I am building a 64 street/strip chevelle and am planning my brake and suspension mods. I am running a 500+ hp 383 stroker with 411 gears and a race built TH350 trans. My goal is to run 11-12's but still have a streetable car. I know that there are options for the brakes and susp. but would like to get as many opinions as possible. I value any info offered.

Thanks ahead of time,

Gene

Ahhhh nevermind. I'll just lurk for a while and see what the rest come up with.....

Hey Dennis. I have been reading your posts and am pretty impressed - read your 101 but didn't understand much(I am new at this). Hoping you can recommend maybe some inexpensive but functional ideas to start with as that seems to be the two major considerations.
Thanks for your time,

Gene

Front: Stock spindles, keep your turning radius and bumpsteer at a minimum. Run the Speedway extened ball joints (like these (http://www.speedwaymotors.com/xq/asp/strBase_List./hilt./source.2191/base_no.91720032/str_base_no.000%2DCATALOG+RACE%2C91034323%2C910348 12%2C91082160%2C91088200%2C91089411%2C91720032%2C9 1720036%2C91720039%2C/header_title.NEW%21+Race+Products%2DBall+Joints/page_name.prod%5Flist%5Fdisplay%2Easp/search_type.L2%7E27/search_option./deptsearch./deptSearch_id.2/dept_id.L2%7E27/dept_id_p.2/dept_name./dept_name_p.NEW%21+Race+Products/ShowImages.yes/sq.0/cont.1/intPgNo.1/redirect./qx/product.htm) ). That will help create a better camber curve during roll (the point of running tall spindles). Baer has a nice bolt on disc brake kit, I think 12" rotors so you may need to up the wheel size (which I highly encourage anyway). New bushings and ball joints, use poly in the front. Hothckis drop coils and Konis.

The rear is easy, Hothckis drop coils, Konis and UMI arms....call it done. I like running steel axle bushings for the upper arms but you could get away with rubber if you were concerned over possible NVH.

Total investment should be under 2K (except for wheels and tires) which isn't bad considering how much more pleasant how much safer you will be.

I may have a GP working with UMI, give them a couple weeks to launch the new product line and get back to me.

Raised Pivot Ball Joints?!?!?

Dang it Denny, you never mentioned them to me before. What are they good for and should I use them when I rebuild the front end of my 67 week end cruiser? What do you tell a shop when it comes time for alignment?

Just when I thought I had it figured out.... :rolleyes:

The "tall" ball joints accomplish the same "tall" spindles do without the negative side affects. They raise the roll center which is way too low on an "A" body and also correct the camber curve.

Stock "A" bodies camber positive when cornering which causes the contact patch to shrink. Effectively lengthening the spindle causes the tire to camber negative during cornering maintaining a decent contact patch.

Sorry for the simpleten explaination.....at work I don't have time to think out my responses.

Sorry Herb, I had initialy thought you were using the Baer tall kit.

Great! Thanks so much Denny for the super info and insight. What are Konis? Could you let me know how to contact these guys? Could I get this stuff from Summit,Jegs or elswhere at a better price?
What tire size will I be required to go to with the Baer disc setup?

Thanks again for the help,

Gene

The Baer track kit will fit any 16" and maybe some 15" wheels. I would look into 17" myself, many more tire choices available.

Koni shocks are available from Summit and I'm sure Jegs too, they are a little pricey, so are the QA1's and Biltsetin. You get what you pay for and with shocks you want the best.

Great advice except for one thing. The UBJs mentioned above are simply 1/2 ton truck BJs. The taper is different than the passenger car spindles. You "can" run them like that (I have prior to better alternatives and so have thousands of circle track guys) but it`s not *right*. You can ream the spindles but then the stud drops farther into the spindle and you loose any BJ pivot height you may have gained. Also they have large bolt pattern "truck" mounting flanges that won`t fit stock or direct replacement aftermarket Chevelle UCAs. The circle track guys who run them use large bolt pattern UCAs. You can still achieve exactly what you`re looking for though with tall stud direct fit modular ball joints from...well...us. smile.gif Yes,they`re much more expensive but they fit and work perfectly and are oustanding quality. They`re also rebuildable and adj. so you won`t have to buy another set for life.
Be aware that *any* tall BJ or taller spindle may require shorter UCAs,especially if the car`s been lowered and or if you want to use modern alignment settings with more - camber and + caster. The UCA BJ mounting pad may have to be at a different angle also in order to eliminate UBJ bind in bump. That`s why we usually sell the tall modular UBJs in a package with correctly matched adj. tubular UCAs ie. our Street Comp Stage 1 or 2 packages. The Baer 12"/PBR brakes,Konis,rest of Dennis`s advice etc. are right on as usual. Marcus

Marcus, thanks for checking in. Just some FYI for those interested...how about a rough estimate on what the Howe joints are costing these days. To those interested the Howe joints are the best. There are cheaper alternatives out there but like the saying goes, "you get what you pay for".

Hi guys! thought I would add the Hydroboost thing. Since it runs off of the power steering pump, it requires "no vacuum". Some guys go conservative on their cam shaft to get the brakes to work. With the Hydroboost, you can run any whopper cam you want. On those Baer brakes, they are great, but don't forget they only have 1.5" pistons, and pads half the size of stock chevelles. They require higher pressure to work. There is a photo of a blown 454 Chevelle on the website : POWERBRAKESERVICES.COM click on company info, for a look. Thanks, Bob

I`ll do better than an estimate,they`re $85ea. assembled,with poly boots,boot spacer for the tall studs and Grade 8 hardware. Yeah,they`re expensive but they`re so sweet! We keep one on the counter in the office. Almost everyone who comes in (even some women!) eventually picks it up and starts playing with it. I`ve had people say "Hey,this thing is really cool! What is it?" smile.gif

As for the brakes,yeah the PBRs have smaller pistons but they have 2. Believe me it took Ben O`Connor at Baer quite some time of going over the hydraulics math to convince me that they do indeed require the same master cyl. as the OE brakes! Having installed a number of them (both 12" and 13") on cars that still use a stock master cyl. I can tell you the improvement in braking performance is huge! Stopping distanced are MUCH shorter and pedal feel is very good. I have to agree now that that the stock master (at least on G body and 3rd gen F) is very well matched indeed. Where a different cyl. is required Baer includes the proper one in their kit.
That said hydroboost certainly has it`s applications,especially on cars with low vacume. If vacume`s an issue I`d sooner use the hydroboost *with* the larger rotors and superior calipers myself. smile.gif Boosting line pressure is all well and good but if you already have enough pressure to induce brake lockup you`re basically just reducing pedal effort. Which is not a bad thing! As I see it hydroboost isn`t a substitute for a improved calipers,rotors or pads but a potentially nice compliment to them. Marcus

I appreciate all of the imput everyone. You guys really have great ideas!

Denny, if I use the Hotchkis drop coils that you recommended and the extended ball joints along with the increase in wheel size to 16 or 17,
will I have a clearance problem(wheelwells/front fenders,etc.?) Do I use the stock LCA's? Also, what additional suspension mods do you recommend for the rear?( traction bars,ladder bars,etc.)

Marcus, is your stage 1 or 2 kit the correct application for my street/strip car (hold up at the strip),and will they bolt on without any mods? Also, what are the prices for the 2 kits?

Thanks again for all of the help,

Gene

Gene, no wheel problem as long as backspacing and tire size is ordered appropriately.

Rebuild the upper rear arms with rubber bushings and replace the lowers with a set of the new UMI arms due to be replaced anytime now (I'll keep everybody notified as I receive info). Stock and inspected LCA will work fine. Make sure to use some decent CA bushings, either poly or Teflon in the front, that will make a huge difference in steering response and increasing roll stiffness.

The SC&C stuff is proven on the street and track, very good stuff. If I were a bolt on type guy I would buy his kits (the stage 5 kit is the one you really want....$$$$).

I'm also working on a '64.

I spoke to someone @ Hotchkis and they're supposed to have the 2" drop springs available mid-Feb. You may want to hold out a little longer for springs.

Thanks again guys for the help in deciding what to do.

I'll check into the SC&C kits and will consider the Hotchkis springs as well.

I will post and let everyone know for sure what I went with and how it all worked.

Thanks again so much everyone for your time and imput.

Gene