After about 500 miles after my camshaft swap I decided it was time to change the oil, plugs, and readjust my valve lash. I take off my filter, and attack it. Open it up, and ran my finger over the filter that after some close observation looked like a gold mine. Long story short, my found metal in my filter after 500 miles of a cam swap. What should I do? I feel like my car has cancer... I can slow the process but it will eventually kill it since I dont think there is a cure once the grinding starts.

Its not the end of the world but I would tear it down. How did you break in the cam so that you can avoid this on the next build?

how much metal? there is obviously gonna be some metal remnants from the cam break in. that is what is happening during the break in. course it usually does not look like metal flake, usually just black dirty oil is what it looks like. also it is a good idea to change the oil right after the break in rather than running that stuff for a while.

take a dial indicator and check your lift at each lobe, and that should tell ya if there is a lobe going away. also if you don't have a real noisy valve train under normal conditions, then you may be able to hear a little ticking in the valve train that is not normally there. also you will be down on power if the cam is going away. see the attached pics to see how i know this. this one was my fault though. mine happened to a cam that had about 30K miles on it running fine. put the car in storage for 2 years with a fresh oil change. came home and drove it without changing the oil again and raced. it. broke a lifter, and swapped one out. funny thing is the one mismatched (USED!) lifter i swapped in is not the one that later failed that you see here.

"gold mine"-is it bronze or steel you found

Its not the end of the world but I would tear it down. How did you break in the cam so that you can avoid this on the next build?

I broke in the cam under proper conditions. 2000rpm for 20 minutes. Never let it idle. Changed the oil after the break in. Used proper oil.

As far as "next time" I will never use a flat tappet cam again. I am considering getting rid of this 350 for a old 454 that would have more potential.

how much metal? there is obviously gonna be some metal remnants from the cam break in. that is what is happening during the break in. course it usually does not look like metal flake, usually just black dirty oil is what it looks like. also it is a good idea to change the oil right after the break in rather than running that stuff for a while.

take a dial indicator and check your lift at each lobe, and that should tell ya if there is a lobe going away. also if you don't have a real noisy valve train under normal conditions, then you may be able to hear a little ticking in the valve train that is not normally there. also you will be down on power if the cam is going away. see the attached pics to see how i know this. this one was my fault though. mine happened to a cam that had about 30K miles on it running fine. put the car in storage for 2 years with a fresh oil change. came home and drove it without changing the oil again and raced. it. broke a lifter, and swapped one out. funny thing is the one mismatched (USED!) lifter i swapped in is not the one that later failed that you see here.

Well I would look at the filter and notice there is "something" there. I take a closer look and see that there is small gold colored looking flakes. Literally flakes. Smaller than a grain of sand. I would run my finger down the inside of a filter fold and pick up some of the flakes. This would be at nearly every filter fold.

"gold mine"-is it bronze or steel you found

I am not sure. I took a magnet to it but it was hard to tell if I was pulling the flakes with the magnet or through the liquids adhesion and cohesion properties when the magnet slightly touched the oil.

Heres a picture of the stuff. What confuses me is that it isnt the color of the cam. It has a gold/bronze shade to it. But that might just be the oil covering it.

http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p162/numtwo/Chevelle/DSC01509.jpg

Any ideas guys? Should I just keep on running the motor until it just gives up and do another cam/lifter swap?

Oil pressure change ?

Oil pressure change ?

Not really. Cold start around 60 at cruise and 55 at idle. After full warm up of the oil at a steady 2k rpm for about 20 minutes (my commute) it will idle in the low 20s and cruise around the mid 40s. If I am on the highway for the commute (3k rpm for 20 minutes) it will be around the top 40s during the cruise and idle a bit under 20.

Oh edit. I have a slight rear main seal leak but nothing too bad. I used bar leaks for the rear main seal but it didnt seem to help after the 500 miles. I was going to use it again a few times so see if it just needed a bit more miles to work. Also I am getting some coolant into the oil. It was milky when it pooled out of the filter. I have not lost much coolant though and the temperature has never gotten out of hand. It will give me a chance to check out the other bars leaks products.

I would just run it. If there is any damage, it is already done. When you change the oil filter, put in a plug in the oil bypass valve or put one of THESE (http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=PRM%2D1135&FROM=MG) on to ensure you have filtered oil. Run a Wix 51061 oil filter as well.
http://static.summitracing.com/global/images/prod/large/prm-1135_w.jpg

Looks like you've got some orange paint in there as well.

Ignore the paint. That probably got there on accident. I can assure you there is no orange paint in the engine. (knock on wood)

I will consider running the wix oil filter.

Ignore the paint. That probably got there on accident. I can assure you there is no orange paint in the engine. (knock on wood)

I will consider running the wix oil filter.

Make sure to put that adapter without a bypass valve on. This will ensure you will always have filtered oil, and no or further damage can occur.

That stuff looks like bearing material but I may be wrong. I hope I'm wrong.

why not run it for another 500 miles or so and change the oil again and see where you are at. if it is material from the main bearings or more likely cam bearings the damage is done anyway. be optimistic:)

That stuff looks like bearing material but I may be wrong. I hope I'm wrong.

Hmmmm well I remember that I used proper lube on the bearings of the camshaft. I have decent oil pressure so my bearings cant be all that bad.

why not run it for another 500 miles or so and change the oil again and see where you are at. if it is material from the main bearings or more likely cam bearings the damage is done anyway. be optimistic:)

Yeah thats what I will end up doing.

Right now I just need to get new spark plugs, oil, and filter. Then I will start putting the miles on it and see how it goes for the next 500.

let us know how you make out! good luck :thumbsup:

I would think that some particles in the oil are normal from a rebuild. I guess I will find out. When I did the initial oil change on my 350 after a month and about 200 miles, there was noticable metallic debris in the oil. I simply changed oil and filter and pressed on. I still have 60 psi at normal speeds, 40 at idle, with a standard oil pump, etc, and no other noises.

I chalked it up to the machine shop not using a hot tank, and me having to clean it with a pressure washer at home. I did everything I could to pressure wash the oil passages, bores, lifter bores, and then blew air through them and the crank oil holes.

Just pulled the motor I built in 2000 apart for an oil pan repair, and with 10-15 k on it, it had a lot more trash in the pan than I expected. Seemed like silicone from my intake and pan gasket sealing. Has great oil pressure and runs fine.

So I am going to press on and watch.

I would think that some particles in the oil are normal from a rebuild.

Yes it is normal. Just ensure that you put an adapter that does not have a bypass valve. This ensures you have filtered oil all of the time. Run the Wix 51061 to ensure to handle the pressure when it is cold.

The manufacturers put the bypass valve in due to, as our good friend Mike Lewis says, "some people don't have enough sense to come in out of the rain, much less change their oil". Us car guys pay way more attention to that detail than the average car driver.

So how exactly does this oil bypass work? I have never had to deal with it before.

The oil bypass works on differential pressure between oil pressure in the system and pressure through the filter. It will bypass the filter at warmup, as there is too much difference between filter pressure and system pressure. There is only like 6#'s of pressure if that on the spring used on the bypass valve.

Here is a pic of a standard adapter. Notice the hole near the main passage of the adapter, and the spring in it. That is where oil bypasses the filter , putting any trash you have in the bottom of the pan through your engine. NOT GOOD.
http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s86/wildman926/New%20Carbs/oiladapter.jpg


HERE (http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=PRM%2D1135&FROM=MG) is the adapter that I recommended earlier, notice no bypass valve. You have to run a filter that can handle the extra pressure, that is why I recommended the Wix 51061. It bolts in place where the standard oil filter adapter is located. You get filtered oil all of the time.
http://static.summitracing.com/global/images/prod/large/prm-1135_w.jpg

sucks to here the story buddy, but dont be so sad its a 350. Change the oil in the sucker, check the cam to see if anything went flat, pull the pan and remove each cap one at time, inspect and then reinstall to find what went away. If it aint knocking just run it till it goes and then build up a 454 to go right in. Trust me, you can assemble them for cheap

Yeah I would like to get a big block but I just dont know how much all the other parts will cost to install it. I doubt it would bolt right up with the small block mounts.

Ref the photo of the no bypass oil filter adapter....

IS THERE SUPPOSED TO BE A GASKET UNDER THE STOCK OIL FILTER ADAPTER???????

If so, oops. but I still have oil pressure!

i never found one under the stock setup :confused:

lol you would not lose oil pressure because it would just bypass the filter and run back in to the system ;)

Yeah I would like to get a big block but I just dont know how much all the other parts will cost to install it. I doubt it would bolt right up with the small block mounts.



bro, I remember when I used to think that a long time ago....But the big block really does just bolt right in. If your serious about getting one, pm me and I will tell you what you need to get. Serious though, real simple.

About the most involved part about it is that you will have to change your exhaust. Thanks to summit though you can do that for cheap. Stay tuned to the thread I started "30 day el camino" you will see what i'm talking about

After about 500 miles after my camshaft swap I decided it was time to change the oil, plugs, and readjust my valve lash. I take off my filter, and attack it. Open it up, and ran my finger over the filter that after some close observation looked like a gold mine. Long story short, my found metal in my filter after 500 miles of a cam swap. What should I do? I feel like my car has cancer... I can slow the process but it will eventually kill it since I dont think there is a cure once the grinding starts.
If you have every poured your old oil from the drain pan into another container out in the bright sun light what you would see could certainly scare the ***** out of you. The oil glimmers with metal flakes. This from my old Honda to my Ford truck to my Four Winns 5.8 L boat engine. Probably just wear in on a new engine...drive it!

Well at first I just want to get some money before I jump into the whole 454 thing but I will follow up on the camino thread.

I hope it's the new stuff still breaking in. Also I did cut up my timing cover to get it to fit. It's not leaking. But I am beginning to wonder if I got all the particles out after sawing off the little lips on the inside.

Well at first I just want to get some money before I jump into the whole 454 thing but I will follow up on the camino thread.

I hope it's the new stuff still breaking in. Also I did cut up my timing cover to get it to fit. It's not leaking. But I am beginning to wonder if I got all the particles out after sawing off the little lips on the inside.


if this is the first time your changing the oil after doing some internal work on the engine it is almost 'normal" to find a bunch of crap when you change the oil the first time. Hell when I took apart a 454 completely and then resealed it with new gaskets (after spraying and brake cleening the hell out of it) I was surprised to how much crap was in the oil pan a few 100 miles later. But I just cleaned all the crap out and changed the filter and the oil has come out looking great. To really get an idea of what kind of crap your getting out the motor you should use a paper filter that is used ofr straining paint before you put in the gun. They are cheap and you can get a ton for a few bucks. When I pull the drain plug on my cars I usually stick one into the stream and filter about a cups worth of oil to see whats in there.

if this is the first time your changing the oil after doing some internal work on the engine it is almost 'normal" to find a bunch of crap when you change the oil the first time. Hell when I took apart a 454 completely and then resealed it with new gaskets (after spraying and brake cleening the hell out of it) I was surprised to how much crap was in the oil pan a few 100 miles later. But I just cleaned all the crap out and changed the filter and the oil has come out looking great. To really get an idea of what kind of crap your getting out the motor you should use a paper filter that is used ofr straining paint before you put in the gun. They are cheap and you can get a ton for a few bucks. When I pull the drain plug on my cars I usually stick one into the stream and filter about a cups worth of oil to see whats in there.

Where can I get that paper stuff? I would like to try it out.

I changed my oil right after the 20 minute break in procedure. And am now changing it after 500 miles.

Where can I get that paper stuff? I would like to try it out.

I changed my oil right after the 20 minute break in procedure. And am now changing it after 500 miles.


any paint store or hardware store