hanging any lower then it will already.

I looked at brett's parts list and the pickup he lists says 8" for pan depth. But the pan he listed also says it has a depth of 8". So I'm not sure if they mean use a minimum of a 8" pan or what.

Minumum 8" depth pan. that pump is prolly 7 3/4", and set up for a stock pan

Awesome thanks Dave, I was a little confused there Summit lists that wierd. I'll just order the same milodon pan Brett lists in his build

That's the same as I have. I got a stud kit for mine also, kinda neat, I'll tell Ya. Put the stud's in, rtv it, then put the gasket over the studs, put the pan on and go. I like it.

Summit also sell's a cheap polished, cast aluminum timing cover that is awesome.

Yeah I saw that while I was looking at their Summit brand alt. brackets. Nice looking stuff and cheap as well. I like the idea of the stud kit, so I threw it in the cart as well. Now just have to wait for payday

Yea I have studs as well, they are nice to have. I like the milodon pan but had to put petroleum teflon on the drain plug to keep it from leaking. I tried most types of washers too.

Double check your pick-up to pan clearance - too little it will cavitate, too much it will not be in the oil. 1/4" - 3/8"