malibu man, Reno 1, and mbu65ss, could you guys and anyone else with starter problems please check-in here with a brief post and we'll combine the starter discussion here from this point on?

This discussion has gone on for a while now in two different sections (Troubleshooting and Engine & Drivetrain). Let's combine them here and get everyone's attention focused in one spot. My reply is going to be a long one; you guys should know that much about me by now so get your details and observations ready.
In the meantime, I'm going to rig-up a nitrogen-cooled keyboard so we keep going until those starters are fixed!

Anybody ready for this?

Louie Hammel

As I stated in my first posting, I am new to this talk forum, and I am so pleased to know I`m not the only one with this problem.

I will make this as brief as possible.

I have a 72 Chevelle S.S. / 402 / auto. with a 400 turbo.

Upon reading the past postings, I am sure my problem is with the srarter brace NOT being re-installed after the overhaul, because that`s when the problem seemed to begin.

But here is my MAIN problem:

When the last starter drive and flywheel was installed just a few week`s ago, it done just fine until ABOUT the 6 or 8 try. Afterwhich the grinding noise returned and sounded like a high spot in the already new fywheel. The starter drive clearence was set with the "pin", and the (new)flywhell was machine checked for roundness before installation.

HERE is my question:
Since it was tried for only 6 or 8 times, IS it possible that the drive and flywheel is damaged once again?

I do NOT have a starter brace on it, but one WILL be installed before going any further.

Thank you for your input!
Steve Charles / Washington In. 47501

Well basically i've got all of the problems fixed besides my last problem. I can't get the starter aligned good with the flexplate.

I've got a CVR Mini Starter from Jeg's. I finally figured out the bolt problem, the wire problem, and the mounting problem. I still can't get the bendix gear to align with the flexplate. I'm using one of the inner holes and one of the outer holes on the gold adapter plate on the starter. Those are the only holes that I can use or else it won't bolt up to the casting.

First I tried two shims. That made the starter gear bind onto the flexplate gears. I had to then pry the starter gear off the flexplate to disengage it. Then I tried four shims. That made it so the starter gear hit the face of the flexplate while engaging, not even close to meshing with the gears on the flexplate. Then I tried one shim. That made it so the starter gear engaged on the the flexplate, but again couldn't disengage. I had to pry the gear off of the flexplate. So on my final try, I used no shims. Again, the starter gear got stuck on the flexplate. I had to pry the gear off with a scredriver.

There is no way that I can get the gear aligned good with the flexplate. I have the correct starter. I can't use any different holes on the gold adapter plate because of the lip on the transmission/flexplate shield.

Would a half a shim help? What else is their to do?

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

OK guys, I'm just checkin' back in with you. I'm going to get some measurements and look at a few different engine/starter combos tomorrow morning. I'll have the part no. for the Chevrolet starter brace and some other goodies.

see ya' tomorrow,

Louie Hammel

Thanks Louie!!

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

I have a new Delco high torque starter that I just put on. It doesn't grind when I turn the key, but it's kinda slow disenguaging once it catches. Would a shim help that? How do I know which shim to use? I got a staggered shim kit from AutoZone with 3 sizes. Do I just start with the smallest one?

Ditto to Chadh5

I have 2 mini starters that are also slow to disingage, Kinda get used to it after awhile but perhaps "just perhaps" a stronger bendix spring to drag it back out ?!?! What is your opinion Louie. Thanks

Jim

I'm going to have to separate this over a couple of nights. I'll try to cover the basic stuff as it should be without any problems and then see if any of this helps to fix or explain what's happening with your starter.

Beginning with the Chevrolet factory-style starter that is common to all of our cars from that era:

The starter motor is the larger part of the starter. The solenoid is the smaller part mounted on top of the motor.
The starter motor and drive bendix (or drive pinion gear mechanism) are a direct-drive system. The drive pinion turns at the same speed as the starter motor. The starter motor must generate enough torque to spin the engine assembly approximately 200 rpm. This is quite a bit of torque necessary when you consider all the forces working against the starter at 200 rpm and no combustion taking place to help.
The pinion drive (bendix drive) is designed to stay in the extended (engaged) position as long as the starter motor is producing more torque than the engine is. When the engine begins to start and the flexplate/flywheel speed and torque overcome the pinion speed and torque, the pinion drive retracts and disengages the flexplate/flywheel ring gear.
Ideally, the pinion drive gear and the crankshaft should be parallel to each other. In real life they are probably at some slight angle to one another. One angle will cause the drive pinion to be kicked back too easily and result in an engine that gets cranked a couple of times before the engine reaches sufficient rpm to start. The opposite angle results in that 'oh-so-familiar' Chevy 'wind-up' sound as the engine starts because the angle is delaying the pinion drive retraction and 'winds-up' the starter a few hundred rpm higher than the starter should be going before it lets go of it (the drive pinion). These angles are mostly just arbitrary, or, just a combination of tolerances that add up. Knowing what causes which allows you to correct it if it's causing problems.
A 'solenoid' (pronounced Sell-Uh-Noyd, not Soul-In-Oyd. I know that's picky but it always bugs me) is a remotely operated device. Could be a switch, a valve, a lever; anything operated from another location. The starter solenoid is an electrically operated switch AND lever. Two things in one device. First, a solenoid is an electro-mechanical lever. Applying voltage of the right amount and current and the coil of the solenoid becomes a magnet that pulls the solid metal slug in the center of the solenoid IN toward the end of the solenoid where the battery cable attaches. This pivots the drive pinion lever and kicks out the drive pinion (bendix drive). The second operation of the solenoid is to become a switch that only closes it's contacts IF the solenoid pole piece (that large metal slug) travels ALL THE WAY to the end of the solenoid cavity. When it gets there it closes the heavy copper contacts in the end of the solenoid (the plastic-looking part). These contacts directly connect the battery positive cable to the starter motor itself. On earlier point-ignition cars it also supplied a full-battery voltage to the ignition coil ONLY during engine cranking.
A solenoid heat shield is a thin metal shield that delays the process of heat transferring from the exhaust system into the solenoid assembly. It is mainly intended for heavy vehicle use (towing) in high heat prone areas. That's one of the reasons they aren't found on all V-8's. They don't completely solve the problem if the car is sitting still, not running, after a long haul or with just about any tubular header system.
A starter brace supports the end of the starter from excessive vibration fatigue failure and helps to retain the installed position of the starter. A starter brace DOES NOT align the starter. It only supports and locks the starter in the position that it was installed. Once installed correctly, the starter brace will greatly help reduce the starter motor housing's tendency to twist or rotate out of position while cranking. An engine can easily overcome the tension of the two bolts that are trying to hold the starter in place. If not all at once then possibly over numerous starts. (Reno 1?)
The starter motor conducts the same amount of current (2-300+ amps or more!) during cranking through the mounting surface of the engine block/starter housing as the positive cable does attached to the solenoid. There usually isn't any other ground path besides the starter brace (that everyone seems to be missing). A loose, greasy, and even a poorly shimmed starter can all have problems that act like a weak or bad battery cable.
The starter housings (pinion drive end) are usually aluminum now. There are cast-iron versions that are heavier and stronger. There are two different size motors used. The longer of the two is usually considered the 'heavy duty' version and is easily identified by the approximately 1" longer motor casing and the copper extension for the motor-to-solenoid connection.
The pinion drive housing, whether aluminum or cast-iron, was made for either 168 tooth ring gears or 153 tooth ring gears. A 168 tooth ring gear provides more ring gear torque than a 153 tooth version would from the same starter.

Well, that'll have to do for this evening. I'll try to finish gathering the part numbers and additional info I'm looking for. In the mean time, if anyone has anything to add (please) just fill in the blank space behind this post. My keyboard just ran out of nitrogen.

Louie Hammel

What is the correct way to test to make sure that enough voltage is present at the starter. Is there a way to test the starter when you have it removed from the car? I'd like to verify if mine is bad. If it is can anyone rec. a mini starter that they have had good luck with. My car came from Ariz. and I added headers-even though it hasn't been run much, I'm afraid that the heat may have done it in. Like I've said before, it cranked a few times and then nothing. Not even a click, just stopped in mid crank! Thanks
George

Thanks Louie

Good info, please keep it coming.

Jim

Damn Starter!!! Now I'm Really Pissed!!! I was shimming just the inner side, thought that might solve the problem. Started with two half shims. Meshed onto the flywheel. Tried 4 half shims. Meshed onto the flywheel. Tried 6 half shims. Looked about perfect, but meshed just a little. Pryed the gear off. Tried 8 half shims. Starter gear didn't touch the flywheel. But then I might have possibly found another problem, or the problem. The gear engaged fine, but the gear didn't spin when the key was held forward. It only rotated about an 1/8th of a turn only when the bendix engaged towards the flywheel. Isn't the gear supposed to spin? I was thinking to myself, "I wonder where they get the 4.4:1 gear reduction from?" LOL I laughed my ass off when I saw it spin an 1/8th of a turn. "Look at that gear reduction!!!" I was suprised. So, you could call that final shimming a bench test without a bench. LOL I had the battery charger on the battery on automatic overnight and today. After the bendix or starter gear engages, the solenoid makes a medium pitched noise. It's almost in between a buzz and a whine. Kinda like "errrrrrrrrrrrrrrr." Pretty close to the sound that a battery charger makes when it's under load, except louder. Is their a problem with the starter? Is it something I can fix or a starter/alternator/generator mechanic can fix? Or should I take it back?
Thanks

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

[This message has been edited by malibu man (edited 06-12-2002).]

Trever, I'm still here, you haven't lost me yet. I am a little confused after reading your last reply. Have you verified the condition of your battery and eliminated the possibility of a weak voltage supply to the starter? It sounds a lot like the solenoid is attempting to pull in the pole piece but there is not enough battery power to pull it in completely and certainly not enough to turn the starter motor itself. Remember, the solenoid won't close the contacts that supply battery voltage to the starter motor until the solenoid has been pulled completely in (pinion drive gear gets kicked out).
You can 'bench test' a starter with a good battery (not a battery charger) and a pair of jumper cables. Clamp the starter in a vise securely using the thick adapter block of your ministarter, attach the ground cable (black) to the adapter block and the other end to the negative battery post. Attach the positive cable to the normal connection you attach the battery cable to in your car and the other end to the positive battery post. If you momentarily connect a small jumper wire to the positive battery cable and the small 'start' terminal (that is most likely a spade terminal connection on your starter), the starter should kick out the pinion gear and spin the starter motor. As soon as you disconnect the small jumper, the pinion drive should return.
Try this, if possible, and get back to us.

Good luck,

Louie Hammel

Ok, I did as you suggested and bench tested the starter with a battery and jumper cables. The starter gear shot out very fast and turned about 1/10th of a turn while it was shooting out. But, after it shot out, it just sat there and buzzed or made that noise like I was saying earlier. When it makes that noise, I get sparks obviously since their is to much of a load building up on the starter, because there is no need for the electricity that is going to it. That's what it does. Any fixing to it? Or, should I use the warranty to my advantage and replace it?

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

That's good info Trever, here's the next test:

With the same set-up you just used to bench test the starter, leave everything as-is EXCEPT the positive cable of the jumper cables. With the positive cable connected to NOTHING, look at the side of the starter motor housing. There is a large gauge wire that is connected to the solenoid and it should have some insulation covering it. Your mini-starter from CVR is a Nippondenso starter just about the same as you'll find on most Toyotas. In some cases you can get small parts to fix them from a Toyota dealership but you'd have to be pretty savvy on both starters and Toyota parts or you'll chasing dead ends forever. The Toyota counter guy will most likely look at you like you are nuts if you don't already know the part numbers.
Anyway, detach the large gauge wire from the solenoid connection. Separate it from the solenoid and keep it away from grounding it against the starter housing while you do this test.
This same test can be performed on a factory Chevrolet type starter. The terminal you use on the Chevrolet starter is the solid copper lugs which stick out through a rubber grommet near the end of the motor housing. Take out the bolt (usually a 5/16" socket hex) that attaches these lugs to the solenoid. On the longer heavy duty starters there is a short (approx. 3/4") copper extension that looks like a little tube. Set this and the bolt aside.
In either case, make sure you have the starter securely clamped in a vise. This test tends to make them jump off the bench.
Momentarily touch the positive jumper cable to the heavy gauge wire or the copper lugs. Be careful to NOT ground the positive jumper cable to the housing of the starter motor.
This SHOULD make the starter motor ONLY spin. It won't make the solenoid kick out, it should just spin the sarter motor itself.
Trever (malibu man), if your motor spins, your solenoid is the problem. If the motor doesn't spin and just makes that humming noise, the motor is probably fried. Either way I think you may need to take advantadge of that warranty.

Good luck,

Louie Hammel

P.S. I haven't forgot about the brace and heat shield part numbers, just don't have them all yet.

The part number for the SB starter brace is 3816511 ( From 72 Assembly manual ).

------------------
Tino #28 Gold
72 Malibu 350-300,700R4
83 Grand Prix LJ 305

Ok, thanks!! Just got in from milking. I'll post back later this afternoon, but probably at night since I have to haul sileage wagons this afternoon.
Thanks!!!

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

Ok, I just tested it. The starter motor doesn't spin nor does the starter make that noise. It just sparks like it should when I touch the terminal with the positive jumper cable. I just sent in my registration card for that starter. Any clue to where I send an email to and send that starter back to, Jegs or CVR?
Thanks

Trever, I would suggest you call Jeg's first and ask them how they usually handle these kinda' things. CVR does have a website, it's www.cvrproducts.com (http://www.cvrproducts.com)

I'll trade you a couple of Southern California city days for a couple of Minnesota farm days?

Louie Hammel

No thanks on that offer. Why do you have to send in a registration cad to CVR?

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

i have what i was told when i bought is a 1993 crate 350 in my 72 chevelle when i had starter problems (grinding and not grabbing)i replaced the starter with a new starter for a 350, which did the same thing so i tryed another and it did the same thing, i tryed shimming one side to get it closer but it didnt get it close enough, im wondering if this could be a 327 or a 305 or if the flywheel just needs replacement, so i was wondering is there anny way to tell by looks the differince between a 305 a 327 and a 350, and i was also wondering if annyone knows if there is anny differince between starters for those 3, anny responce would be really helpfull, thanks

What I meant to say was, Why do you have to send in a registration card to CVR? Do I have to wait for that card to reach their place before I can get a warranty on that starter?

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

I sent in the starter for another one.

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

My starter is making some kind of chattering noise after the car fires and does it for about 3-4 seconds after the car is running. What could that be and how do I fix it?

------------------
my 67 droptop (http://www.mdesignstudio.com/chad/other/mychevelle2.jpg)

Possibility that the bolts are loose or the bendix doesn't disengage off of the flywheel right way. Check those and post back.

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

Bolts are tight. How do I check the bendix is disenguaging? I'm working by myself and I can't get under the car while I start it. This is a brand new starter (my second but that's another story). It's a Delco high torque model.

My other problem with this is with the stainless trans cooler lines that I bought from the Right Stuff. I can't get the dust cover completely off because they are too tight. Needless to say changing the starter is interesting with the dangling dust cover.

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my 67 droptop (http://www.mdesignstudio.com/chad/other/mychevelle2.jpg)

chadh5, do you have one of the mini-starter type starters from Chevrolet Performance Parts? If so, it may just be you are hearing the gear-reduction drive spinning down after disengagement which would be normal for a gear-reduction type starter. If a factory style starter makes a noise after the engine starts, it's usually a 'wind-up' sound in which the starter gets spun up with the engine rpm as it starts. This could be caused by a combination of alignment and shimming problems. Make sure you have the correct knurled shank starter bolts. The Chevrolet part number is 14097278. You need two.
Also, chadh5, your trans cooler lines are where they are because they are intended to be duplicates of the original factory routing. They are, and always have been, a pain to deal with because of their proximity to the starter and the converter cover. I usually bend my own so the starter and the cover can be removed without interfering with the cooler lines but I have the right tools to double flare the tubing and I have enough experience so that I only have to ruin three sets of tubing before I get it right (only half-joking here, it's an acquired art).

doc1972, any of those engines you mentioned can share the same starter. Whichever you have, the starter/flywheel combination must match. A large diameter flywheel/flexplate (you said 'flywheel' which is usually the term for a 'manual transmission flywheel'; an automatic trans uses a 'flexplate') will have 168 teeth and has to have a starter made for it. The other size is 153 teeth and the starter for this will only fit this one. The exception to this would be a mini-starter made by various companies as well as Chevrolet Performance Parts; these have bolt patterns for both applications. If you can get to it, measure the diameter of your flywheel/flexplate. We'll go from there.

Good luck guys, (kinda' have to assume you are guys)

Louie Hammel

No, its not the mini, its full size. I had to buy longer bolts because the Delco case was about .5" taller than the Napa one I had. So went to the hardware and got two bolts. So maybe that's it then? I can got to the chevy dealer and get them? Would Napa have them?

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my 67 droptop (http://www.mdesignstudio.com/chad/other/mychevelle2.jpg)

i had starter problems on a 70 camaro 350 once,tried shims no-go no shims no-go had the starter pad shaved still no-go.took it to tranny shop and found the block was missing an alignment dowel http://www.chevelles.com/forum/confused.gif well that fixed it,but if that is not the problem have a machine shop cut a little off the mounting pad of the starter,you can always put shims back in to take up what they cut off.if removing shims helps but with no shims it is still not quite right this may fix the problem.hope this helps.JIMK

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LouieHammel:
Your trans cooler lines are where they are because they are intended to be duplicates of the original factory routing. They are, and always have been, a pain to deal with because of their proximity to the starter and the converter cover. I usually bend my own so the starter and the cover can be removed without interfering with the cooler lines but I have the right tools to double flare the tubing and I have enough experience so that I only have to ruin three sets of tubing before I get it right (only half-joking here, it's an acquired art).
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Is their a possibility that a person could use flexible stainless steel lines in place of the original aluminum? I've never checked to see where the lines end up, whether they end up bolting into a hole or actually going inside the cooler, but you could always cut off the aluminum line at a point and splice on some flexible. I'd like to turn all of my aluminum lines into flexible. I just like the look and the ease of flexing or bending the lines.

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LouieHammel:
chadh5, If a factory style starter makes a noise after the engine starts, it's usually a 'wind-up' sound in which the starter gets spun up with the engine rpm as it starts. This could be caused by a combination of alignment and shimming problems. Make sure you have the correct knurled shank starter bolts. The Chevrolet part number is 14097278. You need two.


Louie Hammel<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's more erratic than a winding down sound. Defineately a chattering kind of sound. I called my chevy dealer and he can order that bolt but it's going to cost me $30 because they only sell them in sets of 5 (which not only sucks, but last I checked starters had 2 bolts. WTF?) Guess I'll try Napa next.


------------------
my 67 droptop (http://www.mdesignstudio.com/chad/other/mychevelle2.jpg)

Ok, Napa says they have them and that there are only 2, a long and a short version. Apparently I need the long which is why I bought the ones at Ace in the first place. They are $4 each.

------------------
my 67 droptop (http://www.mdesignstudio.com/chad/other/mychevelle2.jpg)

chadh5, Many times I have stepped on these very same bolts lying on the ground in those 'Pick-A-Part' salvage yards that resemble a nuclear wasteland. It seems that the 'core vultures' who wait in the parking lot until a batch of new corpses are fork-lifted into the yard are only concerned with getting the starters and just leave the bolts where they hit the ground. Just take a small ruler with you to make sure you get the right length.

malibu man (Trever), you can easily replace the steel (or stainless) trans cooler lines with the braided stainless flexible type, just beware that not all of them are the same even though they look alike. Some of the cheaper imitation hoses will not be compatible with 250+ degree ATF and could possibly swell and leak or restrict flow. It's very difficult to tell if the inner rubber (or teflon) liner is damaged from too much heat where it may have been too close to a header or exhaust pipe. Expensive race cars have lost expensive races for this very same simple cause.

Louie Hammel

The brand that I would use would be Aeroquip. That's what i'm currently using for my fuel line. Would that work. Where are the fittings on the transmission end of the line. Never followed them back before. I've also got a mysterious line that comes up from the back, follows the front to rear brake line on the driver side, and then goes up behind the A-Arm where the frame is. It used to be connected to a hose that went to a black emission canister. What is it and can I get rid of it?
Thanks

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

Trever, check out this tech info from Aeroquip:
www.aeroquip.com/pages/techinfo.html (http://www.aeroquip.com/pages/techinfo.html)

Good luck,

Louie Hammel

Yep, i'm using the Stainless Steel Braided Racing Hose(FBA) for my fuel line. Looks like I can use that for the cooler lines. Where are the fittings located at on the cooler? Never followed the lines. That would be nice to use that line for every line on the car but that would get spendy.

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

Trever, those lines go from the passenger side of the transmission to the passenger side of the radiator.

Louie Hammel

Alright, thanks!

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

I'm Back!!
The starter came today from Jeg's. Installed it with no shims. To close to the flywheel. Installed it with two half shims on the driver side of the adapter block. Worked great. Tried starting it. Starter cranked over good but didn't start. Looked at the fuel filter and there is no gas going through. Since the car sat there for 2+ weeks, the fuel pump needed priming. Pooring gas down the carb didn't work. Had to get out the air compressor and blow a little air into the tank. Started her up. She runs!!! And She Starts!!! Wow am I happy!! Except for the timing seems funky because the indentation/slash in the damper is about 4 inches past the tab towards the passenger side. I think that I need a balancer cover.

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

Hey Trever, good work. Keep an eye on the starter mounting bolts. Using shims on only one side of the starter (one bolt) makes it a little easier for the bolts to work loose after a few starts. Since you have a non-factory style starter you should probably fabricate a brace that works like the original one. That will ensure that your new starter stays aligned and working for a long time.

Good luck with the rest of your car,

Louie Hammel

Thanks Louie!! Thanks to everyone for the support and info!! Couldn't have made it through without you. My next problem is going to be the timing. You'll probably see me post a new thread on this Forum on how to get my timing perfect. I know what to set it at, just don't really know how to set the advance and how to change the weights and springs. Just got to wait for my piston stop to come in.
Thanks

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

All right Trever!

It's great to see things go well. One suggestion for your distributor curve adventures you are now chasing. See if you can find a local shop who owns a distributor machine. They are great at getting the exact curve you request and do so without wear and tear on your motor (like revving the snot out of it with no load to check total advance).
I'm a little spoiled because I have a Sun distributor machine in my garage. Let's me play around with different stuff 'til I find the best curve for my combination. Saved a few of my friends a lot of headaches too.
Might be worth your time to find a local shop that has one (and knows how to use it).

Good luck,

Louie Hammel

What type of shop should I go and look for one of those machines? Like a dealer, repair service shop, auto parts retailer,???
Thanks,
Trever

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Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

Trever, there are quite a few shops that can perform this service. You might be able to find one near you or send the distributor to someone. Here's an example of a shop that you can access via the internet at www.kendrick-auto.com (http://www.kendrick-auto.com)

Good luck,

Louie Hammel

Ok. I've got a recurving kit but like I said I don't know what springs and weights to use and don't really want to put the wear on my engine.

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

Update: I got some correct starter bolts and so far, the problems seems to be fixed.

Thanks everybody!

------------------
my 67 droptop (http://www.mdesignstudio.com/chad/other/mychevelle2.jpg)

Glad you got your problem solved Chad!!

------------------
Trever Maas
1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO
Undergoing Resotoration

Back to the old starter problems again. Just got this 383 in and running. Now with the new 400 flywheel, I can't use the same mounting configuration that I did with the 350 flywheel. The only way that I can seem to get it mounted up is with it rubbing on the headers. It works but the starter is going to eventually overheat. I was told to try bending the headers. What would you do?
Thanks,
Trever

------------------
Trever Maas
TC Member #: 1432

1972 Chevelle Malibu
Mohave Gold
L65 350/M38 TH350
2.73 AXL RATIO

1948 Chrysler Windsor
Flathead 6/Semi-Auto
4 Speed Column Shift
Fluid Drive Transmission

"Both Undergoing Slow Restorations"

I too have had starter problems with my Chevelle. At first i belived it was just heat soak, a common problem for BB Chevelles. It all started five months ago when i purchased the car. It had just got a new started 5 Months previous to that. After about a month, my car was grinding and all that good stuff, mainly when hot. One rainy day my started decided to give up on me and die. Well we pushed the car into the garage and bought a rebuilt started from pep boys. Now 2 months later it is doing the same thing. I have a heat blanket for it but did not put it on at the time. Could it be the Shims? Or the front mounting bracket? I am probably going to buy another started and install that with the heat blanket and hope all works after that.

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1972 Chevelle 454
Chevelle Pictures (http://community.webshots.com/album/55203245YfTpQz)
Engine Pictures (http://community.webshots.com/album/58398749FWYFLE)

I think my two biggest problems were using the wrong brand of starter and not messing around with shims. Now my car starts good, but still has engine problems after I rebuilt it.

1) The valve lash isn't right and I can't seem to get it set.(Ticking sound coming from engine and out of exhaust.)
2) The engine keeps running after the key's off.(Timing must be too advanced or something.)
3) I've got a major oil leak coming from the rear of the engine.(Pretty sure it's oil but I can't track it with the distributor in the way.)
4) Engines too powerful for rest of drivetrain.(Stock transmission and input shaft, 2.73 rear, bald 205/70/14 Snow Tires.)
5) Engines not broke in yet. :( (Does someone want to do that for me?) graemlins/boring.gif

Malibu Man.....Do you turn your car off immediately after driving, if so that could be your problem as to why your engine keeps running. Try letting it sit for 10-15 seconds after you stop and see how that works.

UPDATE on my starter problems:
Well i now need a new flexpalte. I think i am going to go with B&M. Also while ther transmission is out i figure i should get a high stall torque converter. Also i am going to get a powermaster high torque starter. Any suggestions on these products.

I have just installed a B&M Flexplate and a powermaster high torque starter. The starter is wrapped in a DEI heat shield. One shim was used on the starter. The car starts great now.

Glad you got your problem fixed! I just went with a plain-jane flexplate. I don't even know if it is SFI approved.

I do turn my car immediately off. The valve lash needed to be set, two rockers set too tight and one too loose. My biggest problems are I have too high of compression for what octane of gas I can use, i've got a 600 cfm carb when I should have a 750 cfm or bigger, I can't lock my timing in where I need it at. It's always too advanced. And I have a cheap 2" exhaust system with glasspacks on and the glaspacks keep falling off.

Hello guys,

I'm glad to see you all getting your starter problems fixed. I do have one more suggestion. Whenever you need a fairly generic part like a flexplate (that would fit many years of Chevy's) take a look at the ads in Circle Track magazine. The racers are always tearing up these kind of parts for which the high sales numbers make the parts cheaper. I have had very good experience wih the people at Capital Motorsports Warehouse.

Trever, did you say snow? I can see lots of it from my front yard on top of an 11,500 ft mountain but I haven't been hit by a snowflake in... geeze I can't even remember.
Nice to hear your making progress bud, keep workin' on it, you'll get there.

Louie

Louie,
All of the snow is gone here. We've hit highs of 65 lately and it's already 60 right now. I feel sorry for my car. Nothing just ends up working right. I would treat her to a body-off right now but were limited for space. My dads got an old 34? Dodge truck in their with the chassis-off the cab. I was planning on pulling that out but he doesn't want to spend the money on it right now. Might just have to take the engine out for starters and put it on a stand. Wonder if the stand can support all of the power? LOL Then maybe I can start on the body work and get that done, then hopefully take the body-off and do a little detail work and chassis work. I've been thinking about doing an Art Morrison 4 Link Back Half on my car, but maybe I should just keep it as stock as I can. Pretty soon there won't be anymore stock Malibu's around. And i've been looking for a stock L65 engine for my 72. We'll have to see what happens!

I need help! Please check this out:

When I fully connect the starter and tighten it up all the way, I turn the key and all that happens is just a click sound. Like the solenoid is clicks once and that's all. So just to mess around, I loosen the both the bolts on the starter and then the starter actually extends but is grinding on the flywheel so it's not catching it. Still messing around, I tighten it just a little more and it seems like it is getting closer to catching it; however, it is still grinding. So I tighten it a little more, and then it's back to the solenoid clicking and that's it. So if I loosen it too much, it's not even tight enough to catch it. Tightening it, it grinds and grinds. Fully tightened, it clicks. What would be the problem? Because I don't know why it would extend to try and catch the flywheel when it is loosened but not when it is tightened fully? Can you give a reason why you might think that?

Are you sure this is the correct starter? Has it worked before on this engine?