I just had another thought for a cam/head setup and was wondering if any of you guys are using a Performer RPM cam with Performer RPM heads?

How do you guys think this setup would work?.....


Edel. 600cfm electric choke carb (already have)
Edel. Performer Intake (already have)
Edel. Performer RPM heads (already have)
Edel. Performer RPM camshaft.....???
327 .040 or .060 over (currently being bored)
10:1 comp
balanced & line bored
Forged pistons
stock rods
steel crank

I realize I would be better off with a Performer RPM intake, but I dont have the money for one now; however, i will be getting one asap.

Are any of you guys using a performer rpm cam? How do you like it?

I'd like to say thanks in advance......my engine is just about figured out, and this should be the last step. graemlins/thumbsup.gif

I have never run one, although I ran a Crane that looks similar. You can find a much more potent camshaft them the RPM, IMHO. Your 10:1 gives you a few options, how about stall and rear axle ratio?

Currently it has a TH350 with a 2k stall w/ b&m shift kit, and an open 10bolt 3.08 rear end. I'm going to be changing that asap to a higher stall, or possibably a 4 speed, and either a ford 9" or a GM 12 bolt with some 3.90's or 4.10's. What would you recommend for a cam similiar to that and for $180 or less?? Preferably hydraulic.

that performer cam is huge! the advertised duration is 308/318! thats bigger than the 305h magnum in my 11:1 427. in my honest opinion you will not like that combo, with an engine with small cubes/short stroke and huge cam you will need lots of compression and gear. which limits streetability, i know from experience trust me.

why not follow the advice given to you in your previous posts?

cam recmmendation (http://www.chevelles.com/forum/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=018404#000000)

UDharold cam question (http://www.chevelles.com/forum/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=018619#000000)

Originally posted by pegleg71:
What would you recommend for a cam similiar to that and for $180 or less?? Preferably hydraulic. crane energizer cam and lifter kits are selling for $99.95 at summit.

i run an energizer cam in my biscayne, i drove it every day for a few years and was always happy with its performance.

Understood ratonastick.....but the advertised duration is actually 234/244 with a .488/5.10 lift. I don't know if you were looking at one for a BB possibably? The reason I was thinking about going with this cam as opposed to the cams that were recommended is that it has a larger power range, from 1,000-6,500 (as opposed to 2,000-5,500), than the others. Also for the time being it would help me reduce the amount that I burn out off the line, and give me the higher RPM range that I want for now and for when I get the different rear end and gears.

Just my .02.....maybe i'm wrong? I just figure a balanced 327 will be able to put out some serious RPM's and the gearing I plan on going with later will require an engine that is capable of higher RPM's, so I figure I might as well build up and engine capable. no? :confused:

I do appreciate all the advice and responses. graemlins/thumbsup.gif

pegleg

234/244 is the duration at .050 lift.

i wouldnt get all hung up on the cam description either. thats just a generic description and will be different from combo to combo.

just follow the advice given to you in your previous posts and you will be a happy camper!

A quote from Brandon's search ( good work, I knew I talked on this before)....

"If I go with a crane energizer cam i'm going to take wolfplaces advice and use the 272H10."

So just go out and get one. Plus, there pricing them with FREE lifters right now according to Crane's website.

Snooze you lose here kid. You want Rs you better start thinking solid lifter cam, but for now that little Energizer will work with your stock stall and gear fine. For $100 all in, dont fart around. IMHO

never seen anything that ran as good with that RPM cam than it would with a Lunati or Crane, or Comp Cam. they seem more like a nitrous grind to me. i wouldn't run one in a 327 for sure. you need an XE 262 maybe an XE 268 or something similar like what was mentioned before. if you're stuck on Edelbrock, then i think the Performer Plus cam kit would work better with what you have as far as the rest of the set up.

Yeah, you guys are probably right. I keep hearing this, and I know you guys know what you're talking about. It's just hard to figure out what the best cam would be for the application/purpose. One min someone says "go with the crane so and so" and then on another post I hear that it's bad. :mad: I guess if you guys are having good luck with the cams though then i'll just use one of those. graemlins/thumbsup.gif

I took a look at the crane energizer cams and they don't really seem to have much of a power range. The edelbrock performer RPM cam has a broader range going from 1,500 - 6,500. Ie. crane 3,500-6,500 246/246 .500/.500 What's the deal with that?

All these crane energizer cams also have the same duration for intake and exhaust. If i'm going to run nitrous I should be running a cam with a longer exhaust duration right? At least thats what i've always been told.

Just seems to me like the performer RPM SHOULD be a good cam....but I do hear bad things about it. Can anyone clarify this for me?????? :confused:


lol also.....i have no idea what cams you guys are referring to when you say... 272H10, or XE268 That's just the model number or whatever right? I just don't see where they list those or anything. sorry :D I'm just trying to make sense of it all.
thanks again guys

pegleg

there is nothing wrong with a crane energizer. sure they may not be the most aggressive grind in the world. but one thing they have going for them is longevity.

if you want something that is relatively inexpensive, performs well and will last. i think the Crane Energizer fits the bill nicely.

Originally posted by pegleg71:
lol also.....i have no idea what cams you guys are referring to when you say... 272H10, or XE268 That's just the model number or whatever right? I just don't see where they list those or anything. sorry :D I'm just trying to make sense of it all.
thanks again guys 272H10 means, 272 degrees advertised duration, hydraulic cam on a 110 lobe separation (lsa)

i noticed summit only likes to publish the @.050 duration numbers. dont get .050 and advertised duration confused they are two different numbers. you need to look at the technical specs of the cam in summits description, or go to the cam manufactures website and get the numbers.

unless you are pretty experienced with cam specs, you really need to concentrate on the advertised duration only.

im sure that someone can explain this better than i can, but it gives you an idea.

Crane Energizer PT# 100052
Grind 272H10
http://www.cranecams.com/?show=browseParts&lvl=2&prt=5&Vehicle_Type=Auto&Cylinders=8&Engine_Make=CHEVROLET&Year=1969&Engine_Size=262-400%20C.I.&partNumber=100052&partType=camshaft

272 216 454 110

Basic RPM range 2000-5000

Summit cam and lifter Set PT# CRN-100052
http://store.summitracing.com/

Thanks for the information guys. I think i'll be able to eliminate a couple now.

Thanks for the links thrasher.

Oh, i'm just wondering.....
at what point (what lift and duration) does a cam usually produce a decent lope (generally speaking for a SB)? :confused:

Just curious.....I don't plan on making a cam decision off of it or anything. :cool:

Originally posted by pegleg71:
Oh, i'm just wondering.....
at what point (what lift and duration) does a cam usually produce a decent lope (generally speaking for a SB)?this is pretty hard for me to explain but ill give it a shot.

that lopey sound is a product of valve overlap. cams with lots of advertised duration and tight lobe separation angles(lsa) have lots of overlap. valve overlap is the time that both valves are open during the end of the exhaust stroke and the beginning of the intake stroke.

you could have two cams with identical duration, a cam with 108 lsa will have more lope than the same cam with a 112 lsa. why? because the tighter lsa (108) has more overlap.

lets say you had 2 cams with the same lobe separation, lets say 110 lsa. one cam has 272* advertised duration and one has 305* advertised duration. the cam with more duration has more overlap and will have more lope.

in your case though it will be tough since you plan to use nitrous. nitrous likes wide cams with wide lsa like a 112 lsa or 114. basically when you use cams that have lots of overlap the extra cylinder pressure from the nitrous just blows past the valves. not to say that the nitrous wont make the car run better, but you will see more gains from the nitrous with a cam with less overlap.

Right, the wider lobe separation cams tend to close the intake down later in the upstroke, so some of the intake charge gets pushed out while the valve is hung open and the piston begins to rise. Tigher separation cams tend to shut the intake down early in the stroke, trapping more pressure.

In a 327, that 272H10 will have a nice lope, and it shouldnt mind a small shot of NO. You get into the big shots, and then you do really need to pick a cam specifially for it.

Crane has a nice small-ish solid cam on a wide 114 lsa which should work well with NO. But, I think it'll be too big for you normally.

Ok...makes sense. I never knew how lsa affected lope. I'm actually learning a lot here. graemlins/thumbsup.gif Well I think I have it narrowed down to two cams.... :D

1.) CRN-100052 $120
2.) LUN-00017LK $140

UDHARDOLD recommended both of these cams......after I asked the same question about a million times. lol *sorry*

Which one would you guys recommend? Just curious, which would have more lope? (the crane?)

One last question....
Do you guys think I would have to change any parts of the head setup to use either of those cams? $$$ is unfortunately an issue right now. :(

Performer RPM heads

in my opinion the crane crn-100052 would be a better choice than the lunati 00017. that lunati cam is 290 degress advertised duration compared to the cranes 272 degrees advertised.

if you are wanting to step up to a more agressive grind than the crane i would suggest something like the 301A8LUN lunati hydraulic. if im not mistaken this is actually one of harolds grinds.

301A8LUN specs:

276/286 advertised
221/230 duration at .050
.454/.454 lift
112 lobe seperation

"Big street cam for 350s, popular in 383-406. Lopey idle, will work power brakes. Power 1000 to 5800".

i think this cam is a perfect match for your planned combo and would respond very well with the nitrous. it may not be perfect for all of you current parts, but you said you were going to upgrade the stall, gears etc... i also think with your heads a good dual exhaust and headers you should have no problem pulling to 6000-6500 rpm.

assuming your static compression is 10:1, i calculate your dynamic compression ratio(dcr) to be right at or around 8:1 which is perfect!!!!

please dont fall in the bigger is better catagory, many people have chosen this path and havent been pleased with the results.

as far as the heads/valve springs you would be better off posting a specific question in this forum about that. im sure UDHarold or the guys would be happy to answer your question.

That Crane Energizer is only $99. right now.
It doesn't state that online,but if you call them you will find out.

you asked if anyone has used the rpm cam shaft..........well i think i used what i would consider the same cam............edelbrock advertises there rpm cam as .488/.510 lift and with 234/244 @ .050 so i bought the cam that was the same from P.A.W. part number 10314 advertise duration 300 and 310 duration @ .050 is 234/244 with 488/510 lift.

this is an awesome cam in the 350. with a 750 edelbrock carb.edelbrock rpm dual plane intake, 10.2 to 1 compression with the cheap 100 dollar dome pistons,stock bottom end, and some 882 heads that have 1.94 /1.50 valves with 3 angle valve job.with 20 dollar z28 springs.

combined with 3000 stall and 3.73 posi in a 81 z28......this car goes now. it can light up the 275/60-15 tires at anytime in town. and i dont mean some just barely turning the tires i mean WHAM it smokes them hard anything below 45 miles an hour.

this car has a very nice lobe to it it sounds tough and it response fast in the rpms.it has no problems running to 6500 rpms thru a stock hei unit off a 80 vette.

with out any tunning at the strip...the first outing provided a best 13.32 @ 103.44 mph with a 2.00 60 ft time. with the same street tires and thru the same exhaust as driven daily.some of the first passes was just trying to get the car to hook which resulted in some 13.5 and 13.6 but after learning how to feather it of the line it would keep dropping in e.t.

with some tunning and better traction this car will run easy 12's. and this in a 3700 lbs car with driver.and it runs just fine on 87 octane.

i myself dont see what the big difference between the edelbrock name and the paw and summit and all the others who advertise this same cam.

the advertise duration numbers are just that.....the only way to campare the advertise numbers are if they are taken from the same height/rise......to many companys advertises this cam at .006 .008 .009 and so on to give different advertising numbers. but the .050 lift is the same.

to me your just paying for the name of edelbrock when you can get the ssi cam or summit cam for alower price.about 80 bucks for cam and lifters

the bottom line is this combo works very well in this set up. and i dont see why it would work in the 327 other then it will run higher up in the rpm range since your dealing with a small cubic motor.

but i dont mind running motors up to 6500 or 7000 rpms.

this is my opinion on the deal.....ive messed with to many idle to 5000 rpm type cams and was never happy .....they never seemed to put down the e.t. or mph like the bigger cammed motors do. i like to do set ups in the 3000 plus range.......

RatONaStick That 301A8LUN sounds more like what i'm looking for. Sounds like a good cam, longer power range too. Do you happen to know what the part # is (through summit) so I can look it up and see how much it costs? (if they offer it?)

ddeennis....sounds like you have a fun car there. :D thanks for the reply

pegleg
301A8LUN is the part number, i checked summits website and it didnt show that part number available. you may try to call them and ask or just get with UDHarold and get one from him.

Good Luck! graemlins/thumbsup.gif

Thanks a lot man. THAT sounds like the cam i'm looking for. I'll put up another post and ask UDHarold about it. Thanks again.....I really apprecaite the help.