Hello everyone. Have not been on here a while.
Lost my job two days after Labor Day. It is tough
trying to find an IT job here in central Florida.

Well on to my problem. Kind a long but I wanted to
list all the details that I can remember.

My car was running rough. I wanted to replace the
points and condenser. Replaced cap, rotor and wires last year.

Started the car to see what the dwell was set to.
It was set to 30.

Replaced points and condenser. Set gap to 19. Started car.
Dwell was at 47. Started to back it down to 30 and car died.
Backed it back up to 47 and car started. Started to back it
down to 30 again and car died and not been able to start it since,
no matter what I set the dwell to.
Car cranks fine but it is not firing.

I pulled the plug wire out of the coil and I see it sparking.
I pulled the coil wire out of the dist cap and I see it sparking
at each plug wire. The coil wires are fine. I tested them with an
ohmmeter.

I replaced the condenser three times. Still the same.
I replaced the points again. Still the same.
I replace the rotor and the car fired up for about three seconds
and then died. It just cranks.
I replaced the dist cap and rotor and car fired for about three seconds
and then died. It just cranks.

Any ideas what to try next or what the problem might be?

Thanks in advance

Here's my guess without seeing it. The wire from the junction of points/condenser to - post of coil is chaffed and shorting to distributor case or point mounting plate. Happens more than you would think. The plate moves with vacuum advance and rubs wire. You can test by disconnecting on both ends and run a wire from - on coil through the adjustment window to junction.

Steve,
If Dave's suggestion doesn't work, and if you haven't thrown the old points out, put them back in and see if you can still get 30 degrees. Could be the replacement points aren't made correctly. Also, if the replacement points are aftermarket, try a set of real Delco's. Nowadays, you just don't know about the quality of some replacement parts. If your car isn't a resto, might be time to look at an HEI swap.

Okay. I will try the wire test tomorrow. I was thinking about HEI. I will look at it when I go to the Turkey rod run in a couple of weeks.

I will let you know how it goes with the wire test.

Thanks. Keeping them coming.

Steve,
how do the plugs look? pull'em out, look at them, are they black and carbon fouled? fuel soaked? you may have fouled the plugs by dumping fuel into the cylinders without it starting.
might want to replace those just in case, that way you can rule that out along with the wires.
keep us posted

I changed the coil wire. Still the same just cranks.

I tried another set of points. Same thing.

I put in new AC Delco plugs. Same thing.

I have ran out of ideas.

Anyone else have any ideas?

Thanks for the help so far.

Steve,
I am going to assume that you rechecked that you have spark. Try to change the timing by rotating the distributor a little in either direction. Maybe the timing chain has jumped a tooth.

Do you have another coil you could try?

Just a thought, have you checked to see if its getting fuel?

Have you tried setting the points back with a feeler gauge, just incase the dwell meter is bad? I don't think a car would run with 47 degrees of dwell. Also, make sure you put your rotor back in (been there...done that graemlins/clonk.gif )

It is getting fuel. That is what I thought the problem was.

I have set the points several times. I will try it again.

The coil has strong sparks. I may change it out just to see what happens.

Thanks again. I will let you know what happens.

Steve,
does the car backfire or is there any sign of spark at the plugs? have you tried grounding out a wire at the plug end?

Did you try another Dwell Meter? :eek:

Does the car fire at all while cranking?
If so,how much?

The engine just turns over. It is not firing. The coil wire shows sparking.

Stupid question but is the distributor rotor turning? Maybe a couple teeth got sheered off on the distributor shaft?

Stranger things have been known to happen.....

The rotor is turning. I going to replace the points and coil and try it again.

I will keep you posted.

How old is the distributor. Sometimes when they're worn, the shaft will "wobble" around a little. Going along with what "Tino" said, some aftermarket points are somewhat weaker and don't stablize the shaft as well. Then again, like someone else said here, if it's not a 100% resto, do the HEI.

Like Gene said I don't think the motor would run at 47 deg. dwell. Does your dwell meter have different settings like 4, 6 & 8 cyclinders? Check to see if your using the right setting. Also as some one else asked does the distributor shaft wobble side to side? Also the timing chain thing, set timing mark to your initial timing setting some thing like 10deg btc and remove the the dist. cap, the rotor should be pointing to # 1 cyclinder.If it is not pointing to #1 then you have jumped the timing chain or your distributor has turned alot. Also while the cap is off and the key is turned off turn the motor over by hand, back & forth about a 1/4 rotation and see how much play there is in the timing chain by watching the rotor movment. Rotor should move with little or no delay to crankshaft movment. Dave

Thanks for the help. The car will not run. I replaced everything again. The car does fire for about three seconds and thats it. If I wait until the next day, it will fire again for about three seconds and no more.

Is this any clue as to what is going on?

I tried priming the carb first and still the same thing.

HUGE vacuum leak? Did you remove any hoses or fittings from the intake or carb?

Mine likes to be heavily choked with dry plugs when starting cold.What does the spark look like at the plug ends?weak?strong?Are plugs always wet?

Have you checked the weld on the very top of the dist shaft where the curve weights are? If the weld breaks it will throw your spark timing way out.

Steve..When it fires, does it start and run for the 3 seconds, or does it just have spark? If it runs, how does it sound? Normal or backfiring? If it runs OK, then you are loosing spark or fuel. Try a small amount of fuel in the carb after it stalls. Check the wire coming into the coil for voltage right after it stalls. If you have power to the coil and no spark at the plugs, the coil may be bad. If you can dump fuel in the carb and it will run, the float may be stuck or the pump may not be working. Did you take the fuel line off the carb and turn the engine over to see if it was pumping?

The car acts like it wants to start and it fires but will not run.

I used starter fluid in the carb. It did not fire at all.

I was thinking about going HEI but I hate to spend the money if that does not fix the problem.

I am going to try and play with it again today. I will also test the coil again. Their is an auto parts store here that can test the coil. I may take it to them.

Your coil has to be fine it's fireing.If you had dist. out timing might be off.If it's off just a bit there a pita to get going again.I know :D

Go back to basic's and start all over,find top dead center,no 1. piston comeing up,dist. at no. 1 plug,Have a bud turn dist. while you turn car over.

If the thing fires albeit briefly, the next day, it sounds like a fuel delivery problem. Letting the car sit overnight may let whatever gas is still in the carb drain down and that's what it runs on. Big motor means lotsa gas. If the pump is not delivering what it should...If the pump is okay, hop on the HEI bandwagon. Mark

Okay. I think I have tried everything. I going to install an HEI. It will arrive Thursday. I wanted to go with HEI anyway, this just moved up my timeline.

I hope this will fix the problem.

The HEI is in. Had to play with but the car started and stayed running.

Now I need to know is what should the timing be set at?

I have a 750 Holley with a manual choke. The question I have on this, is the choke on when the butter fly is straight up or in the down position?

When I close (down position) the butter fly the car dies.

Thanks again for all the help.

10 -12 inital,36-38 @3000 rpm,with vacume line pluged, choke on closed,should be open some when cold starting.

The choke is 'closed' when the butterfly covers the opening. When the choke is 'open' you can see down into the carb. On a completely COLD engine, the choke needs to be about 3/4 closed. In other words, about a 3/8" to 1/2" gap at the front. There is a screw to open the throttle while the choke is in this position (fast idle adjustment). Set the choke closed, open and close the throttle. This will allow the fast idle cam to rotate to the screw on the pass side. Turn the screw in till it idles at about 1500 RPM or so while cold. When you push the choke OFF/OPEN, the idle is controlled by the screw on on the driver's side. As for timing, about 8 or 10 degrees at idle, warm with the vacuum canister disconnected is a good starting point. The best way is using a dial back light, set the timing at about 34 degrees at 3000 RPM. Should do for a driver.

Congrats on getting it running. Would be interested in a post mortem on the old distributor - what was bad about it - excessive play etc.

The car is running great now.

I do not see anything wrong with the old dist. There is a some play in it but I do not think that was the problem.

Thanks for all the help you guys gave me.

I'm kind of late to the party here, but wanted to mention something.

When you adjust dwell, you change timing. With a drastic dwell change like you had from 47-30 it may have required a timing change.

Mike