For my next motor, I am still contemplating a solid roller setup, but the worries of streetability have me concerned. Has technology changed that much where I don't need massive spring pressures? What is the best street roller lifter on the market today?

crower severe duty with hippo option or isky redline

Isky Red Zones!!
Crower with the hi pressure pin oiling option
I will not build a roller engiene with any thing else.
I prefer the Isky's because they are rebuildable.

Check this post: Comp Roller (http://www.chevelles.com/forum/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=019439)

For springs, on a billet & I don't run anything else, I feel the worst thing you can do to a roller is not running enough spring.
I like a minimum of 200/500 preferably 225/550 & more if you are going to rpm it to the moon :D

e mail me for info.

graemlins/thumbsup.gif For the Isky Red Zones! Good Stuff!!

Thanks guys
Now, what is the difference, need or benefit between lifters with horizontal bar vs vertical bar?

TTT...inquiring minds want to know smile.gif

Well I'm not positive but I think it was Crane who started the concept of the Spring Loaded Horizontal Bar Roller Tappets.This idea was simply to use the springs to force the lifters up off the lobes once the pushrods have been removed.... Assuming you did not use a rev kit ... then the camshaft could be removed or replaced without removing the intake manifold.Good for quick between rounds cam changes.The concept does work but is really most usefull in serious race applications only.

The fact that both styles have been used successfully for many decades pretty much proves that either type will work quite well.They work about a bazillion times better than the previous style non linked Roller Tappets.I think it was Isky that first patened the linked type back in the late 1950's....I " Think " with thier " Fork and Blade " style links.

What would make you happy ET wise?
The right hyd roller can make alot of power. Don`t overlook that fact,a dual purpose car is a good candidate for one.
Set the valves and never take the valve covers off again smile.gif

Jim,
For a street car, that does alot of driving, i dont think its a good idea to use a mechanical roller.
How much driving do you actually do with the car? Just to and from the track, and car shows, correct?

Consider a swap to a comparable Solid Flat Tappet on a tighter LSA.

There are more ways then one to start moving on to 11 second ET's.

IMHO, if you pick the right camshaft and the right lifter, you will have thousands of street miles with no problems.

Choose a cam profile that has "true" street roller designed lobes. Some of the new so-called street rollers (i.e. XE line) have more aggressive lobes than many race profiles. Keep the agressiveness down and parts will live alot longer. You might give up a little horsepower, but I doubt that you would notice much (if any) power difference. Also don't get carried away with huge lift numbers. Keep the lift (on a BBC) under .650" and the springs will last quite awhile on the street.

Lastly choice a good lifter. Probably the best lifters on the is the Isky "Red Zone" or the Crower "Severe Duty". Very beefy design with a HIPPO oiling option that is "critical" for any street driving.

I have heard people of people running 50K+ street miles on mechanical street rollers and not having to rebuild lifters or replace springs.

Pick the right parts, check lash periodicly and inspect the lifters every 5K miles or so and you should be fine. graemlins/thumbsup.gif

I have thought about a hydraulic roller, but folks tell me it is a waste of time/money. They say if you are going to go roller, skip the hydraulic roller and go straight to solid roller. I have no experience with either type, so I will continue to ask questions and see what is out there.
Brian, yes my driving consists of to/from track, car shows and an occasional trip to the ice cream stand/mini golf place with the wife and kids. Some errands around town as well.
Thanks for the info.

Is the price comparable between the Isky and Crower roller lifters?? I see a roller in my future :D

I am doing a cam swap from a hyd. roller to a more street oriented solid roller. On the phone the guy said the isky red zones are the best, he said the crowers are a good second.
That being said-- I wouldn't rule out a hydraulic roller either. They are easy and reliable, and can make very good power. I think some of the hydraulic rollers I was looking at before I went to solid (more on that in a second) like, 242/248 @ .050 type numbers, would be good for a dual purpose street car. I think unless your gonna see higher rpms or want max perf, the hyd should be fine.. but..
I was pretty happy with the hydraulic roller. I had one picked out and all, until I started calling around for shops to do the cam swap. The shop I ended up picking, and don't quote the shop on this because I'm about to butcher their words, made a pretty clear case for solids in a high performance application. What it basically came down to was a discussion about valve train harmonics, valve float, so on and so forth, which starts to kick in around 5200(ish), depending on springs will be clear by 6100(ish). He said its not a physical matter of the engine not continuing to rev, it will, to a point, but its not doing the best job it can. My engine physically stopped revving at 6350, and dropped off about 110 ft-lbs and like 80 hp from 6100 to 6200. I didn't have very heavy springs on it though, they were pretty mild. I don't know what my 1st hyd roller had in it for springs or if that was the matter, but it made more power than this one, but fell flat on its face on the dyno at like 5700rpm. Probably a good place for a hyd roller to kick the bucket...
I guess what he was saying, and there was more to it than this, that your not going to get max performance from 5500 up with a hydraulic roller w/o some tricky spring work and stuff. but then, I'd assume (and this is me talking) that with more pressure on the lifter and cam that wasn't designed for it, I'd assume more problems.
he said they work great in high performance boats that see like 4500-5000rpm all day, but low 5000rpm max..

I don't know if that helped you at all, but after seeing first-hand on the baseline dyno session for my engine, that my hydraulic roller setup was starting to get lazy at like 5300 and was flat out dead by 6200. I probably spend 1/10th of 1% of my engine time at 5500 plus, but I only drive the car a couple thosand miles a year, so street manners and stuff matter alot less than me. I also have the least efficent, in $ per hp per mile driven car that I have met in actual life. it makes me want to roll thing thing into a lake sometimes. If I actually drove the car aside from just when I felt like it, I'd go hyd roller. I know I'll catch flak for this, but IMHO, a hyd roller is on par power wise with a solid flat, less headache, not as cheap, not as much rpm probably, but fun none the less.
Now-- I haven't dealt with the solid yet.. and its a big solid-- so I can't say that I've made the right choice yet. I __think__ that a properly sized, excellent lifter, with the correct springs should work fine. the cam swap shop said the thing that gets them the most is very high revving 302 ford (5.0 stangs) that insist on using hyd rollers because of what a PITA it is to even take off the valve cover on an EFI one of those, but according to him are kicking themselves in the butt power wise. its all about what you want to do I guess. but no, I wouldn't rule out a hyd roller. I don't see them adjusting the valves on any new factory high performance engines...


we'll see.. hth..
matt

Just curious if anyone out there runs Schnieder roller lifter?

40Coupe tells me that the same company that makes Schneider makes the Crower severe duty roller lifters.

My buddy's 509 has around 22K on it. Mild Crane SR, no problems at all. He used the Crane lifters, springs are mild too 180/440 if I'm not mistaken.

HOWEVER, the Lunati flat tappet seems to make more power since my 440c.i. out mph-d his 510c.i. Camaro. Even with a roll bar he has to have 2-300 lbs on me by his reckoning.

So not all SRs are created equal.

Jim, I always thought that the same 276/284 setup on a roller would be awesome for a 427. (Actually, if I was going "full race" and using a 107-108 LSA, I'd probably like a schooch more duration since my shift points are up there and the 107 would likely cut out too soon. Even the 110 is starting to give it up at 6800. But for a milder 6500 shifting car, perfect.) Not that what I would do if it were me is all that relevant!

Likely gain 1/4 sec in the 1/4mi and around 50 hp above 5000 is what I've been told. For me the 1/4 sec is irrelevant as I can't cage it, but if I didn't like long 'highway star' crusies, I'd have gone SR. Even with my UD solid flat tappet, I don't let it idle low for long.

What cam you have in there now?? I thought you stuffed a new one just a few years ago when you swapped heads?

I have a U/D hyd roller 233@.050 .625 lift on a 109 sep.
Seat pressure is about 140#`s or so, open is around 340#`s.
I shift about 5600 rpm(1-2)and 6-6200 rpm (2-3) have shifted 6500 rpm on occasion.
No problems.

A 427 type motor is rev happy and i`m not sure I would put a hyd roller in one personally.
Having owned a few 427`s in various configurations there`s nothing like a big block reving 7000-8000 rpm smile.gif .
The rev`abilty is part of the fun. Can you imagine putting a hyd cam in a DZ 302 :( :rolleyes: ?! No way.

I`ve always said that a hyd roller will perform very well provided you keep the rpms at 6500 rpm or lower IMHO.

Jim,
for the amount of street driving you do, i'd suggest a solid flat tappet.
I know you're ride to and from the track is a bit lengthy, and until the car becomes a car thats is driving to and from the track on a trailer, and sees only limited street driving (occasional cruise and maybe car show) i'd stick with the simplicity of a solid F/T.

I've asked plenty of questions on making Solid rollers live, and In my opinion they're too big of a maintinence item to see alot of street duty.

However if you do decide to go with a roller, consult our friend on how to make them live.